The writers ignored the established 'rules' for the sake of convenience, which means they are poor writers.

But even Boba had more to him than Phasma did.

No one would accept that pitiful shortcut of a plot, but here you are saying that's just what we should do? I call shenanigans.

I do agree that the plot was rushed. in my opinion, I thought the part where the rathnars where chasing everyone should have been instead a sequence where they started to fill the gaps between Episode 6 and 7. I can believe Rey being able to use the Force the way she did in the movie. there's a theory that she can copy any manipulation of the Force once she sees it. The lightsaber duel though was a bit of a stretch for me. She does have experience in using a staff, but that is much different than a lightsaber. Maybe they'll give some explanation in later movies and/or books.

in the original theatrical release of Episode 5, Boba most certainly did NOT have more to him than Phasma. All you knew was that he was a bounty hunter that was hired by the Empire and that he was also working for Jabba. That's it. Phasma, you know she's a senior officer in the First Order. She has conviction, is ruthless and completely loyal to the First Order.

I'm not saying you should accept what's been shown in Episode 7, nor am I saying you should denounce what has happened. if you noticed in my post, I was stressing to wait for the other movies to come out before completely judging a plot that is clearly meant to span across 3 movies. Sure TFA has weaknesses, but every movie does. I'm hoping Disney learns from any shortcomings in Episode 7 to make the other 2 installments better.

Episode V boba had more context than Phasma. He captured Han Solo, he had his own ship, he interacted meaningfully with the main characters, Vader, and Jabba through name dropping, and dripped intrigue and awesomeness. Phasma spoke to Finn for 2 seconds, got captured randomly BY Solo, rolled quickly and was dropped down a garbage chute. She does nothing of importance and is completely disposable.

I'm sorry, what equitable comparison do you see?

Actually, it was Vader who captured Solo. so much for awesomeness; he couldn't even capture Han himself. you call name dropping interacting? Boba's name wasn't even mentioned in the movies until Episode 6. the "intrigue" he had was more curiosity. everyone wanted to know who was the man in the cool looking armor.

don't get me wrong, I think Boba is awesome; but only after ALOT of EU stuff came out to solidify who he was. I do agree that Phasma didn't really do much, but for her first movie appearance she had more impact in Episode 7 than Boba did in Episode 5.

If you want to be picky, it was probably Jim the stormtrooper who physically captured Han. However, Vader needed to HIRE boba to do the job...which he did. Tracked Han, led to his capture, took Han to Jabba WHILE escaping from Luke AND Leia/Chewie. Without Boba's involvement, Han gets to cloud city and disappears. He also goes to an imperial prison if ever captured, rather than Jabba. So Boba is the direct reason for the entire second half of TESB & the first half of ROTJ.

You are claiming that Phasma's betraying the New Order under duress to save her own life puts her on equal footing with "the best bounty hunter in the Galaxy" who was immediately the hottest thing since Luke Skywalker upon release of TESB? Right now, today, how many people give a hoot about Capt. Phasma?

14 is still a child, but that's older than I expected. I saw my first Star Wars film at 3, and then many more of the original Trilogy during the 80's on VHS many times growing up. I had probably seen Star Wars (OT) at least 3x each before I was 10. Most people who love Star Wars were introduced to it during childhood. It's magical and awesome and perfect for children to fall in love with, yet there is also something there for our adulthood to latch on to as well.

But it appears we may simply disagree and I won't spend too much time trying to convince you of my point of view. Suffice to say that I loved the new film and it has me excited for the next two. Though I do hope episode 8 borrows less specific things from the previous films. It can perhaps borrow some theme or feel, but I hope the rebels don't have a secret base and the first order sends a probe droid to find it, and Finn goes to investigate a meteor and gets nabbed by a native creature and Poe has to go and save him and build a shelter, meanwhile the First Order lands troops on the planet and comes in with large slow ground units.... while the resistance escapes and seeks out Lando. (Though to be fair I'd be more than happy to see Lando, I just was hoping to get him in the first film).

You are claiming that Phasma's betraying the New Order under duress to save her own life puts her on equal footing with "the best bounty hunter in the Galaxy" who was immediately the hottest thing since Luke Skywalker upon release of TESB? Right now, today, how many people give a hoot about Capt. Phasma?

I still like her a lot, though admittedly less after that scene. Still I love the actress and costume... I'm just confused as to the character. I'm withholding some judgment until the next episode. This is an opportunity for her to really grow now. She might be ashamed for what she's done and have to overcome that shame with a vengeance. Lots of potential here. She's gonna be really mad at Finn.

You are claiming that Phasma's betraying the New Order under duress to save her own life puts her on equal footing with "the best bounty hunter in the Galaxy" who was immediately the hottest thing since Luke Skywalker upon release of TESB? Right now, today, how many people give a hoot about Capt. Phasma?

I still like her a lot, though admittedly less after that scene. Still I love the actress and costume... I'm just confused as to the character. I'm withholding some judgment until the next episode. This is an opportunity for her to really grow now. She might be ashamed for what she's done and have to overcome that shame with a vengeance. Lots of potential here. She's gonna be really mad at Finn.

Disagreement is fine.

On this point though, do we have anything to indicate she didn't just die in a garbage compressor when the base went up?

You are claiming that Phasma's betraying the New Order under duress to save her own life puts her on equal footing with "the best bounty hunter in the Galaxy" who was immediately the hottest thing since Luke Skywalker upon release of TESB? Right now, today, how many people give a hoot about Capt. Phasma?

I still like her a lot, though admittedly less after that scene. Still I love the actress and costume... I'm just confused as to the character. I'm withholding some judgment until the next episode. This is an opportunity for her to really grow now. She might be ashamed for what she's done and have to overcome that shame with a vengeance. Lots of potential here. She's gonna be really mad at Finn.

Nothing solid. Only real world indications, one that she's a significant character, and people like her USUALLY manage to get away in time. Also she's in Episode 8 so there's that.

And her character is far from "worthless". She gets a simple introduction, but her armor is fantastic. She's basically a picture menu - "This looks awesome, I hope it tastes just as good next movie". And That works for me. Seems very similar to Boba Fett in Episode 5.

" Sure, your girlfriend might SAY she likes it but deep down she just wants an engagement ring. And maybe the crazy fandom is cute in some way. "

Lol thats funny.

I liked the movie.

To be honest i saw a new hope the first time when i was 6, and i saw phantom menace in the theaters when i was 9 ( i liked that one when it first came out too TBH, but that love has died a miserable death)

Ive been a huge fan of the star wars universe and have read most of the books. I was very disappointed when disney said they were getting rid of all of it. (some of it would have been fine, but now thrawn's gone and im sad) . That being said i was impressed by how much of the Expanded Universe they twisted to put in this movie. Ben is the name of Han's son rather than luke's, and while Han's son did turn to the dark side, he is obviously not Sith - rather just a dark Jedi. I originally thought that Ray may be Ben's sister and keep true to the han and leia have twins and eventually jaina kills jacen arc, but as the movie went on i got a stronger feeling that she was luke's daughter instead. (if thats the case i want to see mara jade even if its in a flash back!!!)

I was disappointed in the whole starkiller base thing. I think the movie would have been much more interesting if they fought for control of the station rather than trying to blow it up. also the whole first order screamed Nazi's to me. both with the color choices and the language used at he speech scene at star killer base looked like something out of an old war movie.

I was happy to see that there were no inept indigenous species around. I probably would have walked out of the theater if i had seen a gungan.

i was surprised to see how fast force powers were mastered, but i also picked up on the undisciplined/brute force approach that both Ray and Ben had.

I feel the space in this movie was inconsistant, moving from huge galaxy on jakku to a 20 second hyperspace ride from the Resistance base to starkiller base. (they also broke hyperspace, but at least han made it look cool)

all in all the movie was entertaining and worth seeing, and i will reserve judgement on the quality of the story until i see how much it all plays into episode VIII.

really what im looking forward to most is how much of a bad-ass Donnie Yen is in the Rogue 1 movie.

Oh, and did any one else see the spindly legged AT-AT walking out on the tundara of Starkiller Base?

that thing looked kick ass

I think Boba Fett made a bigger impact in episode 5 than Phasma did in episode 7.

Boba Fett: "Ooooo... who is that cool bad guy that just flew off with Han Solo?!"

Phasma: "Yawn."

Disagreement is fine.

On this point though, do we have anything to indicate she didn't just die in a garbage compressor when the base went up?

I read that Gwendolyn Christie (can't remember if that's the actress' name) said captain Phasma has a really good character arc over the progression of the trilogy.

let me first say I respect the things you have pointed out, but I must also point some things out as well.

1) there is plenty of presidence to show that the Force doesn't need to be taught in order to use specific abilities:

- Episode 1, Anakin had precognitive powers to be able to pilot his podracer at blinding speeds. Qui-Gon confirms this.

- Episode 1, Anakin being tested by the Jedi Council with the tablet.

- Episode 5, Luke Force pulling the lightsaber out of the ice.

- Episode 5, Leia knowing where to find Luke after his fight with Vader

- The original Force users. Each one learned how to manipulate the Force in their own way before the Jedi Order existed.

As for your next string of questions about why Snoke is bad, who were the people that died to the SKB laser, etc:

Yes, the plot was very generic in terms of it being about a big star base killing millions/billions of people that in turn is destroyed. however, I believe they used the destruction of both the Republics capital/fleet and Starkiller Base to signal that the next movies will be about Lightside vs Darkside. this is just speculation, but there are other things said in the movie that support/suggest this.

As to who Snoke is, I believe Yoda said it best, "Patience!" there's 2 more main story movies (Ep. 8 and 9), a side story movie (Rogue One), along with books and other goodies that will fill in the gaps. They aren't going to reveal who everyone is in the first movie.

I never really questioned Rey's ability to use the force. It isn't really a plot hole to me. Either she has a background that is not yet explained (which we know from the flashback when she touched the lightsaber), or she picked it up quickly. That never bothered me, and wouldn't really even if it was never explained. From her expression it looked to me that she knew what she was doing, which suggests to me that she was aware she could do it, so may have done before during the past that we don't know about yet. Of course, it being JJ, with the plot patience of a demented roadrunner on speed, it could be that she just pulled it out from nowhere.

I also didn't have a problem with Luke's dissaperance. During the Thrawn Trilogy he quite clearly doubts his own ability to be a teacher of others. He has accepted the position and responsibility of Jedi Knight, but he worries he doesn't have the knowledge and wisdom to teach the next generation, which is why he seeks out C'Boath. With the change in story he has taught a new generation of Jedi, but it went wrong, which I could see shattering his confidence and belief he is worthy and able to continue.

I would say that another thing that is a little irrittating is how poorly the film hangs on its own. A New Hope was originally envisioned as a stand alone film, and so works on its own, as does Return of the Jedi (Empire Strikes Back less, as it is a bridging film, and relies a lot on knowing who the relevant characters are). This film, however, very heavily sets things up for the future, rather than striving to be a complete experience on its own. It is fine leaving unresolved plot threads to continue, but so much of the characters and plot lines are just there for the future: Phasma, Snoke, meeting Luke (which should have been the focus of this film, not Death Star 3) etc.

Finn shouldn't have been able to defeat people with a lightsaber. I always thought you needed force ability and training to use one. He even held his own for a moment with Kylo Ren, even scoring a hit. - Explanation - as a stormtrooper he likely had plenty of martial training including various hand to hand classes etc. Also we DO see Han cut open a Tauntaun, so it's not a huge stretch to say Finn could swing it. And I guess Finn didn't do THAT good, as another stormtrooper kicked his butt, and Kylo Ren was weak and bleeding by the time they fought. So while this is a nitpick, it's kinda understandable, it just clashes with what many of us thought about lightsaber training.

Rey used the force too quickly - This is the most common nitpick. Both her mind trick, and the whole part at the end where she closes her eyes and uses the force to become a badass with a lightsaber.... was too rushed. Explanation - we have seen some examples of people who were a very quick study, like Luke in A New Hope, or Anakin in Episode 1 doing some things with no training at all. This could mean that she is a skywalker, or it could mean the force is acting different now and "Waking up" in the absence of a Jedi order. Even if this part is contrived it doesn't ruin the movie for me, it just leaves unanswered questions that someone will probably write a book about some day.

Starkiller Base is a Super Death Star? - I was disapointed by this, I'll admit. Felt so unoriginal. The other bad guys seemed fine. Borrow from the feel of the original trilogy all you want, but everything about Starkiller Base was TOO borrowed. Han on the ground disabling the shield, them needing a "Miracle" to blow it at the last second... It was just TOO borrowed. Explanation - I don't have much here - other than they wanted it to "feel" very Star Wars-ish and this felt safe. I get that. It's a way to introduce young kids to the series and have them get the FEEL of what Star Wars has been all about for years. As much as I wish they'd done something else, I can't say that this ruined the movie or anything. It's ok for the film to have some imperfections. Now I hope the next movie has some FLEET vs FLEET action - large ships etc. (or at least one of the films). I'm anxious to see some capital ships in this new universe!

I got the impression that Finn is meant to be Force Sensitive. Also, I am not so convinced of the "you have to be a force user to wield one", just you have to have the precognitive abilities and enhanced reflexes of a Jedi to make it worth over just shooting someone with a blaster. Of course having the silly stormtrooper with the lightning thing kind of undermined that... but then JJ so likes undermining sensible world building.

As I said previously, Rey's ability to use the force so quickly doesn't bother me. It doesn't even fall into plot hole as far as I am concerned. Either it will be explained, or it is simply as it is... it doesn't bother me as much as lazy unoriginal story writing and nonsensical events.

Well, JJ isn't writing the next one, so hopefully the new writer will be willing to develop things more and deal with the flaws that he can, ignoring those he can't. However, if it is heavily driven by JJ expect to see Empire Strikes Back all over again.

The writers ignored the established 'rules' for the sake of convenience, which means they are poor writers.

But even Boba had more to him than Phasma did.

No one would accept that pitiful shortcut of a plot, but here you are saying that's just what we should do? I call shenanigans.

I do agree that the plot was rushed. in my opinion, I thought the part where the rathnars where chasing everyone should have been instead a sequence where they started to fill the gaps between Episode 6 and 7. I can believe Rey being able to use the Force the way she did in the movie. there's a theory that she can copy any manipulation of the Force once she sees it. The lightsaber duel though was a bit of a stretch for me. She does have experience in using a staff, but that is much different than a lightsaber. Maybe they'll give some explanation in later movies and/or books.

If JJ has the choice between a quieter scene with important character development or a scene where we can have people unecessarily chased around by a gient monster, he will always choose the latter, because stopping to talk would be boring. Even if it wouldn't be in the correct hands and in fact when done well aids the pacing, rather than spoiling it. But that maybe says something about his ability or confidence as a film maker.

How old were you the first time you saw a Star Wars film?

I was about 6 or 7, but my dad was in his early 20s... but then he only say Return of the Jedi in his mid 30s, and felt that Darth Vader turning good spoiled the films, so...

I really do believe that Supreme Leader Snoke is none other than Darth Plageius. During the first conversation between him and Kylo, the music titled Tragedy of Darth Plageius played from Episode 3.

I really do believe that Supreme Leader Snoke is none other than Darth Plageius. During the first conversation between him and Kylo, the music titled Tragedy of Darth Plageius played from Episode 3.

Two possilities if that is true. 1.) Palpatine lied or was mistaken that he actually killed Plagus which severely weakens Palpatine's character (left a powerful competitor alive or couldn't even kill him) 2.) Palpatine killed him but he was able to return from the dead which severely weakens the morality of the force, namely Lucas's premise that only Jedi could return from death due to their 'selfless' focus, whereas sith would fade into nothingness.

Either one is a poor choice IMO.

I really do believe that Supreme Leader Snoke is none other than Darth Plageius. During the first conversation between him and Kylo, the music titled Tragedy of Darth Plageius played from Episode 3.

Two possilities if that is true. 1.) Palpatine lied or was mistaken that he actually killed Plagus which severely weakens Palpatine's character (left a powerful competitor alive or couldn't even kill him) 2.) Palpatine killed him but he was able to return from the dead which severely weakens the morality of the force, namely Lucas's premise that only Jedi could return from death due to their 'selfless' focus, whereas sith would fade into nothingness.

Either one is a poor choice IMO.

Its a bastard of both. Palpatine killed his body, but plagis had rendered himself down to a midiclorian soup by that point, and went body hopping as an infection. He was supposed to have finally been killed, I think, in a cave where there was nobody around to jump to.

I dont know about were you live guys but 14 years old isnt considered a child around here. Its considered an adolescent here (half way to adulthood - in just 4 years they will have full adult dutys and rights).

Also George Lucas said in a recent interview to Charlie Rose in Hulu that was the age he was aiming for when he made Episode IV because there wasnt anything "sci-fi"ish at the time. He was very surprised that both many adults and younger ones loved the movie. I saw it when I had 6 years old.