Kanan: or, how i learned to stop worrying and go full chicken little.

By banjobenito, in X-Wing

I think FFG are about to publish an overpowered card. An overpowered card that is meta-independently good, and that has incredible synergy with a ton of rebel ships.

Kanan effectively turns every white maneuver on a dial green. The result is this: the hwk gets a green hard two, previously the reserve of only a few high end interceptor ships. The K-wing's entire dial is now green, 100%. Dash's outrider is levelled up to absurd levels: blocking him now becomes a matter of sheer chance, as he has every maneuver range 1-3 on green, and a green 4 too. His dial is lightyears ahead of the A-wing, the interceptor or the /fo.

On top of this, if Kanan isn't needed on his ship this round, he can lend his dial-greening power out to a wingman. Ptl corran gets 15 green maneuvers, if he stay within 1-2 (hardly a herculean task), for example.

Now, we play in a game that is largely dominated by action economy and stress assignment. Kenan is a huge card for both these elements of the game, and clocks in at 3pts. He breaks the system by which we judge dial quality, and tips maneuverability overwhelmingly in favour of the rebels. What the hell.

I'm calling it. The sky is falling!

On one ship. Once a turn. Within Range 1-2.

He removes only one token, he doesn't guarantee an action, and does nothing if you still run into something. He is absolutely worth his cost and he's going to have some very potent effects but he is absolutely not overpowered. He's a very real extension of Rebel synergy, and will be prominent in the forthcoming evolution of Control as a game strategy.

Pretty sure chicken little didn't stop worrying...

I think FFG are about to publish an overpowered card. An overpowered card that is meta-independently good, and that has incredible synergy with a ton of rebel ships.

Kanan effectively turns every white maneuver on a dial green. The result is this: the hwk gets a green hard two, previously the reserve of only a few high end interceptor ships. The K-wing's entire dial is now green, 100%. Dash's outrider is levelled up to absurd levels: blocking him now becomes a matter of sheer chance, as he has every maneuver range 1-3 on green, and a green 4 too. His dial is lightyears ahead of the A-wing, the interceptor or the /fo.

On top of this, if Kanan isn't needed on his ship this round, he can lend his dial-greening power out to a wingman. Ptl corran gets 15 green maneuvers, if he stay within 1-2 (hardly a herculean task), for example.

Now, we play in a game that is largely dominated by action economy and stress assignment. Kenan is a huge card for both these elements of the game, and clocks in at 3pts. He breaks the system by which we judge dial quality, and tips maneuverability overwhelmingly in favour of the rebels. What the hell.

I'm calling it. The sky is falling!

Normally, I am -firmly- in the "wait and see"-camp.

but your points are very well laid out. I'm not convinced he's OP, but he's definitely something to keep an eye on, especially in a hypermobile dash/corran-build.

so.. wait and see.. and keep a blaster pointed on that jedi. better several.

On one ship. Once a turn. Within Range 1-2.

He removes only one token, he doesn't guarantee an action, and does nothing if you still run into something. He is absolutely worth his cost and he's going to have some very potent effects but he is absolutely not overpowered. He's a very real extension of Rebel synergy, and will be prominent in the forthcoming evolution of Control as a game strategy.

Not to burst your bubble, but not sure if you caught that he works for the ship he is on, which, well, is always in range 1 of itself.

He's pretty powerful, but honestly, I'm not convinced he's any more powerful than say, unhinged TLTs.

Edited by Kdubb

Let`s wait and see. Don`t cry a river before it`s already late.

K-wing with full green dial? So what? they never get stressed

HWK with lots of green dial? So what? it`s still an HWK with 5 life and 3 more juicy points to collect when you kill it.

Maybe Super Dash will benefit the most of it, but Dash with Nien Numb was never that big of a deal.

Nah, sky won't fall. Kanan is hilariously strong, but not that good versus stress dealing lists that will only increase in popularity. Those will often deal so much stress that it might as well not matter if you remove 1. Put it on a K-Wing? Thats 3 entirely irrelevant points if you opponent does not bring stressdealers, which they certainly will not in every single game (although in some). Super Dash is going to lose his triple action economy for becoming incredibly hard to block, which may sometimes not be worth it. I see no problem with HWKs being able to deal better with stress. In the end they are paying 10 points to really get use out of this (PTL, Kanan, EU) and that doesn't even include the turret.

I see him as a strong and game changing, but not breaking card.

Tsieg, It blows my mind that you can think he's not overpowered. Truly. A 3 point upgrade that turns all white green, with loan out capability?

It is far and away ahead of any other upgrade card that improves maneuverability, it has no equal. How can that not qualify as overpowered?

The real kicker is that it is a totally unnecessary development. It's not in response to a new tendency or new archetype, it's purely about removing one of the most interesting constraints in the game. For one ship.

Edited by banjobenito

I'm not sure he is better than Kyle on super-Dash. Probably an even break for my Dash/Corran play style.

Tsieg, It blows my mind that you can think he's not overpowered. Truly. A 3 point upgrade that turns all white green, with loan out capability?

It is far and away ahead of any other upgrade card that improves maneuverability, it has no equal. How can that not qualify as overpowered?

The real kicker is that it is a totally unnecessary development. It's not in response to a new tendency or new archetype, it's purely about removing one of the most interesting constraints in the game. For one ship.

PTL Dash with Engine Upgrade will definitely love this card. It does, however, replace Kyle Katarn, so you'll have fewer dice modification tokens to work with. I think it will be strong but balanced.

What I'm really looking forward to is PTL B-Wings. Too bad you can't give them both crew and Engine Upgrade though. Still, imagine Ten Numb with PTL, Mangler, E2, Kanan, and Advanced Sensors.

Edited by EdgeOfDreams

Let`s wait and see. Don`t cry a river before it`s already late.

K-wing with full green dial? So what? they never get stressed

HWK with lots of green dial? So what? it`s still an HWK with 5 life and 3 more juicy points to collect when you kill it.

Maybe Super Dash will benefit the most of it, but Dash with Nien Numb was never that big of a deal.

Straight greens are not a huge advantage though. It's worth about what Nien Numb is worth- 1 point.

But green HARD turns... The best arc dodgers in the game all have one thing in common- green hard turns. Without them, Tie interceptors would be as dead as they were without autothrusters.

Ask a player who plays interceptors heavily what green maneuver they could never live without. Pretty sure they would say the green 2-hard turn.

Kanan is just bonkers on Dash it seems, giving him virtually every, we will call it "basic" maneuver as green (check his dial if you don't know what I mean). I honestly think the big failure here with the card was having it apply to the ship he is equipped on. But then again, this is all in THEORY. I will hold my TRUE and full evaluation of the card for when I see it on the board. I just pray it wont be one of those matches that makes me want to flip the table... xD

On one ship. Once a turn. Within Range 1-2.

He removes only one token, he doesn't guarantee an action, and does nothing if you still run into something. He is absolutely worth his cost and he's going to have some very potent effects but he is absolutely not overpowered. He's a very real extension of Rebel synergy, and will be prominent in the forthcoming evolution of Control as a game strategy.

Not to burst your bubble, but not sure if you caught that he works for the ship he is on, which, well, is always in range 1 of itself.

He's pretty powerful, but honestly, I'm not convinced he's any more powerful than say, unhinged TLTs.

Yes I'm aware he empowers whatever is carrying him, and I'm still really not that concerned. No moreso than when I see Biggs on the table, or Torkil. You're spending points for an effect that can shape how the game plays out, but you can play the game in such a manner as to counter or neutralise that specific effect. Some builds have better interactions than others, as ever.

Tsieg, It blows my mind that you can think he's not overpowered. Truly. A 3 point upgrade that turns all white green, with loan out capability?

It is far and away ahead of any other upgrade card that improves maneuverability, it has no equal. How can that not qualify as overpowered?

The real kicker is that it is a totally unnecessary development. It's not in response to a new tendency or new archetype, it's purely about removing one of the most interesting constraints in the game. For one ship.

He really isn't. He does nothing for red manoeuvres, he does nothing in the face of obstacles, he doesn't provide post-manoeuvre options by himself, and he takes up a crew slot. Where does he fit as a crewmember that doesn't sacrifice damage output or attack consistency? The only place that comes to mind for me is the Ghost (appropriately) and arguably the Falcon, maybe even onboard the Outrider.

You're correct that he's strong though. Most ships that can take him will have a great advantage on the field if they bring Kanan. PtL sees a resurgence coming with him. He works on ships that have been ionised, and he isn't limited just to the ship he's on. I feel it's an incredibly thematic ability that suits both the character and the game.

Normally things that make your dial have more greens are cheap. Like one point cheap. R2, unhinged, and Nien are all one point. None of those tear up the meta. Given he's unique, takes up a valuable crew slot and is three points, I think he's about right.

Seriously, three point crew are almost always good. I don't see how he's so special considering what Mara, Vader, or C-3PO can do.

Edited by DarkArk

Dash will be a lot harder to block with Kanan. The question is, can he still get out of arcs and get modifiers without Kyle? I think it's possible, but against PS8+ it's dicy.

How often do K-wings end up stressed? Very seldom, in my experience. And since they can't take PTL, they don't have much use for Kanan's affect. They might be good carriers for him, though.

More greens on the HWK is nice, but Jan is the only one who stresses herself. The other HWKs are much more in need of a white 3-bank and 4-straight than additional greens.

The B-wing doesn't need more greens. It is another alternative carrier for Kanan, though.

While this does make PTL Falcons more practical, I think it's still going to be inferior to the superior mitigation-offense combo of 3P0, Predator, and Gunner/R2-D2.

It's interesting as support for other, nearby ships with PTL, but remember, Kanan doesn't actually make maneuvers green. Corran+R2-D2 is still going to be doing green maneuvers most of the time.

It's interesting as support for other, nearby ships with PTL, but remember, Kanan doesn't actually make maneuvers green. Corran+R2-D2 is still going to be doing green maneuvers most of the time.

That's exactly it. Kanan is fantastic but doesn't work well with most abilities that coincide with manoeuvres; he's more useful if you stress yourself with an ability. PtL, Opportunist, Stay on Target, R3-A2, Jan Ors (Pilot)....that's where he's going to shine.

PTL Dash WILL be even cooler now, which is neat.

He will be harder to block and predict, but without Kyle Katarn crew, his action economy will make him a bit worse, so he might actually receive more damage or dish out less damage. It's a good trade I think.

If he did make them green, even Lando would suddenly be overpowered. :P

Stresshog now required in all lists. Sorry Imps and scum.

I'll be more than happy to see Dash flying around without Kyle Katarn. I'll be ecstatic for that pancake-loving nerf herder's ship to go down in flames from an Inquisitor's blast while Kanan is aboard.

Hi tsieg, I don't see any of your points as constraints, I'm afraid...

'He does nothing for red maneuvers' - Dash, his obvious partner, only has one! Granted, he has only a limited effect on B-wings, but on every other carrier, this is a minor quibble. Let me say it again: he makes a hwk dial viable for arc dodging. He ushers in the first ship with a 100% green dial - something that if spitballed on the forum before his release would have been laughed out as game breaking - and that ship is the K-WING! :D

'He doesn't negate obstacles' - a crew member that turns your Dial 90% green And eliminates obstacles from the game results in a game that is straying away from x-wing. And a 3pt card that only achieves half of this is not a concern in terms of balance? Especially when his most obvious partner already has that ability?

'He takes up a crew slot' - yes, sure, he's a crew card.

In short, your objections amply demonstrate just how powerful he is; Kanan breaks a crucial element in the cost analysis of a list, but that's okay because ... he's a crew card?? We haven't even talked about his very powerful aoe effect.

Edited by banjobenito

Normally things that make your dial have more greens are cheap. Like one point cheap. R2, unhinged, and Nien are all one point. None of those tear up the meta. Given he's unique, takes up a valuable crew slot and is three points, I think he's about right.

Seriously, three point crew are almost always good. I don't see how he's so special considering what Mara, Vader, or C-3PO can do.

This is a worthwhile argument, and you are swaying me a bit in my initial feelings on the card. I would say there is a key difference between those upgrades and him though in that he opens up the dial both ways- up and down and side to side. The R2 and unhinged give greens across all of a single speed maneuver. Nien Numb gives greens to all straights. Kanan gives greens to, well... for some ships, just about everything. With these other upgrades, all you have to do is think "Ok, all his 3s are green, so I need to remember that...", whereas with Kanan it's more like "What's Dash's dial again? Oh, wow. Ya, guess I'll take a guess and see how this goes!"

And ya crew in general is a very powerful upgrade slot. Tactician coming in at 2 points is probably just as valuable as Mara. And C-3PO is likely under costed. Ysanne Issard, although at 4, is basically the imperial equivalent of C-3P0, and an absolute pain of a card to face. So I feel ya on that one.

And just another note. This card continues to solidify PTL as the leader of of the holy EPT trinity along with Veteran Instincts and Predator. Sigh... Maybe someday we will have others worth using... *Remembers Crack Shot* Oh! How about that!

Daredevil is a white maneouver...

Please tell me this is joke. Pretty please tell me this is tongue-in-cheek...............

Holy cow, hedge! Hadn't thought of that! Great game last night, by the way! :)