1. People are just speculating based of previously abused arcs ala Hollywood.

2. The prequels are very much appreciated by many fans.

3. Please, tone down the douchery. People here engage in cordial conversation with others that enjoy the same.

1: don't encourage them!

2:they shall burn.

3: how then do you propose the vaginas get cleaned?

So there was a mention that Luke was standing over a grave at the end scene. Thoughts on this?

I am of the opinion that its is a grave marker. of whom? I have hopes and suspicions; but until more is revealed, I will be anxiously waiting.

however, we all have to consider that it could be nothing.

Calling you out for being rude is not "discrimination." We are not using racial slurs, religion, gender, or any other general characteristic to demean you. We are calling you, individually, rude because of your choice to insult anyone who disagrees with you on a personal level.

Amazing how that looks perfectly normal. If you don't want to hear about the Skywalkers anymore, that's your opinion. However,1) it's not incestuous and 2) why are you watching Star Wars seeing as every single movie has been about the Skywalkers?

1: you are not accepting my condition wich makes me act like an asshat on the internet, you intollerant ass.

2: the family isn't incestuous the convoluted backstories you all crave are wich is what I was alluding to but you are one of those literal minded fuckers like the EU writers who wrote it so tarkin actually has a condition that makes him smell bad instead of it being a random insult by leia.

Okay, finally saw it. I'd give it a 6, maybe 7 out of 10, which is about as high as the movie could probably rate, given the constraints (public, financial, etc) it was made under.

Some thoughts...

First, as some said, *FAR* too much a rehash... it almost bordered on reboot (which I understand it sort of is.) But star-gazing kid on desert planet zips away on Falcon and begins to learn the force, hotshot pilot attacks death star and has to hit that ONE spot while good guys walk around inside Death Star, turning the corner every time Stormtroopers walk by... etc etc... even the Cantina nod was too much. Unless we get a "the Force is out of alignment and history will repeat itself until it is aligned" I thought it was too much.

Ford was rather wooden. A few of the lines hit home, but he was missing something. Also, needed the hair to be cut a bit shorter. Glad they killed him off, as he was holding back the new generation.

Poe and Finn seemed to get buddy-buddy FAR too quickly for my tastes. I liked Poe's line about Ren being hard to understand, but it felt a tiny bit forced. Speaking of which...

... a lot of the humor felt forced. The first movie DEFINITELY has humor, but... I don't know. Some parts worked (I enjoyed the chemistry between Boyega and Ridley) but a lot didn't.

I didn't quite get why the Republic was so thrown together, as someone mentioned. I mean... isn't that the GOVERNMENT? Why does the First Order come off as the military might, and the Resistance (what exactly are they resisting again?) as a Rebel force? It would have worked a LOT better if the bad guys had been the smaller force that moves and fights without having to answer to a political force and without any rules, and THAT'S why the bad guys are winning... jumping into systems, destroying things, jumping out before the lumbering government could respond...

I enjoyed John Boyega, and Daisy Ridley was perfection. She is REALLY easy on the eyes... love that she has a bit of muscle and an untraditionally-strong neck and all that... just a beautiful girl, and she pulled the role off well.

I liked that so many characters were held back (Luke, Lando, R2). Leaves something for later.

Hate that Adam Driver (in terms of acting) felt weak. Not "flawed guy" weak... I just didn't buy him, and I love the guy. He needed a bit more of the quirk that he traditionally brings, but quirk turned evil. He felt like a petulant kid, and that isn't a positive. And WTF was with that mane of hair being all penned up under that helmet? Ugh.

What was with the force natured of the map? Wait... WHO made it? Why would Luke leave a map behind, but with a part missing? How did that guy in the first scene get it? FAR too contrived and unnatural... like "Quick, we need a plot! I know... a map!" Come on.

The Han death scene was FAR too set up. On the bridge, everyone important there watching but magically no bad guys until Han dies, and THEN tons of bad guys for the good guys to shoot? Felt stupid; it IS possible to do a scene like that while also still respecting the established realism of the film.

Agreed with the person who said last page; where DID that light saber come from? And don't give me the "Oh, it's a long story I'll tell you later" ********.

Wish that the fighting style of Stormtroopers had been updated; they still seem to use the combat doctrine of "RUN FORWARD AND SHOOT WILDLY UNTIL YOU DIE!" Seeming them moving like modern soldiers might make them even scarier and more effective.

What the heck was that weapon that that stormtrooper was using to fight a guy with a lightsaber? Saber should have sliced right through it in one go. And why were they shooting at x-wings with their little hand weapons? That felt dumb.

Captain Phasma was TOTALLY unused. I assume she is coming back.

I did enjoy that there was a split in power in the First Order... infighting is a positive, as it adds depth to the story and characters.

WTF, only X-Wings and TIEs? Why no TIE Bombers in the attack on the planet? Why no third-gen B-Wings or A-Wings in the attack on Death Star Pt 3? Hated that. Maybe needed to save some toys for the next movie?

Enjoyed the shot of Luke at the end... he has aged in a way that works.

Loved the little reuse of certain sound effects, like that Death Star robot beep:)

the Jacen/Jaina storyline is no longer canon, but the theory could still be used... I mean, we are halfway there. But it certainly does seem that she will be Luke's daughter. But speaking of old canon... please, FFS, bring Thrawn in. He was always a lot of fun:)

There better be a LOT more emotional fallout from Han's death, particularly with Leia and Chewie. Like... I want an entire film where those two are basically walking wrecks. It is okay if they get over it EVENTUALLY, but they should be appropriately devastated for a long, long time.

Favorite part? That Kylo Ren's name is Ben. That feels organic.

So yeah... it was fine. Not amazing. But fine. I'll see the next one.

Btw, I need some responses... Need to process my thoughts a bit with like minded people:)

Okay, finally saw it. I'd give it a 6, maybe 7 out of 10, which is about as high as the movie could probably rate, given the constraints (public, financial, etc) it was made under.

Some thoughts...

First, as some said, *FAR* too much a rehash... it almost bordered on reboot (which I understand it sort of is.) But star-gazing kid on desert planet zips away on Falcon and begins to learn the force, hotshot pilot attacks death star and has to hit that ONE spot while good guys walk around inside Death Star, turning the corner every time Stormtroopers walk by... etc etc... even the Cantina nod was too much. Unless we get a "the Force is out of alignment and history will repeat itself until it is aligned" I thought it was too much.

Ford was rather wooden. A few of the lines hit home, but he was missing something. Also, needed the hair to be cut a bit shorter. Glad they killed him off, as he was holding back the new generation.

Poe and Finn seemed to get buddy-buddy FAR too quickly for my tastes. I liked Poe's line about Ren being hard to understand, but it felt a tiny bit forced. Speaking of which...

... a lot of the humor felt forced. The first movie DEFINITELY has humor, but... I don't know. Some parts worked (I enjoyed the chemistry between Boyega and Ridley) but a lot didn't.

I didn't quite get why the Republic was so thrown together, as someone mentioned. I mean... isn't that the GOVERNMENT? Why does the First Order come off as the military might, and the Resistance (what exactly are they resisting again?) as a Rebel force? It would have worked a LOT better if the bad guys had been the smaller force that moves and fights without having to answer to a political force and without any rules, and THAT'S why the bad guys are winning... jumping into systems, destroying things, jumping out before the lumbering government could respond...

I enjoyed John Boyega, and Daisy Ridley was perfection. She is REALLY easy on the eyes... love that she has a bit of muscle and an untraditionally-strong neck and all that... just a beautiful girl, and she pulled the role off well.

I liked that so many characters were held back (Luke, Lando, R2). Leaves something for later.

Hate that Adam Driver (in terms of acting) felt weak. Not "flawed guy" weak... I just didn't buy him, and I love the guy. He needed a bit more of the quirk that he traditionally brings, but quirk turned evil. He felt like a petulant kid, and that isn't a positive. And WTF was with that mane of hair being all penned up under that helmet? Ugh.

What was with the force natured of the map? Wait... WHO made it? Why would Luke leave a map behind, but with a part missing? How did that guy in the first scene get it? FAR too contrived and unnatural... like "Quick, we need a plot! I know... a map!" Come on.

The Han death scene was FAR too set up. On the bridge, everyone important there watching but magically no bad guys until Han dies, and THEN tons of bad guys for the good guys to shoot? Felt stupid; it IS possible to do a scene like that while also still respecting the established realism of the film.

Agreed with the person who said last page; where DID that light saber come from? And don't give me the "Oh, it's a long story I'll tell you later" ********.

Wish that the fighting style of Stormtroopers had been updated; they still seem to use the combat doctrine of "RUN FORWARD AND SHOOT WILDLY UNTIL YOU DIE!" Seeming them moving like modern soldiers might make them even scarier and more effective.

What the heck was that weapon that that stormtrooper was using to fight a guy with a lightsaber? Saber should have sliced right through it in one go. And why were they shooting at x-wings with their little hand weapons? That felt dumb.

Captain Phasma was TOTALLY unused. I assume she is coming back.

I did enjoy that there was a split in power in the First Order... infighting is a positive, as it adds depth to the story and characters.

WTF, only X-Wings and TIEs? Why no TIE Bombers in the attack on the planet? Why no third-gen B-Wings or A-Wings in the attack on Death Star Pt 3? Hated that. Maybe needed to save some toys for the next movie?

Enjoyed the shot of Luke at the end... he has aged in a way that works.

Loved the little reuse of certain sound effects, like that Death Star robot beep:)

the Jacen/Jaina storyline is no longer canon, but the theory could still be used... I mean, we are halfway there. But it certainly does seem that she will be Luke's daughter. But speaking of old canon... please, FFS, bring Thrawn in. He was always a lot of fun:)

There better be a LOT more emotional fallout from Han's death, particularly with Leia and Chewie. Like... I want an entire film where those two are basically walking wrecks. It is okay if they get over it EVENTUALLY, but they should be appropriately devastated for a long, long time.

Favorite part? That Kylo Ren's name is Ben. That feels organic.

So yeah... it was fine. Not amazing. But fine. I'll see the next one.

good points, new generation could definetly stand on their own, they should have made it a bit clearer that the resistance is basically a fringe group of people fighting the remnnt outside of the official new republic goverment. would have loved some other fighters too.

didn't think too hard about the poe/ finn buddying up because poe was being tortured and probably wanted to get out of there so what ws he gonna do? piss off the only guy offering him a way out? plus he figured out pretty quick that finn only really needed him because he needed a pilot to get away. poe overall comes across as cocky but good so yeah the line about the mask may have been a bit forced but I think he may be using forced humor like that in character to hide his fear.

mark hamil did really get into shape for this role, if you compare his pictures now and a year or two ago.

Okay, finally saw it. I'd give it a 6, maybe 7 out of 10, which is about as high as the movie could probably rate, given the constraints (public, financial, etc) it was made under.

Some thoughts...

First, as some said, *FAR* too much a rehash... it almost bordered on reboot (which I understand it sort of is.) But star-gazing kid on desert planet zips away on Falcon and begins to learn the force, hotshot pilot attacks death star and has to hit that ONE spot while good guys walk around inside Death Star, turning the corner every time Stormtroopers walk by... etc etc... even the Cantina nod was too much. Unless we get a "the Force is out of alignment and history will repeat itself until it is aligned" I thought it was too much.

Ford was rather wooden. A few of the lines hit home, but he was missing something. Also, needed the hair to be cut a bit shorter. Glad they killed him off, as he was holding back the new generation.

Poe and Finn seemed to get buddy-buddy FAR too quickly for my tastes. I liked Poe's line about Ren being hard to understand, but it felt a tiny bit forced. Speaking of which...

... a lot of the humor felt forced. The first movie DEFINITELY has humor, but... I don't know. Some parts worked (I enjoyed the chemistry between Boyega and Ridley) but a lot didn't.

I didn't quite get why the Republic was so thrown together, as someone mentioned. I mean... isn't that the GOVERNMENT? Why does the First Order come off as the military might, and the Resistance (what exactly are they resisting again?) as a Rebel force? It would have worked a LOT better if the bad guys had been the smaller force that moves and fights without having to answer to a political force and without any rules, and THAT'S why the bad guys are winning... jumping into systems, destroying things, jumping out before the lumbering government could respond...

I enjoyed John Boyega, and Daisy Ridley was perfection. She is REALLY easy on the eyes... love that she has a bit of muscle and an untraditionally-strong neck and all that... just a beautiful girl, and she pulled the role off well.

I liked that so many characters were held back (Luke, Lando, R2). Leaves something for later.

Hate that Adam Driver (in terms of acting) felt weak. Not "flawed guy" weak... I just didn't buy him, and I love the guy. He needed a bit more of the quirk that he traditionally brings, but quirk turned evil. He felt like a petulant kid, and that isn't a positive. And WTF was with that mane of hair being all penned up under that helmet? Ugh.

What was with the force natured of the map? Wait... WHO made it? Why would Luke leave a map behind, but with a part missing? How did that guy in the first scene get it? FAR too contrived and unnatural... like "Quick, we need a plot! I know... a map!" Come on.

The Han death scene was FAR too set up. On the bridge, everyone important there watching but magically no bad guys until Han dies, and THEN tons of bad guys for the good guys to shoot? Felt stupid; it IS possible to do a scene like that while also still respecting the established realism of the film.

Agreed with the person who said last page; where DID that light saber come from? And don't give me the "Oh, it's a long story I'll tell you later" ********.

Wish that the fighting style of Stormtroopers had been updated; they still seem to use the combat doctrine of "RUN FORWARD AND SHOOT WILDLY UNTIL YOU DIE!" Seeming them moving like modern soldiers might make them even scarier and more effective.

What the heck was that weapon that that stormtrooper was using to fight a guy with a lightsaber? Saber should have sliced right through it in one go. And why were they shooting at x-wings with their little hand weapons? That felt dumb.

Captain Phasma was TOTALLY unused. I assume she is coming back.

I did enjoy that there was a split in power in the First Order... infighting is a positive, as it adds depth to the story and characters.

WTF, only X-Wings and TIEs? Why no TIE Bombers in the attack on the planet? Why no third-gen B-Wings or A-Wings in the attack on Death Star Pt 3? Hated that. Maybe needed to save some toys for the next movie?

Enjoyed the shot of Luke at the end... he has aged in a way that works.

Loved the little reuse of certain sound effects, like that Death Star robot beep:)

the Jacen/Jaina storyline is no longer canon, but the theory could still be used... I mean, we are halfway there. But it certainly does seem that she will be Luke's daughter. But speaking of old canon... please, FFS, bring Thrawn in. He was always a lot of fun:)

There better be a LOT more emotional fallout from Han's death, particularly with Leia and Chewie. Like... I want an entire film where those two are basically walking wrecks. It is okay if they get over it EVENTUALLY, but they should be appropriately devastated for a long, long time.

Favorite part? That Kylo Ren's name is Ben. That feels organic.

So yeah... it was fine. Not amazing. But fine. I'll see the next one.

good points, new generation could definetly stand on their own, they should have made it a bit clearer that the resistance is basically a fringe group of people fighting the remnnt outside of the official new republic goverment. would have loved some other fighters too.

didn't think too hard about the poe/ finn buddying up because poe was being tortured and probably wanted to get out of there so what ws he gonna do? piss off the only guy offering him a way out? plus he figured out pretty quick that finn only really needed him because he needed a pilot to get away. poe overall comes across as cocky but good so yeah the line about the mask may have been a bit forced but I think he may be using forced humor like that in character to hide his fear.

mark hamil did really get into shape for this role, if you compare his pictures now and a year or two ago.

Funny, I thought Hamill looked awfully large in that shot. I think he looks slimmer in the stuff outside of the movie now. I'm hopeful that means he's leaning out for the next film.

I absolutely believe that I was the most critical out of all of my friends about this movie. I think it was a 7/10... but for the same reasons as above; Felt rushed, under-explained, Han's death could be seen from a mile away (friggin women always getting men in trouble), the underwhelming soundtrack (actually I was shocked at this more than anything), the lack of creativity of the plot and it's drivers. Kylo is about the same level of whiney ***** as Hayden Christensen was in the prequels. He's like a kid who didn't get enough hugs at best. The force stopping blaster fire...don't get me started on that. Vader didn't do it, fully trained Jedi didn't do it... why did they do that? So stupid.

Things I liked? The cast was well done. Every one was just good at their roles... maybe except Adam Driver...but that could just be the way they wrote the character. The flight scenes were good enough to get me a hair queasy. I normally don't. The lightsaber fighting looked legit as just untrained fighters can be. Nice to see a return to that style. The lack of obvious CGI was excellent. I mean other than Snoke and the sun sucking, it was nearly unintelligible between CGI and practical effects.

I really expected JJ to stand on it. I HATE what he did with Trek. But he really did well with what he had. It's watchable, it's entertaining, but it's clearly a reboot or written by people who lack creativity or the desire to stray from the tested format.

I still think the idea of the Resistance apparently having no capships at all was insane. I never really expected them to have the heavy warships in the first film but at least a few corvettes or frigates. Hell even the rebel network in Rebels has that much as well as at least one of the canon resistance cells a decade pre-Rebels.

And the Resistance only having X-Wings is IMO sheer laziness on the part of the designers. You can't seriously tell me that with the budget they had they couldn't afford to include updated A-Wings, B-Wings, or a new fighter design for the Resistance to use along with the X-Wings. And IMO a Resistance movement like this being able to achieve that kind of uniformity in its fighter inventory makes no sense.

I saw the movie,

It was good.

I saw this thread

It is good.

I really can't agree that Adam Driver is Hayden Christensen 2.0. Never did I feel that Kylo Ren's dialogue was grating or embarrassing... the character is petulant, impatient, and unsure but NEVER was he face-palming to listen to. Especially in II, Anakin felt more creepy rather than conflicted, and it was painful to listen to.

I mean, when it comes to depicting a force-using youth conflicted between the dark side and the light side I think Driver does a much better job than Christensen. Anakin felt like a whiner, but for Kylo I can understand his impatience and his, well, drive.

I really can't agree that Adam Driver is Hayden Christensen 2.0. Never did I feel that Kylo Ren's dialogue was grating or embarrassing... the character is petulant, impatient, and unsure but NEVER was he face-palming to listen to. Especially in II, Anakin felt more creepy rather than conflicted, and it was painful to listen to.

I mean, when it comes to depicting a force-using youth conflicted between the dark side and the light side I think Driver does a much better job than Christensen. Anakin felt like a whiner, but for Kylo I can understand his impatience and his, well, drive.

I didn't see any similarity to their characters until I heard it mentioned by others. Even then it feels like a stretch. I think that Ren was closer to what Anakin was supposed to seem like - but I don't think that it was done to intentionally be a parallel.

There are not a huge variety of ways to portray a young character with conflicting moral pulls.

I'm right there with you.

Okay, finally saw it. I'd give it a 6, maybe 7 out of 10, which is about as high as the movie could probably rate, given the constraints (public, financial, etc) it was made under.

Some thoughts...

First, as some said, *FAR* too much a rehash... it almost bordered on reboot (which I understand it sort of is.) But star-gazing kid on desert planet zips away on Falcon and begins to learn the force, hotshot pilot attacks death star and has to hit that ONE spot while good guys walk around inside Death Star, turning the corner every time Stormtroopers walk by... etc etc... even the Cantina nod was too much. Unless we get a "the Force is out of alignment and history will repeat itself until it is aligned" I thought it was too much.

Ford was rather wooden. A few of the lines hit home, but he was missing something. Also, needed the hair to be cut a bit shorter. Glad they killed him off, as he was holding back the new generation.

Poe and Finn seemed to get buddy-buddy FAR too quickly for my tastes. I liked Poe's line about Ren being hard to understand, but it felt a tiny bit forced. Speaking of which...

... a lot of the humor felt forced. The first movie DEFINITELY has humor, but... I don't know. Some parts worked (I enjoyed the chemistry between Boyega and Ridley) but a lot didn't.

I didn't quite get why the Republic was so thrown together, as someone mentioned. I mean... isn't that the GOVERNMENT? Why does the First Order come off as the military might, and the Resistance (what exactly are they resisting again?) as a Rebel force? It would have worked a LOT better if the bad guys had been the smaller force that moves and fights without having to answer to a political force and without any rules, and THAT'S why the bad guys are winning... jumping into systems, destroying things, jumping out before the lumbering government could respond...

I enjoyed John Boyega, and Daisy Ridley was perfection. She is REALLY easy on the eyes... love that she has a bit of muscle and an untraditionally-strong neck and all that... just a beautiful girl, and she pulled the role off well.

I liked that so many characters were held back (Luke, Lando, R2). Leaves something for later.

Hate that Adam Driver (in terms of acting) felt weak. Not "flawed guy" weak... I just didn't buy him, and I love the guy. He needed a bit more of the quirk that he traditionally brings, but quirk turned evil. He felt like a petulant kid, and that isn't a positive. And WTF was with that mane of hair being all penned up under that helmet? Ugh.

What was with the force natured of the map? Wait... WHO made it? Why would Luke leave a map behind, but with a part missing? How did that guy in the first scene get it? FAR too contrived and unnatural... like "Quick, we need a plot! I know... a map!" Come on.

The Han death scene was FAR too set up. On the bridge, everyone important there watching but magically no bad guys until Han dies, and THEN tons of bad guys for the good guys to shoot? Felt stupid; it IS possible to do a scene like that while also still respecting the established realism of the film.

Agreed with the person who said last page; where DID that light saber come from? And don't give me the "Oh, it's a long story I'll tell you later" ********.

Wish that the fighting style of Stormtroopers had been updated; they still seem to use the combat doctrine of "RUN FORWARD AND SHOOT WILDLY UNTIL YOU DIE!" Seeming them moving like modern soldiers might make them even scarier and more effective.

What the heck was that weapon that that stormtrooper was using to fight a guy with a lightsaber? Saber should have sliced right through it in one go. And why were they shooting at x-wings with their little hand weapons? That felt dumb.

Captain Phasma was TOTALLY unused. I assume she is coming back.

I did enjoy that there was a split in power in the First Order... infighting is a positive, as it adds depth to the story and characters.

WTF, only X-Wings and TIEs? Why no TIE Bombers in the attack on the planet? Why no third-gen B-Wings or A-Wings in the attack on Death Star Pt 3? Hated that. Maybe needed to save some toys for the next movie?

Enjoyed the shot of Luke at the end... he has aged in a way that works.

Loved the little reuse of certain sound effects, like that Death Star robot beep:)

the Jacen/Jaina storyline is no longer canon, but the theory could still be used... I mean, we are halfway there. But it certainly does seem that she will be Luke's daughter. But speaking of old canon... please, FFS, bring Thrawn in. He was always a lot of fun:)

There better be a LOT more emotional fallout from Han's death, particularly with Leia and Chewie. Like... I want an entire film where those two are basically walking wrecks. It is okay if they get over it EVENTUALLY, but they should be appropriately devastated for a long, long time.

Favorite part? That Kylo Ren's name is Ben. That feels organic.

So yeah... it was fine. Not amazing. But fine. I'll see the next one.

After reading aftermath is talk about mon mothma wanting to demilitarize the republic so imperial systen will not feeled they have to join. She see the war as the same war since the separatiz war in attack of the clones.

Those the republic makes a cease fire peace treaty with the empire rements. The republic mothballs most of the fleets and give each system a small defense fleet.

However some like han leia ackbar and others keep on fighting against the empire and thus the 1st order. So why no captial ships the resistance cant afford them and the Republic small navy was taken out aka pearly harbor with the system being deathstar part 3

I really can't agree that Adam Driver is Hayden Christensen 2.0. Never did I feel that Kylo Ren's dialogue was grating or embarrassing... the character is petulant, impatient, and unsure but NEVER was he face-palming to listen to. Especially in II, Anakin felt more creepy rather than conflicted, and it was painful to listen to.

I mean, when it comes to depicting a force-using youth conflicted between the dark side and the light side I think Driver does a much better job than Christensen. Anakin felt like a whiner, but for Kylo I can understand his impatience and his, well, drive.

Agreed

Like if we go down the list

Anakin/Vader

-----------------------

- Whining and angst was coming from mainly that people weren't recognizing how great he felt he was.

- Angst also coming from he couldn't be both a Jedi Knight and Padme's lover.

- Even as Vader, the guy was incredibly selfish. All he thought about was himself and his power and his revenge and how everyone else fit into that.

- Cared little for other peoples lives. Wiped out a village of sandpeople because some jerk sand people killed his mother. Killed all the Jedi on the vague promise of immortality from Sidious. Not to mention killing officers that failed him even if their failure wasn't their fault, or risking the imperial fleet in an asteroid field just to get at Luke's friends.

Ben/Kylo Ren

----------------------

- Whining and angst is coming more from his fear that he won't live up to his and Snoke's expectations.

- Arguably he's incredibly selfless, willing to kill his own father and others because he thinks and orderly galaxy is the best galaxy. Believes Darth Vader's main failing was his selfish act to save his son Luke.

- Won't kill underlings for simply failing him. He'll take out his anger on an inanimate object instead.

Really Anakin is sort of that evil jock from High School that wanted everyone to bow down to him and managed to get the girl. Ben is more of the crazed overachiever that is so hell bent on improving himself and the world around him he doesn't even realize he has become the villain.

I still think the idea of the Resistance apparently having no capships at all was insane. I never really expected them to have the heavy warships in the first film but at least a few corvettes or frigates. Hell even the rebel network in Rebels has that much as well as at least one of the canon resistance cells a decade pre-Rebels.

And the Resistance only having X-Wings is IMO sheer laziness on the part of the designers. You can't seriously tell me that with the budget they had they couldn't afford to include updated A-Wings, B-Wings, or a new fighter design for the Resistance to use along with the X-Wings. And IMO a Resistance movement like this being able to achieve that kind of uniformity in its fighter inventory makes no sense.

Yes OK, so I have a few questions now in regards to canon and in particular, what is mentioned in Aftermath.

I haven't read it myself, but can someone briefly sum up the timeline following the Battle of Endor into what is now in Force Awakens?

Where is the New Republic? Were they wiped out when the Starkiller base hit those planets? I don't know the targets actually were, were they militarily significant? From the movie, it looked like random cities to instill terror and nothing more. If the target was the New Republic government, then is Mon Mothma dead?

Where are all of the New Republic capital ships? Why would they demilitarize following the Battle of Endor and when the remnants of the Empire are clearly still causing trouble? And lastly, why is Leia with the "Resistance" and not fighting for the New Republic?

Yes OK, so I have a few questions now in regards to canon and in particular, what is mentioned in Aftermath.

I haven't read it myself, but can someone briefly sum up the timeline following the Battle of Endor into what is now in Force Awakens?

Where is the New Republic? Were they wiped out when the Starkiller base hit those planets? I don't know the targets actually were, were they militarily significant? From the movie, it looked like random cities to instill terror and nothing more. If the target was the New Republic government, then is Mon Mothma dead?

Where are all of the New Republic capital ships? Why would they demilitarize following the Battle of Endor and when the remnants of the Empire are clearly still causing trouble? And lastly, why is Leia with the "Resistance" and not fighting for the New Republic?

I've been going through the Force Awakens novelization, and based on it to answer those questions (not done yet though)

Rules over most of the galaxy and seems to be as ineffective as the one in the prequel trilogy. They had a small fleet based in the system that was destroyed. However in order to prevent another military dicatorship, the republic military is divided into it's member worlds. So Mon Calamari have a small fleet, Corellia has a small fleet, ect. The Alpha Strike the New Order did only destroyed the government and will hinder the Republic from coordinating their spread out fleet and launching an immediate counter attack.

It's also implied there are other imperial factions and the New Order has only recently arrived at the scene.

The Resistance is fighting all Imperial Factions and is just die hards wanting to eliminate any trace of the old empire from existence as well as just people still stuck under Imperial rule. The Republic has more or less said "I got mine" and don't want to push onto those worlds.

Was I the only one that was egregiously aggravated by Rey's force use? It's established she hardly know what a jedi is, but then somehow pulls off a ******* JEDI MIND TRICK. NO ONE WOULD EVER JUST ASSUME THEY CAN DO THAT. And the terms of the trick have to be believable to the individual. "these are not the droids you are looking for" is fine because that poor stormtrooper has probably been checking robots all day and just wants to go home. "You will disobey every direct order you have been given for no believable internal reasoning and let a dangerous prisoner go" is ridiculous. Even her force grabbing the lightsaber is garbage. Luke trained for a long time just to float ****, and all that just gets glazed over; As i stated before, Rey still has no ******* idea what a jedi is.

Don't get me started on the lightsaber battles. Finn vs electro-tonfa stormtrooper was cheesy, but Rey and Ren was just as much a joke. Once again, no-training-Rey "overcomes" an obstacle because "good guys." Ren would have wiped the floor simply due to ANY amount of training and experience with a lightsaber. Her only experience is carrying around a giant, useless, metal rod. That's cool /sarcasm. IT DOESN'T EVEN ******* SHOCK PEOPLE; IT'S LITERALLY A GIANT METAL ROD.

Speaking of Kylo Ren, he was essentially that one guy from Grandma's Boy. You all know who I mean.

I'm getting worked up thinking about it again. TFA wasn't bad, but it was hardly good.

ANYWAY, back to armada! something I enjoy!

I hope we get some sort of Larger Star Destroyer with 6 hull zones. As for the rebel fleet, maybe the Liberty class but I'm drawing blanks for any other possibility.

Was I the only one that was egregiously aggravated by Rey's force use? It's established she hardly know what a jedi is, but then somehow pulls off a ******* JEDI MIND TRICK. NO ONE WOULD EVER JUST ASSUME THEY CAN DO THAT. And the terms of the trick have to be believable to the individual. "these are not the droids you are looking for" is fine because that poor stormtrooper has probably been checking robots all day and just wants to go home. "You will disobey every direct order you have been given for no believable internal reasoning and let a dangerous prisoner go" is ridiculous. Even her force grabbing the lightsaber is garbage. Luke trained for a long time just to float ****, and all that just gets glazed over; As i stated before, Rey still has no ******* idea what a jedi is.

His theory is this:

Rey is so in tune with the Force (due to her parentage or some phenomena), that she just naturally knows how to manipulate the Force without really knowing what she is doing. Once she sees something done, her natural ability essentially cracks the code. My brother pointed out to me that she didn't start to use Force powers until they were used on her. When Kylo Ren put her to sleep, that was a form of compulsion. She learned from the experience and used it to mind trick the trooper.

Then she Force pulled the lightsaber to her after Ren Force pushed her into a tree (matter manipulation).

I know it maybe a stretch, but the ability to mimic Force powers could be some sort of natural gift Rey has.

Was I the only one that was egregiously aggravated by Rey's force use? It's established she hardly know what a jedi is, but then somehow pulls off a ******* JEDI MIND TRICK. NO ONE WOULD EVER JUST ASSUME THEY CAN DO THAT. And the terms of the trick have to be believable to the individual. "these are not the droids you are looking for" is fine because that poor stormtrooper has probably been checking robots all day and just wants to go home. "You will disobey every direct order you have been given for no believable internal reasoning and let a dangerous prisoner go" is ridiculous. Even her force grabbing the lightsaber is garbage. Luke trained for a long time just to float ****, and all that just gets glazed over; As i stated before, Rey still has no ******* idea what a jedi is.

Don't get me started on the lightsaber battles. Finn vs electro-tonfa stormtrooper was cheesy, but Rey and Ren was just as much a joke. Once again, no-training-Rey "overcomes" an obstacle because "good guys." Ren would have wiped the floor simply due to ANY amount of training and experience with a lightsaber. Her only experience is carrying around a giant, useless, metal rod. That's cool /sarcasm. IT DOESN'T EVEN ******* SHOCK PEOPLE; IT'S LITERALLY A GIANT METAL ROD.

I thought the exact opposite... the mind-tick scene was great. The film had a lot (but not too much) Force use, and what Force use there was felt about right, including some neat new tricks (but no horrible force-jumps or super-speed).

Might as well also put in some stuff that's made more clear in the novelization

1. Snoke and Kylo Ren

- Leia's talk with Han is greatly expanded and it's revealed that Han didn't want Kylo Ren to train as a Jedi as he was worried Kylo was too much like Vader. Leia than took the decision to send Kylo away to the academy and Han then left.

- Depending on how you read that part of the book, you can either read things as that Snoke was watching and manipulating Kylo Ren from the start and for some reason Leia didn't want to tell Han about it and sent him to the academy to get him away from Snoke OR Snoke tricked Leia into sending Kylo to the Academy. Alan Dean Foster isn't the best of writers and both views can be taken if you read the whole page.

- It's implied that Luke, Leia, and Han were all friends with Snoke at some point, if not an outright teacher at the Academy.

- Snoke and Kylo Ren have expanded dialogue and seem to like telling each other how awesome the other is. Their relationship is way different from Emperor and Vader.

- Snoke is also in hiding. He's on a ship which is constantly changing it's location, and is sending out his messages through an untraceable hologram. Only a few people, like Kylo Ren know how to find Snoke.

- Snoke doesn't seem to believe in the force, or free will, or self determination, or luck. He seems to believe everything can be explained by science and as a result groups like the Jedi are really just a cult.

- Snoke and Kylo Ren believe the Empire was for the best in the galaxy and it was Vader's selfishness for wanting to save Luke, his being tempted by the light, that caused it to fall.

- Snoke was alive before the Clone Wars.

2. Jakku and Rey

- Max Von Sidow's character's dialogue (can't remember the characters name) was expanded to show he was a legendary adventurer. He isn't an elder of the village, he simply found a piece of the map on Jakku and let Poe know.

- Its heavily implied that whoever Luke entrusted the map to on Jakku died sometime ago, likely was Rey's guardian on the planet.

- Rey learned how to pilot from the flight simulator she built. Effectively she's been playing all the Rogue Squadron games and Tie Fighter in her free time.

- Both Snoke and Kylo Ren have suspicions on who Rey could be, and by the end at least Kylo Ren realizes that "it's her". It's even italicized in the novel.

- Incidentally it's also basically confirmed that Rey is far stronger than Kylo Ren in the force. Somehow this confirms to him what her identity is.

- No one else seems to have an idea who Rey is or why she's as strong in the force as she is.

- Rey seems to have been left on the planet around the time of the Jedi Academy slaughter.

- When Rey defeated Kylo Ren a voice in her head tried to compel her to kill him and she resisted.

3. State of the Galaxy

- The Republic is established but it's a gong show apparently. Basically it's gone back to the ineffective government it was before the Clone Wars.

- The Imperial Remnants are also a gong show. The First Order has only recently appeared on the scene and most people haven't even heard of them. They are just a imperial faction, possibly trying to unite the others.

- The Resistance is trying to destroy the last vestiges of the Empire and is not officially supported by the New Republic. They are fighting the First Order and anything else that's oppressive.

Might as well also put in some stuff that's made more clear in the novelization

1. Snoke and Kylo Ren

- Leia's talk with Han is greatly expanded and it's revealed that Han didn't want Kylo Ren to train as a Jedi as he was worried Kylo was too much like Vader. Leia than took the decision to send Kylo away to the academy and Han then left.

- Depending on how you read that part of the book, you can either read things as that Snoke was watching and manipulating Kylo Ren from the start and for some reason Leia didn't want to tell Han about it and sent him to the academy to get him away from Snoke OR Snoke tricked Leia into sending Kylo to the Academy. Alan Dean Foster isn't the best of writers and both views can be taken if you read the whole page.

- It's implied that Luke, Leia, and Han were all friends with Snoke at some point, if not an outright teacher at the Academy.

- Snoke and Kylo Ren have expanded dialogue and seem to like telling each other how awesome the other is. Their relationship is way different from Emperor and Vader.

- Snoke is also in hiding. He's on a ship which is constantly changing it's location, and is sending out his messages through an untraceable hologram. Only a few people, like Kylo Ren know how to find Snoke.

- Snoke doesn't seem to believe in the force, or free will, or self determination, or luck. He seems to believe everything can be explained by science and as a result groups like the Jedi are really just a cult.

- Snoke and Kylo Ren believe the Empire was for the best in the galaxy and it was Vader's selfishness for wanting to save Luke, his being tempted by the light, that caused it to fall.

- Snoke was alive before the Clone Wars.

2. Jakku and Rey

- Max Von Sidow's character's dialogue (can't remember the characters name) was expanded to show he was a legendary adventurer. He isn't an elder of the village, he simply found a piece of the map on Jakku and let Poe know.

- Its heavily implied that whoever Luke entrusted the map to on Jakku died sometime ago, likely was Rey's guardian on the planet.

- Rey learned how to pilot from the flight simulator she built. Effectively she's been playing all the Rogue Squadron games and Tie Fighter in her free time.

- Both Snoke and Kylo Ren have suspicions on who Rey could be, and by the end at least Kylo Ren realizes that "it's her". It's even italicized in the novel.

- Incidentally it's also basically confirmed that Rey is far stronger than Kylo Ren in the force. Somehow this confirms to him what her identity is.

- No one else seems to have an idea who Rey is or why she's as strong in the force as she is.

- Rey seems to have been left on the planet around the time of the Jedi Academy slaughter.

- When Rey defeated Kylo Ren a voice in her head tried to compel her to kill him and she resisted.

3. State of the Galaxy

- The Republic is established but it's a gong show apparently. Basically it's gone back to the ineffective government it was before the Clone Wars.

- The Imperial Remnants are also a gong show. The First Order has only recently appeared on the scene and most people haven't even heard of them. They are just a imperial faction, possibly trying to unite the others.

- The Resistance is trying to destroy the last vestiges of the Empire and is not officially supported by the New Republic. They are fighting the First Order and anything else that's oppressive.

Thanks!

In light of this information, how much do you think Snoke is actually Darth Plageius?

Thanks!

In light of this information, how much do you think Snoke is actually Darth Plageius?

From the novel, I'd put it at like 75% chance.

It seems most of the stuff from the novel that didn't make the film was any hints of who Snoke is, and all of these hints ring true with what we've heard about Plagarius. The guy is portrayed as an evil atheist force user who's fatherly and views things in scientific terms, and that's kind of what we know about Plagarius that's still cannon.

That and I'd say the novel implies that Rey is the result of somekind of Dark Side experiment and she isn't Luke's daughter. Luke somehow got a hold of her and decided to abandon her on Jakku rather than let Snoke get her or kill her himself.

Heck if you accept that Snoke is Plagarius and Rey is the result of a Dark Side experiment, it's not a big step from there to say that Plagarius experiments also created Anakin in the "virgin birth" as was implied in RoTS and Rey is effectively Anakin 2.0.

Thanks!

In light of this information, how much do you think Snoke is actually Darth Plageius?

From the novel, I'd put it at like 75% chance.

It seems most of the stuff from the novel that didn't make the film was any hints of who Snoke is, and all of these hints ring true with what we've heard about Plagarius. The guy is portrayed as an evil atheist force user who's fatherly and views things in scientific terms, and that's kind of what we know about Plagarius that's still cannon.

That and I'd say the novel implies that Rey is the result of somekind of Dark Side experiment and she isn't Luke's daughter. Luke somehow got a hold of her and decided to abandon her on Jakku rather than let Snoke get her or kill her himself.

Heck if you accept that Snoke is Plagarius and Rey is the result of a Dark Side experiment, it's not a big step from there to say that Plagarius experiments also created Anakin in the "virgin birth" as was implied in RoTS and Rey is effectively Anakin 2.0.

Mind effectively blown.

Please re-seal airlocks.

Was I the only one that was egregiously aggravated by Rey's force use? It's established she hardly know what a jedi is, but then somehow pulls off a ******* JEDI MIND TRICK. NO ONE WOULD EVER JUST ASSUME THEY CAN DO THAT. And the terms of the trick have to be believable to the individual. "these are not the droids you are looking for" is fine because that poor stormtrooper has probably been checking robots all day and just wants to go home. "You will disobey every direct order you have been given for no believable internal reasoning and let a dangerous prisoner go" is ridiculous. Even her force grabbing the lightsaber is garbage. Luke trained for a long time just to float ****, and all that just gets glazed over; As i stated before, Rey still has no ******* idea what a jedi is.

Don't get me started on the lightsaber battles. Finn vs electro-tonfa stormtrooper was cheesy, but Rey and Ren was just as much a joke. Once again, no-training-Rey "overcomes" an obstacle because "good guys." Ren would have wiped the floor simply due to ANY amount of training and experience with a lightsaber. Her only experience is carrying around a giant, useless, metal rod. That's cool /sarcasm. IT DOESN'T EVEN ******* SHOCK PEOPLE; IT'S LITERALLY A GIANT METAL ROD.

Speaking of Kylo Ren, he was essentially that one guy from Grandma's Boy. You all know who I mean.

I'm getting worked up thinking about it again. TFA wasn't bad, but it was hardly good.

ANYWAY, back to armada! something I enjoy!

I hope we get some sort of Larger Star Destroyer with 6 hull zones. As for the rebel fleet, maybe the Liberty class but I'm drawing blanks for any other possibility.

I can live with Rey being able to pull all this off if she turns out to be the one who really brings balance to the force or such. But Finn? How the hell can he even last one stroke vs a Dark side user? They simply should abstain from those things. I mean, Luke cant even deflect this training probe's bolts when he first uses a saber, and along comes Finn...."you have a weapon" is apparently all he needs.

I dont care, to an extent, when people say the movie has to be for everyone. Many have years or decades of Star Wars experience, I just cant take everything and say "great", even if overanalysing, especially a SciFi movie, is not wise.

Edit: Yes, even though Finn has Stormtrooper close combat training.

**** this new movie about space wizards! their magic doesn't make sense anymore.

They do name the system that gets blown up, but it's not one I've heard of before. So presumably it's like Alderaan; reasonably important and populated by "the enemy", but who's loss is not some sort of crippling blow to the Republic.

The fallout from such an act, though, would likely galvanize both the Reublic and the Empire to start preparing for war with each other. As we know the Resistance is covertly funded by the Republic, it would seem likely that we'll start to see more new fighters and capital ships find their way into the films as they proceed on from here.

Also, it would seem strange for Snoke to turn out to be Darth Plagueis, since he was, first and foremost, a Sith. Kylo are the Knights of Ren are very clearly NOT Sith, though they do use the dark side. So while there are similarities in back story, it would seem strange for Snoke to completely throw out all of the Sith traditions that would have been ingrained on him once he's in power among the First Order. Unless it turns out he's some sort of force-ghost-reincarnation who lost his memories but could eventually duplicate the original's work. Which would be lame.