When OL play Controlled Power - he must spend as many surges as possible.

Is it possible that he can use surge to remove fatigue token from my hero?

Indeed, he must do that if he has an available surge not yet spent. BUT, he can spend the surges on any order he prefers, so, if the hero is not exhausted, OL can waste the first surge to non-recover a fatigue, and then use the remaining surge(s) to fatigue him. Or if the hero was already full of fatigue, OL can first force to suffer a fatigue, wich in exchange makes into damage, and then , recover a fatigue with the next surge.

Indeed, he must do that if he has an available surge not yet spent. BUT, he can spend the surges on any order he prefers, so, if the hero is not exhausted, OL can waste the first surge to non-recover a fatigue, and then use the remaining surge(s) to fatigue him. Or if the hero was already full of fatigue, OL can first force to suffer a fatigue, wich in exchange makes into damage, and then , recover a fatigue with the next surge.

While you're correct that he has to spend all surges, I'm not sure I agree as far as timing. It's still the hero's turn- wouldn't he get to deterimine the order in which the surges took effect, since they all happen at the same time?

Do surges happen all at the same time? I've always played it that surges happen one by one, in the order of the person spending the surges.

That seems to make sense to me with the way you spend surges for +range before spending any others to make sure an attack hits.

I think the surges for range is different because its sort of spent before step 4. I've always thought about surges occurring all "at the same time," but in a specific order because the active player (usually the attacker) is making that happen via golden rule.

I can see arguments for the hero determining the order but we always played the OL got to select the order.

One more interesting question is if the OL says the surge is for something like move the monster who gets to determine how to move the monster.

I can see arguments for the hero determining the order but we always played the OL got to select the order.

One more interesting question is if the OL says the surge is for something like move the monster who gets to determine how to move the monster.

I'm not aware of a particular ruling on this point, but I'd think it would be the hero. The OL gets to choose "how the hero spends his surge results," but the hero still spends his surge results. That is, the OL gets to determine what the surges must be spent on. The hero still does the actual spending. The OL is not "controlling the hero" as he might for a Dark Charm.

I think the surges for range is different because its sort of spent before step 4. I've always thought about surges occurring all "at the same time," but in a specific order because the active player (usually the attacker) is making that happen via golden rule.

Is there a ruling on this one? For instance, there are times when I have a Runemaster attack with no stamina on him, and he then gets two surges. He spends one on Runic Knowledge to buff his damage, suffering one fatigue, and then uses his second surge to recover that fatigue. Is this wrong?

I may have an apology to make to my current OL if I'm been doing this one wrong for so long.

I think the surges for range is different because its sort of spent before step 4. I've always thought about surges occurring all "at the same time," but in a specific order because the active player (usually the attacker) is making that happen via golden rule.

Is there a ruling on this one? For instance, there are times when I have a Runemaster attack with no stamina on him, and he then gets two surges. He spends one on Runic Knowledge to buff his damage, suffering one fatigue, and then uses his second surge to recover that fatigue. Is this wrong?

I may have an apology to make to my current OL if I'm been doing this one wrong for so long.

There's not a specific ruling on it that I'm aware of. Which part you you mean, specifically? I'm not sure if there's a ruling on any of it, but I can submit a question.

Don't know why I was so sure about surges being sequential, not simultaneous. If there ever was any official response about it, I can't remember, but I could totally be wrong about it. Not much a game change, but in this case (Uncontrolled Power), could make a slight difference. Would be glad if you bring the current position from FFG, Zalt.

I've just thought on another possible issue with surge timing. Imagine a hero with the crossbow, hiting an enemy 1 heart away of dying. Imagine for simplicity that the damage dealt was lower that the defense results. The hero moves the monster over a lava pool, thus, causing it one damage, and killing it. But the attack got another surge, and the hero wanted to recover fatigue from the surge. You can say that the hero would always choose to recover first, but, what if the attack was made during the OL's turn, with First Strike, for example? Could it be that, being something simultaneos, and happening during OL's turn, would he (OL) decide the order?

... what if the attack was made during the OL's turn, with First Strike, for example? Could it be that, being something simultaneos, and happening during OL's turn, would he (OL) decide the order?

Yup, that is a real thing, and part of the reason for the question. Our group was actually playing last night, and a situation occurred with Trenloe being knocked back into the lava, defeating him, and he wanted to trigger "Stalwart," but Stalwart walked him back through the lava to make an attack. It was rather amusing.

EDIT: Got a response! Looks like the correct answer is somewhere in the middle of what we thought.

Ah, good to know. From my reading of this, it sounds like surges do not happen all at the same time, but one at a time in the order of the spender's choice.

Ah, good to know. From my reading of this, it sounds like surges do not happen all at the same time, but one at a time in the order of the spender's choice.

And knowing that surges happen in order, another relevant tidbit- the target space does not move during an attack, even if the target figure moves. That is, if you happen to be a runemaster with a crossbow, and you use "exploding rune," the spaces affected by blast will be those adjacent to the space you measure range and LOS to, not adjacent to where the figure is when you move him with the surge.

Interesting info. So do we know who moves the monster when the OL spends the surges?

Interesting info. So do we know who moves the monster when the OL spends the surges?

It was not in the answer to the question, but I would say it's still the hero who gets to do that. Again, the OL isn't controlling anything but how the hero spends the surges.

Another pertinent question about uncontroled power:

I was playing with the OL Enchanter deck and I opted to maximize defensive skills with the help of Alric plot deck. So, I managed to pick my 1st exp bought card - Elixir of stone (Enchanter I). That card instances that the whole group of monsters has guaranteed one shield when attacked, keeping the card at the play area for the remaining of the encounter. However, a player may spend his surges (2 of them) to force the OL to discard the card from the play area.

Here comes the question: Uncontroled power says I must play the card after dices are rolled. So, after I make my defense roll and notice the 2 surges rolled, must I declare the using of Uncontroled power at this time, or could I wait the player announce he is willing use the surges to make me discard the Elixir of stone, and only then play the card frustrating this plans? Thats make a huge difference, since sometimes heroes just forget these details and I would save me an Uncontroled power for later use.

"After dice are rolled" is RIGHT AFTER dice are rolled, meaning before moving on to step 4, before spending surges. Likewise, a hero player cannot wait to be sure you are not playing "uncontrolled power" before he exhausts a card to add a surge to the results.