Le gaspe!~

=( I'm kind of meh on them right now. They seem to die faster than you'd really hope, move earlier than you'd want them to and just... never have stuff to shoot at when you're playing an opponent who's equally or more competent than i am.

Their sheer expense makes them prohibitive to find in a 4 ship list, and being counter deployed sucks. Their speed is nice, but dang... Sometimes you still can't catch nothing.

You want more upgrades, but then it starts getting expensive. And its massive bulk makes it hard to coordinate with other ships.

Also, 2 ISD lists so far suck. =/

And 3ISD? LOL.

Maybe 3ISD with Cluster Mines... WAIT THATS IT.

An ISD II with ECMs, Motti, and Needa replacing the contain token can be worth the point investment.

I'm also of the mindset that the ISD should be placed last when it comes to deployment, so an initiative bid may be more important for an Imperial player with a single ISD list.

Admiral M. Drive speed 3 and all ship attacks against you are obstructed. Good card I see few playing.

An ISD II with ECMs, Motti, and Needa replacing the contain token can be worth the point investment.

I'm also of the mindset that the ISD should be placed last when it comes to deployment, so an initiative bid may be more important for an Imperial player with a single ISD list.

I've done all of this. Motti, meh. I've blown him up on ISDs with Ackbar. Also Needa... really isn't sure he's worth it even.

I do this also, but it hasn't helped that much.

I feel like the imperial second player objectives are boring as hell. Contested Outpost all day. Adv gunnery?

Minefields. BOOORING.

I haven't got to play much Wave 2 yet, so they still are very effective as a psychological weapon against me. They are downright terrifying.

An ISD II with ECMs, Motti, and Needa replacing the contain token can be worth the point investment.

I'm also of the mindset that the ISD should be placed last when it comes to deployment, so an initiative bid may be more important for an Imperial player with a single ISD list.

I've done all of this. Motti, meh. I've blown him up on ISDs with Ackbar. Also Needa... really isn't sure he's worth it even.

I do this also, but it hasn't helped that much.

I feel like the imperial second player objectives are boring as hell. Contested Outpost all day. Adv gunnery?

Minefields. BOOORING.

Needa is the opposite of Montferrat: he's there if you plan on hanging back a bit. Then he can save you some damage from some long-range sniping (for only 2 points).

Ok Bail, do you win your games normally? If not, then what are you doing wrong? Are you playing too spread out? Are you attacking the wrong ships and thus letting the opponents dictate engagements?

Let's figure that out first before we start the condemnation of a fine ship.

I think ISD's are awesome, personally.

They don't seem that great because everyone sees em and goes "Imma kill that thing right away."

Ya I find it has white whale syndrome. Thats ok though, it has done enough killing in my name to see use. Generally it has been flaoting around with 3 Raiders and Ozzel. Worked pretty well so far.

It's also easy to get into the trap of thinking they should be way more powerful than they are. I mean it's a freaking Imperial Star Destroyer!!

And it is powerful in the game, 8 dice attack is something you have to account for. I'm saying Blail Blerg has done this, but I could see people putting one on the table and expecting it to just about one shot everything it sees.

That's interesting, in my little patch of the woods I've been having a lot of success with them. I run a 2 ISD, anti fighter build that I posted in another thread, though, Mind you I've only been playing against a friend of mine. However he is far more competent of a player then myself. In-fact my experience has been exactly the reverse of what some have been saying. I love both Imperials and Rebels, and I desperately want to run a strong MC80 list, however every-time I play as Rebels or against Rebels as Imperials, the game ends with Akbar at fish fry.

I dont consider myself particuarlly skilled at flying but, so far the games I've played with a well loaded ISD 2's have been major triumphs bordering on down right unfair.

Big thing about the ISD is not to use them as battering rams like in the movies

They're actually incredibly maneuverable for their size and can hit enemies at angles that diminish return fire

Their speed is nice, but dang... Sometimes you still can't catch nothing.

Sometimes a big gun is more about their fear of being hit than actually landing that shot.

For me ALL of Wave 2 is in flux. The ISD is a monster, but I've seen them kill easily and be killed easily. The game is now even more compelling but it is getting so challenging to build lists. Yes it is tough to build lists around a single ISD but I am going to do it - Because its an ISD.

Last night a two ISD build I ran TOTALLY destroyed a rebel fleet of 2 MC30s, Corvette and AFII. If we ran it again the outcome would probably not be the same, but the two ISDs were definitely the stars of the show. They will dictate what goes on.

Answer to question in title is: nnooooo

Damned if I can beat them ( ! It doesn't help that my only opponent runs them and is a far better player than me

I played last night against a good opponent of mine, who regularly tabled me in Wave 1. Now that Wave 2 is here, he's having a bit of a harder time to adjust. I think it's very much like has been suggested... no one is entirely sure how to bring the ISD to the game. Is it a carrier? Is it a dreadnaught? Is it pure intimidation? It's a bit of all of that really.

In the first match we played with it, he tried to chase me around and only kept the forward arc on my fleet. He didn't have Gunnery Team so I knew there was only one shot coming at me. Whoever was going get hit could be ready to take a roundhouse, but it would only be one shot. So use every friggin' defense token that's available to be used. The next match we played, he was better at using speed 3, getting two arcs into play. When he fired, he'd fire from the side arc first. I knew that the forward arc would be coming, so I was way more cautious in using the defense tokens. So I let a few more of the hits come through. Then the big guns came, and I was into discarding defense tokens just to stay alive. Then there was the VSD beside it that then threw the fighters at me using a Coordinate action. *poof* No more MC30.

Rebels are hit and fade, with me trying to run the Corvettes and MC80s around to the side and rear arcs. I find that the Imperial need the synergy of attack patterns to overlap their fields of fire. The ISD is a cornerstone of your fleet, it just shouldn't be (in my mind) your whole fleet.

Short answer: No.

Long answer: Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

There is plenty of whelming going on with ISDs. They're the toughest ships in the game, can put out an incredible amount of firepower and equip Gunnery Teams. They cost a lot but deliver on that cost (and don't even need nearly as many upgrades to be powerhouses like the MC80).

I've managed to squeeze in exactly one wave 2 game so far. So take my opinion with a grain of salt.

The ISD awesome, but can't be left alone. Unsupported it goes down to concentrated firepower like a VSD would. The only perk you have is the maneuverability, so don't be afraid to use it.

I'm a little worried with MC80s having higher shields and access to a support team. With Ackbar, Mc80 broadsides fire the same amount of dice (and with more red dice), and have a higher ability for self-repair. The only thing the lack is gunnery team, but it's not like an attacking ISD gains a second attack on the same ship with a gunnery team either.

So my worry is that a self-healing eternal MC80 can hold off the supposedly monsterous Imperial star Destroyer simply by spamming engineering and let Ackbar and the passive gunners (with any passive turbolasers) do the work for him, along with the rest of the fleet.

I'm a little worried with MC80s having higher shields and access to a support team. With Ackbar, Mc80 broadsides fire the same amount of dice (and with more red dice), and have a higher ability for self-repair. The only thing the lack is gunnery team, but it's not like an attacking ISD gains a second attack on the same ship with a gunnery team either.

So my worry is that a self-healing eternal MC80 can hold off the supposedly monsterous Imperial star Destroyer simply by spamming engineering and let Ackbar and the passive gunners (with any passive turbolasers) do the work for him, along with the rest of the fleet.

Been saying it since Sullust... the ISD looks a lot tougher than it is.

Go to the raw numbers. It only has two more shields and three more hull than the VSD, meaning a lot of the time it's going to die just as fast or maybe a *little* slower.

I feel like people expected the Imperial to be like some indomitable god of war striding across the battlefield laying waste, but at the end of the day it's just the Victory's older brother.

Been saying it since Sullust... the ISD looks a lot tougher than it is.

Go to the raw numbers. It only has two more shields and three more hull than the VSD, meaning a lot of the time it's going to die just as fast or maybe a *little* slower.

I feel like people expected the Imperial to be like some indomitable god of war striding across the battlefield laying waste, but at the end of the day it's just the Victory's older brother.

With ability to take ECM, move speed 3, and 33% more firepower across the board.

Been saying it since Sullust... the ISD looks a lot tougher than it is.

Go to the raw numbers. It only has two more shields and three more hull than the VSD, meaning a lot of the time it's going to die just as fast or maybe a *little* slower.

I feel like people expected the Imperial to be like some indomitable god of war striding across the battlefield laying waste, but at the end of the day it's just the Victory's older brother.

With ability to take ECM, move speed 3, and 33% more firepower across the board.

ECM on one variant, and speed 3 gets it into trouble as often as it helps.

VSDs still bring more firepower to bear point for point.

Don't get me wrong, the ISD is a great ship, but we're very much in the honeymoon phase.