Hi! I'm playing a league. I have Soontir PTL, AT, SD, Title; Whisper, VI, FCS, ACD and Intelligente Agent; and Omega Ace with PTL.

This week I face this list:

PILOTS

Torkhil Mux (25)
HWK-290 (19), Twin Laser Turret (6)

Black Sun Soldier (15) x 5
Z-95 Headhunter (13), Feedback Array (2)

What can I do to beat them??

Check out this thread: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/182857-feast-of-crows-%E2%80%93-2015-dallas-regionals-battle-report/

It is written by a person running this list. Also shows how to best deal with it.

You have been 'hard-countered'. That list is designed specifically to defeat your type of list.

Your best chance of victory is to preserve Soontir Fel. You cannot save Whisper, so you might as well except her loss and try to deal as much damage with her before she bites it. In order to keep Soontir alive, you need to identify the biggest threat to the baron----I would say that it is all the feedback arrays. Soontir cannot be harmed by a single twin laser turret, so Torkhil vs Soontir is an easy win for you. Therefore, try to get that endgame scenario by destroying all the z-95s. With focussed fire, its possible to destroy 1 z-95 per turn (although that's only realistically going to happen in the first turn---after that, you'll be taking opportunity shots and trying like hell to keep Soontir outside of feedback zones). Don't worry if whisper or omega ace get hit by feedback----in fact, its not a bad idea to encourage it. Since both are going to die, tempting your opponent to use feedback to kill them makes it easier for Soontir to kill that z-95 later.

Its an uphill battle for you, but if you pull off a win, it will be very satisfying. Good luck!

you'll need to play hit&run. I'd personally kill Torkil first and then use asteroids + unexpected moves (decloack forward + k-turn) to avoid R1 engagements.

Or just kill Torkil and go to time. Imo when you fight against a hard counter there is no shame in playing extra safe...

you'll need to play hit&run. I'd personally kill Torkil first and then use asteroids + unexpected moves (decloack forward + k-turn) to avoid R1 engagements.

Or just kill Torkil and go to time. Imo when you fight against a hard counter there is no shame in playing extra safe...

That is what I was thinking. I can set up after him so turn 0 will be crutial. Any thoughts?

Bring big rocks and make a cluster in the middle. Your ships are really fast: Soontir can 5 forward + boost and whisper can get away from any bank 3 by decloack to a side + hard 1 and BR. It shouldn't be hard to kill Mux by turn 2, after that just split Soontir + Omega on one side and Phantom on the other. After Zs commt to one vector make those ships fly looong and away (give yourself an extra green die by having a rock in between) while the rest of your fleet end them from behind.

makes sense?

Makes a lot of sense. The hard thing will be to kill the HWK, and I mean getting into range 3 of him and only him. Then, the runaway is hard though. Ill do my best!

Makes a lot of sense. The hard thing will be to kill the HWK, and I mean getting into range 3 of him and only him. Then, the runaway is hard though. Ill do my best!

I don't think going after Mux first is a good idea.

If your opponent is smart, he will deploy the HWK in behind the z-95s. The only way you will get range 3 on it is if you are in R1 of the z-95s and then you get feedbacked to death. At least that's how I'd play that particular list.

If your opponent doesn't play it smart, then yeah, you can win if he over commits too early. However, to guarantee your victory (regardless of whether its a good or bad player), I strongly suggest killing off the z-95s first. Once he's down to just 2 or 3, he has no chance of winning, because Soontir Fel cannot be harmed by a single twin laser turret and can easily play keep away against a couple of ships.

Also, flying fast and aggressive with Soontir can run you into trouble. If you 5 straight, your opponent will react and head for Soontir. Then you risk getting caught in feedback range. I think it would be better to slow roll your ships with Soontir on one Flank and the other two together on the other flank. Once your opponent commits to one direction, you know who he wants to kill first and then you can develop a counter plan...

That's how I would approach it. Good luck in any event!

Makes a lot of sense. The hard thing will be to kill the HWK, and I mean getting into range 3 of him and only him. Then, the runaway is hard though. Ill do my best!

I don't think going after Mux first is a good idea.

If your opponent is smart, he will deploy the HWK in behind the z-95s. The only way you will get range 3 on it is if you are in R1 of the z-95s and then you get feedbacked to death. At least that's how I'd play that particular list.

If your opponent doesn't play it smart, then yeah, you can win if he over commits too early. However, to guarantee your victory (regardless of whether its a good or bad player), I strongly suggest killing off the z-95s first. Once he's down to just 2 or 3, he has no chance of winning, because Soontir Fel cannot be harmed by a single twin laser turret and can easily play keep away against a couple of ships.

Also, flying fast and aggressive with Soontir can run you into trouble. If you 5 straight, your opponent will react and head for Soontir. Then you risk getting caught in feedback range. I think it would be better to slow roll your ships with Soontir on one Flank and the other two together on the other flank. Once your opponent commits to one direction, you know who he wants to kill first and then you can develop a counter plan...

That's how I would approach it. Good luck in any event!

In my mind it's the classic setting of each player in opposite corners and big rocks in the middle, what you describe is more of a joust, attack from behind with either Soontir or Whisper and it will be fine imo.

In my mind it's the classic setting of each player in opposite corners and big rocks in the middle, what you describe is more of a joust, attack from behind with either Soontir or Whisper and it will be fine imo.

Joust is not what I meant at all. I'm not sure I could describe it better without pictures...oh well.

You know where the Z's are going thanks to the IA, use that to decide wether or not to decloak with Whisper. It's more important to stay out of range 1 and preferably out of arc. Be willing to sacrifice first the TIE F/O and then Whisper.

Take your time, this match is decided during the planning phase.

Wow, a lot of things to keep in mind.

I need to be in range 2 to use the IA. Range 2 of the Z's will be Range 2 of the HWK so pretty much PS drop down to 0.

I think stay away in range 3 all the time should be my option, right?

Wow, a lot of things to keep in mind.

I need to be in range 2 to use the IA. Range 2 of the Z's will be Range 2 of the HWK so pretty much PS drop down to 0.

I think stay away in range 3 all the time should be my option, right?

Intel agent is useless in this matchup because all of the enemies have lower PS than all of your ships (they will be moving before you move anyway, and you should already have an idea where they are going before Whisper decloaks). So don't worry about getting into R2 per se.

Also don't fly all your ships in formation. Keep them spread out and try to force your opponent into an error. I like using Fel as bait for that if he's off by himself the opponent might be tempted to go after him, and he is the best kiting ship in the game.

But if he doesn't take the bait, In one round of shooting, Whisper, Fel and Omega Ace all hitting the same z-95 should be able to kill it before it fires. Now there are only 4 left. Next turn, Whisper should be able to decloak away from the blob of enemies to stay out of range 1 of the z-95s, and between her and possibly one of your other ships, should be able to put some damage on another z-95. She should get one more shot at least before dying (hopefully), but that's the most you can expect from Whisper. Once Mux drops her to PS0 she's basically toast----its just a matter of how many of the opponent's attacks it takes to finish her off. So as I said before, don't try too hard with tricksy flying to keep her alive, because if you are trying to get fancy with her, it means you are likely denying her shots. Meanwhile, omega Ace and Fel can kill another z-95. Once there are 3 left, its still a bit tricky, because you don't want Fel to get close, so tricksy flying on his part is definitely recommended. Eventually, taking opportunity shots on z-95s will take out a third (although omega ace might be dead by this point, depends). Fel vs 2 z-95s and Mux is winnable. You just have to kill either Mux or the two z-95s and you win on points. See, Fel doesn't care if he's PS 0----his firepower is still greater than a z-95 and as long as you have at least 2 tokens and stealth and autothrusters, then one Twin Laser turret alone cannot push damage through his defenses.

Thank you very much!!!

So I'll try to keep Soontir away on the first couple of turns, and meanwhile try to get down Zs with Whisper and Omega. Then, involve Soontir into the fight.

Thanks!

Thank you very much!!!

So I'll try to keep Soontir away on the first couple of turns, and meanwhile try to get down Zs with Whisper and Omega. Then, involve Soontir into the fight.

Thanks!

That's not exactly what I meant. Just keep Soontir out of feedback range (and firing arcs of multiple ships if you can swing it). If he's out of arc, he can still get shots just fine at the same time as the rest of your list...

Ok, got it. But I also need to keep him out of range 2 of the HWK so he can shoot first, in case he is inside firing arc of the HWK.

Ok, got it. But I also need to keep him out of range 2 of the HWK so he can shoot first, in case he is inside firing arc of the HWK.

Keeping out of firing arc, yes. Good idea!

Keeping out of range 2 all game? Probably not feasible, but no worries as long as you have autothrusters and 1 or 2 defensive tokens...

Hi! I'm playing a league. I have Soontir PTL, AT, SD, Title; Whisper, VI, FCS, ACD and Intelligente Agent; and Omega Ace with PTL.

This week I face this list:

PILOTS

Torkhil Mux (25)

HWK-290 (19), Twin Laser Turret (6)

Black Sun Soldier (15) x 5

Z-95 Headhunter (13), Feedback Array (2)

What can I do to beat them??

What another poster above said about being hard countered. Once the Phantom came out, the game was broken. FFG then decided to make a bunch of stuff on the level of the OP broken stuff, specifically the phantom, before they decided to just nerf the **** thing. So Torkil Mux was created as a way to nuancelessly autowin against a Phantom.

So we have 2 solutions:

1.)Keep flying your list and just deal with the hard counter matchup. Try and make sure your first engagement is at range 3, this will guarantee no damage for you, and probably some for your opponent. Try and focus one thing down. Whatever you do, do not get within range one of multiple Feedback Z's. With Whisper's dumb candy cane maneuvers and Soontir's hypermobility, this should not be a problem.

2.) Win in the list building phase yourself. 40 Point Whisper, 4 Black Squadron TIEs with Crackshot. You'll have PS and too many ships to just "lol ya dead. Feedback"

But I cant change the list, we are playing a locked list league.