Most lists tend to fall into some category where they have some obvious weakness. We used to have this with the swarm>turret>phantom archetypes.

It seems though that there's finally what I'd call an all-rounder list. It's really capable of taking on any type of list.

Palp 2 Aces. Variants: Most common - SoontirStealth VaderVI. Others - double interceptors with auto, giving a few more upgrades to the shuttle. Even whisper variants.

What lists are actually a strong counter to this list?

Do you have any flying tips that you think generally work well to play against this list?

Crack Shot using squads tend to perform well against Palp builds.

Can you show us what you'd take? And how does the game work out? Do you get enough damage done in the early few turns? What happens in the late game?

This is a list I've been considering.

It has a strong matchup against opposing TLT. It has feedback to punish getting too close, and then TLT providing support fire can probably do enough damage to down even 2 aces. From there, the shuttle should be able to take down with any ships you have remaining.

Syndicate Thug (18)

Heavy Laser Cannon's + ships. Kill Vader/non Fel first then shuttle, Fel if you have time

Mandalorian Mercenary (35)
Predator (3)
Heavy Laser Cannon (7)
Tactician (2)
Feedback Array (2)

Mandalorian Mercenary (35)
Predator (3)
Heavy Laser Cannon (7)
Tactician (2)
Feedback Array (2)

Total: 98

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Can you show us what you'd take? And how does the game work out? Do you get enough damage done in the early few turns? What happens in the late game?

Personally brobots with Crackshot instead of VI.

IG88B,IG88C, Advanced sensors, Crack Shot, HLC, dampeners, Autothrusters, title.

Only in my imagination, more of an imperial player but what about:

Serissu (20)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Autoblaster (5)

"Heavy Scyk" Interceptor (Cannon) (2)

IG-88B (36)

Crack Shot (1)

Fire-Control System (2)

Heavy Laser Cannon (7)

Inertial Dampeners (1)

Autothrusters (2)

N'Dru Suhlak (17)

Crack Shot (1)

Homing Missiles (5)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

All 3 ships are scary for Soontir so most likely your opponent will be extracareful with him. Deploy Syck+IG on one side and Z at R2 of them and your firing arcs can cover almost any approach.

Gloomshuttle can die first turn with incoming Homing+HLC shots. Keep Serissu out of the first round of fire just in case. If Soontir did not shoot this turn (fear) you've killed 29 points with the only returning fire being Vader.

Vader does not turn well so IG can make long moves and k/s loop/turn and catch a couple of shots.

Autoblaster at PS 10 is very Good on Boba so should be all right on Serissu. Much cheaper.

R3-A2, Poe and Miranda. Alternatively, BBBBZ or four strategically placed TLTs.

I brought

Patrol leader

vader crew

Gunner

Oicun

Predator

Ysanne

Rebel captive

I brought this list to a FLGS store tournament and completely wrecked the palp aces list I played. I took first, though I never faced tlt spam, but it handled every thing else okay...

Maybe swap Oicun out for 4 obsidians if you're tlt worried?

Ya, Vader crew is the easiest way to handle aces. With a conventional list I think the Emporer must die quickly because it will be too hard to kill Soontir with him alive.

Is the strategy to go after Vader first or the Palp Shuttle?

Most lists tend to fall into some category where they have some obvious weakness. We used to have this with the swarm>turret>phantom archetypes.

It seems though that there's finally what I'd call an all-rounder list. It's really capable of taking on any type of list.

Palp 2 Aces. Variants: Most common - SoontirStealth VaderVI. Others - double interceptors with auto, giving a few more upgrades to the shuttle. Even whisper variants.

What lists are actually a strong counter to this list?

Do you have any flying tips that you think generally work well to play against this list?

1.) There was never actually a swarm>turret>phantom thing. Firstly, swarms are rather rare now and were especially rare at the height of fat Turretwing. People like to pretend they're still a thing but it's just one French guy at Worlds and a bunch of 5 ship lists being mistaken for swarms. Secondly, swarms don't actually counter fat turrets. Swarms are vulnerable to arc dodgers. Which ships are the best arc dodgers? Fat turrets with engine upgrade, especially Dash. And what counter arc dodgers? You got it, fat turrets! Fat turrets were the all comer list, this is why every top table for the past year up until TLT and the MoV nerf was 7/8 children with ice cream bars smearing them on each others faces, pretending that it takes skill to win by list building and rolling dice.

2.) Bump them in front of 4-5 Crack Squadrons. You'll have PS on the shuttle, so setup opposite it. Try and rush it, and then position yourself to threaten the aces defending the shuttle.

This list HATES stresshogs. I had this match-up in a tournament and the stress just shut down each ace.

1.) There was never actually a swarm>turret>phantom thing. Firstly, swarms are rather rare now and were especially rare at the height of fat Turretwing. People like to pretend they're still a thing but it's just one French guy at Worlds and a bunch of 5 ship lists being mistaken for swarms. Secondly, swarms don't actually counter fat turrets. Swarms are vulnerable to arc dodgers. Which ships are the best arc dodgers? Fat turrets with engine upgrade, especially Dash. And what counter arc dodgers? You got it, fat turrets! Fat turrets were the all comer list, this is why every top table for the past year up until TLT and the MoV nerf was 7/8 children with ice cream bars smearing them on each others faces, pretending that it takes skill to win by list building and rolling dice.

I don't mean to pick on you, but there's just so much incorrect information there...

First off, http://lists.starwarsclubhouse.com/get_tourney_details?tourney_id=2 and http://lists.starwarsclubhouse.com/get_tourney_details?tourney_id=1

Those were the 2014 Worlds results. In Flight 2, Four TIE Swarms in the top 11 MoV. Five swarms if you consider 4BZ a Rebel swarm.

These were the final tables:

So that's two Fat Turrets, two Phantoms, aaaand two Swarms in the top 8. I have no idea how you arrived at the conclusion that "Fat turrets were the all comer list, this is why every top table for the past year up until TLT and the MoV nerf was 7/8 children with ice cream bars smearing them on each others faces, pretending that it takes skill to win by list building and rolling dice."

I agree with this tactic against aces. And seeing as how PWTs are much more susceptible to blocking than Soontir/Vader, Swarms in fact are a counter to Fat Turrets even if they have EU/BR.

Vader and fel LOATHE stress, any ion effects are gravy on top.

Double post

I agree with this tactic against aces. And seeing as how PWTs are much more susceptible to blocking than Soontir/Vader, Swarms in fact are a counter to Fat Turrets even if they have EU/BR.

Yep. As a Z swarmer myself, back in those times I was very happy to face Fat turrets. I took care of them fairly easily. Easier if you don't care about rocks and your opponent thinks you do. Won a tourney full of Turrets and a couple Phantom/Mini-Ties with my Tarnation build.

This is a list I've been considering.

It has a strong matchup against opposing TLT. It has feedback to punish getting too close, and then TLT providing support fire can probably do enough damage to down even 2 aces. From there, the shuttle should be able to take down with any ships you have remaining.

Syndicate Thug (18)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

R4 Agromech (2)

Syndicate Thug (18)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

Bomb Loadout (0)

R4 Agromech (2)

Proximity Mines (3)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

The prox mine was just random leftover 3 points.

Variant:

Syndicate Thug (18)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

R4 Agromech (2)

Syndicate Thug (18)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

Bomb Loadout (0)

R4 Agromech (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Spice Runner (16)

Autoblaster Turret (2)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Variant 3, with Torkil Mux

Torkil Mux (19)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

Moldy Crow (3)

Syndicate Thug (18)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

R4 Agromech (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

Feedback Array (2)

Black Sun Soldier (13)

XX-23 S-Thread Tracers (1)

Feedback Array (2)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Stressing upgrades or TLT spam are pretty solid counters. Taking actions away is always a strong approach, and Autothrusters and Palpatine simply cannot stand up against the onslaught of attacks of TLT lists. Palpatine's defensive efficiency is quickly broken when you are the target of 8 attacks, as he can only help one roll. If you get at least 2 full turns of attacks against Soontir, you are certain to break that stealth device, and then AT can't help him as much. The key is to spread. They will want to close to R1, so your separate your doughnuts so that the blind spot of each ship is protected by his 3 wingmen.

Latts with Weapon Engineer

2 x Black Sun Ace with Crackshot, Glitterstim and Homing Missiles

Deploy asteroids all in a line up the side of one of the board edges to give the Interceptors a nice place to receive cover. Deploy your ships in the centre to adjust to where the Interceptors will start (mostly this is going to be on the side with all the asteroids in line, see why we did that now?)

Move Latts up the board centre and Target Lock as soon as able, put a lock on both Interceptors. This should be easy as they are going to try and go from one board edge to the other using the riods as cover.

As soon as the opportunity presents itself, target lock on to one of the interceptors with the Aces and if when they are in arc at the start of a shooting phase, pop Glitterstim. Be patient with this, it may not happen right away.

Homing missile is 4 dice, denies range bonus and doesn't use up the target lock, also it denies the use of the evade token. Hit them with 4 hits (glitter and rerolls is quite possible) use Latts to bring their agility down by 1 and then crack shot the other evade they get. In most cases this is going to be four red versus two green. If this happens at range 2, then that should be enough to insta kill unless by some weird strange event Palp manages the save. If the Interceptor is AT and TC, then they will go pop, an Interceptor with only one evade is a dead Interceptor.

Tried this tactic 6 times now and each time Fel or Carnor goes boom first time. Vader dies from taking a pounding from the homing missiles and then the next turn having Latts and an Ace fire at him with primaries. Most people concede after that.

If they have Fel and Whisper, fire at Whisper first to force a Palp save and then hit Fel in the same turn. Fel will die or be on one hull. Use Latts to finish either one off.

Unfortunately, you will find you struggle against swarms or any stress inducing list.

Latts with Weapon Engineer

2 x Black Sun Ace with Crackshot, Glitterstim and Homing Missiles

Deploy asteroids all in a line up the side of one of the board edges to give the Interceptors a nice place to receive cover. Deploy your ships in the centre to adjust to where the Interceptors will start (mostly this is going to be on the side with all the asteroids in line, see why we did that now?)

Move Latts up the board centre and Target Lock as soon as able, put a lock on both Interceptors. This should be easy as they are going to try and go from one board edge to the other using the riods as cover.

As soon as the opportunity presents itself, target lock on to one of the interceptors with the Aces and if when they are in arc at the start of a shooting phase, pop Glitterstim. Be patient with this, it may not happen right away.

Homing missile is 4 dice, denies range bonus and doesn't use up the target lock, also it denies the use of the evade token. Hit them with 4 hits (glitter and rerolls is quite possible) use Latts to bring their agility down by 1 and then crack shot the other evade they get. In most cases this is going to be four red versus two green. If this happens at range 2, then that should be enough to insta kill unless by some weird strange event Palp manages the save. If the Interceptor is AT and TC, then they will go pop, an Interceptor with only one evade is a dead Interceptor.

Tried this tactic 6 times now and each time Fel or Carnor goes boom first time. Vader dies from taking a pounding from the homing missiles and then the next turn having Latts and an Ace fire at him with primaries. Most people concede after that.

If they have Fel and Whisper, fire at Whisper first to force a Palp save and then hit Fel in the same turn. Fel will die or be on one hull. Use Latts to finish either one off.

Unfortunately, you will find you struggle against swarms or any stress inducing list.

1.) Good list idea.

2.) Against stress lists you have PS and the alpha strike capability to deal with them IMO.