I had a couple interesting issues come up the other day. I was playing some rounds of skirmish with a friend and we had two interesting interactions.

1. Vader gains 4 movement points for his first action and moves 1 space so that he can get in range to Force Lightning Luke. Vader spends his 2nd action on Force Lightning. Is it possible for Vader to then use To the Limit to gain a third action and then use the rest of his movement points before using his 3rd action to attack? Or, does Vader have to instantly use his 3rd action and then become Stunned as per To the Limit?

(I feel like he has to spend the action immediately but I don't believe the word "after" is really defined anywhere in the rules.)

2. IG-88 declares an attack on Gideon who has 1 damage remaining until defeat and there are no Command Cards left to discard. Gideon is defeated when IG-88 declares his attack. Does he still get to roll his dice for the purpose of recovering? I can't find anything in the rules about cancelling an attack after it has been declared but I feel like you shouldn't be able to do this.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Off the cuff gut thoughts:

1) Using movement points isn't an action, so I see no reason why you could not spend the remaining movement points before you resolve the additional action granted by To The Limit. However, if you resolved the extra action, you would then be stunned and could not move.

2) Your defender is no longer on the board at the start of Step 1: Declare Target, so it would stand to reason that the attack ends there since there is no longer a defender. Because you no longer have a valid target to proceed to Step 2: Roll Dice, the attack is lost, and you may not bowl for surges to try to recover with no defender.

"Interrupt", RRG, Page 19:

If an interrupt makes the current action or ability invalid, that effect is not resolved. Any costs used to resolve that effect are still paid.

For example, if a player plays a Command card that allows it to attack a figure, and the figure interrupts to move out of line of sight, the Command card is discarded and the action spent on the attack is lost.

"Defeated", RRG, Page 10:

When a figure has a number of damage tokens equal to its Health, the figure is defeated.

When a hero is defeated... <omitted for skirmish ruling>...

-- When any other figure is defeated, it is removed from the map along with any of its condition and damage tokens.

I definitely agree with your point #2 and you definitely cited the rules I was looking for.

I'm curious about point #1. I sent an e-mail to FFG.

I definitely agree with your point #2 and you definitely cited the rules I was looking for.

I'm curious about point #1. I sent an e-mail to FFG.

That would be the way to go. I am pretty spot on most of the time, but even Fizz has his off days....

It has been clarified before. As soon as the To the Limit action has been resolved, the model becomes stunned, so it would be impossible to move the remaining movement points after To the Limit action.

But what he's talking about using his 3 remaining movement points after playing To The Limit but before resolving another action.

It has been clarified before. As soon as the To the Limit action has been resolved, the model becomes stunned, so it would be impossible to move the remaining movement points after To the Limit action.

Yeah Fizz has it right, I completely understand that you are basically instantly stunned after your To the Limit action but I want to know if there's any sort of exploitable gap (one where remaining movement points can be spent) between performing a special action and then performing the To the Limit action.

My thought is that To the Limit lets you perform an additional action right away, as opposed to gaining an action.

Very interested to hear how FFG responds.

It has been clarified before. As soon as the To the Limit action has been resolved, the model becomes stunned, so it would be impossible to move the remaining movement points after To the Limit action.

Yeah Fizz has it right, I completely understand that you are basically instantly stunned after your To the Limit action but I want to know if there's any sort of exploitable gap (one where remaining movement points can be spent) between performing a special action and then performing the To the Limit action.

Don't think so.

I got an official response from Paul which I think answers both questions in the way that I believe they should be answered.

OK, so after To The Limit is played, there is no gap. But, does that mean you can exploit a different gap like this:

1. Activate
2. Action 1: Move Action, gain movement points
3. Move one space
4. Play ╔► Force Lightning
5. Move three spaces
6. Play ╔► To The Limit (it doesn't say "immediately after", it says "after you resolve a ╔► during your activation")
7. Resolve 3rd action
8. Become Stunned.
9. End
   

References:

"Activation", RRG, Page 3:

Abilities that trigger “during” a figure’s activation are used before or after either of that figure’s two actions.

"Abilities", RRG, Page 2:

An ability that can be used “during your activation” can be used before or after performing an action during an activation. It cannot be used while resolving an action.

"Command Cards", SG, Page 5:

A player can play each Command card when specified on that card. To play the card, he reveals it to his opponent, resolves its ability, and then discards the card.

This here is basically what makes the ruling. Once you play the card, you have to resolve it. *But*, if you move those last three spaces BEFORE you play it, this seems legal to me.

OK, so after To The Limit is played, there is no gap. But, does that mean you can exploit a different gap like this:

• Activate
• Action 1: Move Action, gain movement points
• Move one space
• Play ┌► Force Lightning
• Move three spaces
• Play ┌► To The Limit (it doesn't say "immediately after", it says "after you resolve a ┌► during your activation")
• Resolve 3rd action
• Become Stunned.
• End

References:

"Activation", RRG, Page 3:

Abilities that trigger “during” a figure’s activation are used before or after either of that figure’s two actions.

"Abilities", RRG, Page 2:

An ability that can be used “during your activation” can be used before or after performing an action during an activation. It cannot be used while resolving an action.

"Command Cards", SG, Page 5:

A player can play each Command card when specified on that card. To play the card, he reveals it to his opponent, resolves its ability, and then discards the card.

This here is basically what makes the ruling. Once you play the card, you have to resolve it. *But*, if you move those last three spaces BEFORE you play it, this seems legal to me.

Oh man, another rules question to send in. I think you may be right. I mentioned before the rules don't really specify what "after" means unlike Armada where it's clearly defined to mean immediately after the triggering event.

Well, based on the rules quoted, the two triggers are:

• After you resolve a ╔►.
• During your activation.

Off the top of my head, I cannot think of any situations where you would be using a ╔► while it is not your activation. Otherwise, why would it specify "during your activation" unless they were planning for the future?

Well, based on the rules quoted, the two triggers are:

• After you resolve a ╔►.
• During your activation.

Off the top of my head, I cannot think of any situations where you would be using a ╔► while it is not your activation. Otherwise, why would it specify "during your activation" unless they were planning for the future?

Except, Fizz, I believe the intent was "after you resolve" was immediately after you resolve. Else, by your logic, one could do it any time after one's first action until the end of the game. I do recall that there was a ruling on something similar to this where "after" meant "immediately after" but I am too lazy to look through all the old rulings handed down from above.

So, in short, I am more comfortable with no moving or anything else between actions there. Oh, I just considered this: what of cleave? Surely you would not like people to spend movement points before it happens because cleave happens after an attack is resolved (and if you did damage).

daa

No, my logic doesn't say "to the end of the game". In the case of "To The Limit", it says "During your Activation", so "after" in this case has a defined end point, that activation, not every time that figure activates in the future. Once begin another activation, you have to create the trigger again to play the card.

And Cleave does not say "after the attack", because Cleave states that the damage occurs once the trigger has been met, which is Step 7: Calculate Damage. Once the damage has been dealt, you choose another legal target for the attack. If you were to move, you would lose the point of reference to where the attacker could make a legal attack.

Discussion on my end is just curiosity and an exercise in logic, I enjoy finding timing loopholes (and closing them).

Paul has clarified before that To the Limit must be played immediately after the Special Action has been resolved, so there is no loop hole Fizz.

Here is his answer to me in an email that was asked regarding this on a different subject here on the forum.

Hi Jesper,

“To the Limit” must be played immediately after the special action is performed, so your Scenario 1 would not be legal.

Thanks!

Paul Winchester

Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

Perfect.