Yesterday I was in a tournament at Zombie Planet in Albany NY. It was a great tournament with 26 great players. It was well run and with excellent prize support. What made my head nearly explode was Tournament points. We did a five round swiss with no cut. I was the only undefeated player at the tournament, but I had THREE modified wins. Apparently no one else even had one modified all day. Even though I was the only player who had not lost once I ended up in 5th. Argh!

I'm not saying the system is broken or should be changed or anything. There was literally a single left turn made by my Tycho Celchu that cost me the tournament and the guy running the event felt enough sympathy they gave me an extra prize anyway, just because he was a good guy. I'm just venting and sharing my pain!

Thats painfull! I believe it is enough of an edge case that there won't have to be something done about this, though. In all the tournaments I did (which aren't many, I have to admit, so take my experience with a huge grain of salt) I have seen 2 modified wins. Most games will finish.

EDIT

I'm saying the system is broken or should be changed or anything.

Going by context, I think you accidentally said the exact opposite of what you meant...

2 wins and 3 wins on time with fewer than 12 points between the players hardly counts the same as 5 wins, as is proper

I only go to tournaments so I can get in a few games in one day. I missed the last local store tournament because of car trouble... that being said:

I don't like the 'system' that my store uses. I ALWAYS get a bye round- NO matter how I play, the MOV or any other reason. Last time I got a bye round because someone left early. I really think the T.O. pairs players based on personal preference.

I really want to know why winners don't win and newbies get the shaft.

And.., Why can't community groups run tournaments with official FFG kits?

Modified wins are still wins and doesn't record supercede MOV?

I don't see how 2 wins and 3 modified wins is worth less than someone with 4 full wins.

Modified wins are still wins and doesn't record supercede MOV?

I don't see how 2 wins and 3 modified wins is worth less than someone with 4 full wins.

It´s pretty simple

Full wins are worth 5 pts.

Modified Wins are worth 3.

4x5+1x0=20

3x3+2x5=19

Wow, that would be frustrating.

However I think the OP mistated wording slightly as the tone came across more that they DONT think the system needs changing?

Modified wins are still wins and doesn't record supercede MOV?

I don't see how 2 wins and 3 modified wins is worth less than someone with 4 full wins.

MOV is the first tiebreaker. Victory points is the primary ranking.

Modified wins are still wins and doesn't record supercede MOV?

I don't see how 2 wins and 3 modified wins is worth less than someone with 4 full wins.

It is not about record, but about score. A modified win scores you 3 points, a full one gives you 5. That means op had 19 points, while someone with 4 full wins and 1 loss had 20.

we had some like 5 modified wins throughout our tournament yesterday

this just speaks to how amazing balanced the game is and how close our matches were (and how far we've come from the era of fat ships and 200-0 garbage)

I myself took part in giving up a modified win to the champion, and taking 2nd place with a modified win in my record. You had to claw over the bodies of our opponents (and your own dignity) to place well on that day

https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/194145-fickles-most-shameful-game/

1st place:

1 Mod win, 3 Full Wins

2nd place:

1 loss (mod win for opponent, 1st place), 2 full wins, 1 mod win

3rd place:

1 loss (mod win for opponent, 4th place), 2 full wins, 1 mod win

4th place:

2 mod wins, 1 full win, 1 loss (mod win for opponent, 2nd place)

I think it should be brackets like every sport out there. Reseed if you want, but a win is a win.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. They need to move to a 4 point system, and revert to a mod win being 33 points, and put the draw at 12 points.

4 points = Full win > 33pts, or all opponent ships are dead

3 points = Mod win 13-33pts

2 points = Draw, within 12 points

1 point = Mod loss 13-33pts

0 points = Full loss >33pts

This way, every game is worth 4 points. Furthermore, how often does someone get the mod win not because it's 5 ties vs 4 ties, but because he has 49pt Horn and his opponent has 48pt Horn (or something similar), where it still is really a toss up between the two. Therefore, the "draw" is expanded from exact point match to being within the 12 point range of a "basic ship." I'd be open to the idea of reducing that to 6 or something since the case could easily be made that an Academy Pilot doesn't stand a chance against a Rookie Pilot in a 1on1 situation, and that's only 9 points differential. And then the modified win goes out to 33 points as it originally did, indicating that you were ahead, but not by an unrecoverable amount. With the rounds extended to 75 minutes these days, a modified win should basically mean that you were unable to wipe the board in the allotted time period. Granting the final point to a confirmed victory basically.

As it would apply to your situation, you would have had 2 wins and 3 draws (because they were within 12 points), giving you 12 points. The 4-1 folks, assuming they completed every game would have 16 points. When it is phrased as 2 wins and 3 draws, this makes sense as your games were basically too close to call one way or another. Now, if you had 2 wins and 3 modified wins, you'd be at 17 points, still ahead of the 4-1 folks. You'd have to have all 5 games be modified wins before you're score would be lower than a 4 full win 1 loss player.

But where this system truly shines is when you're on the losing side of things. All too often a mod win/loss is decided by what round time is called. The previous turn one player was ahead, the next turn the other player is. Thus why i'm of the opinion that it shouldn't be a modified win and a full loss, rather a draw, and both players split the points. This extends to modified win/loss. At this point, you're clearly losing, but by sticking around and making your opponent work for the win, you're performing better than the guy at the next table that just tabled 200-0 10 minutes into the game. Your score should reflect that. Plus, if you end up losing by 13 points, you weren't far off from forcing the draw. Why should you be severely punished for being 1 point away from a draw and gaining 2 points?

It also has the benefit of every game being worth 4 points, so it makes it easy to double check the scores at the end of each round - it should always be divisible by 4.

I feel your pain I went to a tournament once went 4-0 but 2 were modified. Both games I had full health Corran against 1 health soontir with damaged cockpit and 3 health Han when time was called. Ended up being the only one to go undefeated but finished 4th out of 10th.

Thank you, should be fixed now.

I'm saying the system is broken or should be changed or anything.

Going by context, I think you accidentally said the exact opposite of what you meant...

Modified wins are still wins and doesn't record supercede MOV?

I don't see how 2 wins and 3 modified wins is worth less than someone with 4 full wins.

It´s pretty simple

Full wins are worth 5 pts.

Modified Wins are worth 3.

4x5+1x0=20

3x3+2x5=19

Which is exactly what happened. Again I'm not asking for changes or anything, I got greedy in one game and took an unnecessary risk with Tycho. That's on me. Just sharing a story.

hm.. I can see where that IS unsatisfying, but..

the system is fine as it is, IMHO.

a mod.win is basically a draw, with just a TINY amount of plus on one side.

so it's quite okay that a full.win and a mod.win are 2 points apart.

having been handed a 2nd place yesterday I can understand your point of view, but as you say yourself: it's venting frustration ATM. it should lift pretty soon and you'll see that as okay, too - I guess.

that said: I had a blast yesterday and am eager to play some more xwing - quite a different situation from ANY OTHER GAME I had tournaments in. the great crowd of people surely plays into that.

I can't think of any system that would work better without major re-adjusting anywhere, so I think we're in a pretty good place, concering tournaments.

seeing that things in the game are pretty balanced as well, it is really a good time to be playing X-Wing :-)

I'm not sure how the modified wins thing works, but I went 3-0 at my last tournament and got second place to another 3-0 who had a better points margin. It was seriously like 180-183. It was a weird situation where the tournament only started with 5 players and one dropped out at the beginning of the second round. The two 1-1 players had played each other the first round, so they couldn't play each other again and me and the other 2-0 guy couldn't play for the win.

I'm not sure how the modified wins thing works, but I went 3-0 at my last tournament and got second place to another 3-0 who had a better points margin. It was seriously like 180-183. It was a weird situation where the tournament only started with 5 players and one dropped out at the beginning of the second round. The two 1-1 players had played each other the first round, so they couldn't play each other again and me and the other 2-0 guy couldn't play for the win.

Margin of Victory is not the Victory Points. Victory Points is essentially your win/loss record. Modified wins are essentially timed wins where you don't kill 12 or more points than your opponent. Margin of Victory is the primary tiebreaker, since you need something to determine rankings with the same amount of victory points.

What is this "win" thing you all keep speaking of?

What is this "win" thing you all keep speaking of?

having a good game of xwing = win. 2 winners, actually

(only that one gets more points than the other^^)

4 points = Full win > 33pts, or all opponent ships are dead

3 points = Mod win 13-33pts

2 points = Draw, within 12 points

1 point = Mod loss 13-33pts

0 points = Full loss >33pts

I'd be open to the idea of reducing that to 6 or something since the case could easily be made that an Academy Pilot doesn't stand a chance against a Rookie Pilot in a 1on1 situation, and that's only 9 points differential.

I'd say it needs to be less than the cheapest ship. It would be unfair to kill a tie, have your opponent kill nothing and get a draw out of it.

While I generally like the system, the one thing I don't like is that the loser gets nothing for a Modified Loss. Maybe make it so a Draw is 2 points and a Modified Loss is 1 point.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. They need to move to a 4 point system, and revert to a mod win being 33 points, and put the draw at 12 points.

4 points = Full win > 33pts, or all opponent ships are dead

3 points = Mod win 13-33pts

2 points = Draw, within 12 points

1 point = Mod loss 13-33pts

0 points = Full loss >33pts

This way, every game is worth 4 points. Furthermore, how often does someone get the mod win not because it's 5 ties vs 4 ties, but because he has 49pt Horn and his opponent has 48pt Horn (or something similar), where it still is really a toss up between the two. Therefore, the "draw" is expanded from exact point match to being within the 12 point range of a "basic ship." I'd be open to the idea of reducing that to 6 or something since the case could easily be made that an Academy Pilot doesn't stand a chance against a Rookie Pilot in a 1on1 situation, and that's only 9 points differential. And then the modified win goes out to 33 points as it originally did, indicating that you were ahead, but not by an unrecoverable amount. With the rounds extended to 75 minutes these days, a modified win should basically mean that you were unable to wipe the board in the allotted time period. Granting the final point to a confirmed victory basically.

As it would apply to your situation, you would have had 2 wins and 3 draws (because they were within 12 points), giving you 12 points. The 4-1 folks, assuming they completed every game would have 16 points. When it is phrased as 2 wins and 3 draws, this makes sense as your games were basically too close to call one way or another. Now, if you had 2 wins and 3 modified wins, you'd be at 17 points, still ahead of the 4-1 folks. You'd have to have all 5 games be modified wins before you're score would be lower than a 4 full win 1 loss player.

But where this system truly shines is when you're on the losing side of things. All too often a mod win/loss is decided by what round time is called. The previous turn one player was ahead, the next turn the other player is. Thus why i'm of the opinion that it shouldn't be a modified win and a full loss, rather a draw, and both players split the points. This extends to modified win/loss. At this point, you're clearly losing, but by sticking around and making your opponent work for the win, you're performing better than the guy at the next table that just tabled 200-0 10 minutes into the game. Your score should reflect that. Plus, if you end up losing by 13 points, you weren't far off from forcing the draw. Why should you be severely punished for being 1 point away from a draw and gaining 2 points?

It also has the benefit of every game being worth 4 points, so it makes it easy to double check the scores at the end of each round - it should always be divisible by 4.

Ahh, not a fan of TIE Swarms in the meta, I see.

We did the 33 pts for a Full Win before. God help if a TIE Swarm was paired with a TIE Swarm.