I mean, not that dropping a horizontally fired torpedo down a vertical shaft 100s of meters long into a completely unprotected power core makes all kinds of sense either~

Thats not a point of information that has deep implication in the overall lore. Its not driving of the story beyond being classic "weak point". As far as i know, there was no novels made to explain why that worked.

The Rule of Two? The trillions of credits required to build the Clone army? Those do have storywise implication. Theres a huge difference between a worldbuilding stupidity that needs patching, and a minor plot point stupidity that you gloss over.

Hell. People have spent longer explaining why Stormtroopers are such apparent bad shots, because the fact that they were good shots was actually a plot point established earlier in the movie, which had consequences to the overall plot and was part of the worldbuilding.

Just proves the degree of a *********** the Prequels were, if it requires that much of patchwork just to make the overall story make sense.

There are certainly many plot holes in the PT. The Rule of Two is not one of them. Through the lens of the movies - thus canon - there was no Rule of Two. So Yoda's line of "always two there are" is perfectly rational. In this case, it was the Darth Bane novels that caused the confusion.

Just proves the degree of a *********** the Prequels were, if it requires that much of patchwork just to make the overall story make sense.

There are certainly many plot holes in the PT. The Rule of Two is not one of them. Through the lens of the movies - thus canon - there was no Rule of Two. So Yoda's line of "always two there are" is perfectly rational. In this case, it was the Darth Bane novels that caused the confusion.

Wasnt that inspired by mention of the Rule of Two in the Episode 1 novelization? Werent that written based on noted from George Lucas?

I mean, not that dropping a horizontally fired torpedo down a vertical shaft 100s of meters long into a completely unprotected power core makes all kinds of sense either~

Thats not a point of information that has deep implication in the overall lore. Its not driving of the story beyond being classic "weak point". As far as i know, there was no novels made to explain why that worked.

The Rule of Two? The trillions of credits required to build the Clone army? Those do have storywise implication. Theres a huge difference between a worldbuilding stupidity that needs patching, and a minor plot point stupidity that you gloss over.

Hell. People have spent longer explaining why Stormtroopers are such apparent bad shots, because the fact that they were good shots was actually a plot point established earlier in the movie, which had consequences to the overall plot and was part of the worldbuilding.

Okay, we get that you hate the Prequels, but the constant bashing is getting a little old, IMO. Star Wars is inherently based on ridiculousness, and that's okay - it's space fantasy. It's meant to be that way.

To be honest, it's feeling a little like "this isn't how I wanted it, so it's objectively stupid". Plenty of people are perfectly fine with the Rule of Two - I am, I think it gives the Sith nuance and sets them apart from the Jedi - and the cost of the Clone Army isn't that big of a deal in the long run.

Wasn't that inspired by mention of the Rule of Two in the Episode 1 novelization? Werent that written based on noted from George Lucas?

I'm not sure. I never read the Episode I novel. The Movie novelizations are in a "maybe canon" state at the moment. If the Rule of Two was mentioned, that's fine too.

I think I missed my own point in my previous comment, and that's my fault. What I mean to say was, the Rule of Two could have been established even before the Sith went into hiding. The Jedi could be aware of if it.

Wasn't that inspired by mention of the Rule of Two in the Episode 1 novelization? Werent that written based on noted from George Lucas?

I'm not sure. I never read the Episode I novel. The Movie novelizations are in a "maybe canon" state at the moment. If the Rule of Two was mentioned, that's fine too.

I think I missed my own point in my previous comment, and that's my fault. What I mean to say was, the Rule of Two could have been established even before the Sith went into hiding. The Jedi could be aware of if it.

But thats one big point: Yoda's comment is completely meaningless. There was no consequences whatsoever to him pointing out there was another Sith. Thry did not find him (or even heard of his activities) during the next 10 years. And Obi-Wan/Windu acts incredulous when they learn the Darth Lord has infiltrated the Senate.

Nobody acts, reacts, or consider intelligently. Its just plot points thrown at the wall with no coherence or consequences.

Wasn't that inspired by mention of the Rule of Two in the Episode 1 novelization? Werent that written based on noted from George Lucas?

I'm not sure. I never read the Episode I novel. The Movie novelizations are in a "maybe canon" state at the moment. If the Rule of Two was mentioned, that's fine too.

I think I missed my own point in my previous comment, and that's my fault. What I mean to say was, the Rule of Two could have been established even before the Sith went into hiding. The Jedi could be aware of if it.

But thats one big point: Yoda's comment is completely meaningless. There was no consequences whatsoever to him pointing out there was another Sith. Thry did not find him (or even heard of his activities) during the next 10 years. And Obi-Wan/Windu acts incredulous when they learn the Darth Lord has infiltrated the Senate.

Nobody acts, reacts, or consider intelligently. Its just plot points thrown at the wall with no coherence or consequences.

That's the point of the Sith. You can't find them until they reveal themselves, and the fact that they didn't find anything reinforces that. Remember Maul's line in Episode I - "At last we will reveal ourselves to the Jedi..."? It's also clear from lines in both Episode II and III that the Jedi were clearly trying to find him, but couldn't. Sidious was EXTREMELY good at shrouding his actions and adapting when things didn't go his way, which is why no one could find him.

Also, that's the whole point of their existence post-Ruusan Reformation - both Jedi and Sith. The Jedi got stagnant, and the one Jedi who 'got it' - Qui-Gon - wasn't around to point it out. Anakin got it too, but he was a petulant child to most of the Jedi, so they dismissed him.

The Jedi in the PT weren't acting particularly intelligent, as was the point - they were desperate, backed into a corner. Qui-Gon knew what was up, but he was dead. Again, with space fantasy, there's certain things that are just accepted because fantasy doesn't always need nitty-gritty explanations. The White Council in LotR were just as stupid in not believing Gandalf when he talked about Sauron being back, but it works because it gives tension. Anakin was right about a lot of things, and it was meant to give nuance to his fall, but Lucas didn't portray that through dialogue very well, but the themes are there.

Even Obi-Wan had this idealized version of the Jedi/Republic because he followed them without question, for the most part. It's why he was such a poor Master for Anakin. Qui-Gon was the best fit for Anakin because they were both iconoclasts - but then, Qui-Gon had to die for the story to go forward. It's what Luke Skywalker is as a Jedi - modeled after Qui-Gon since Yoda adopted much of Qui-Gon's ideals post-Order 66 and he is in a lot of ways what his father would have been had he remained a Jedi.

The point i am making isnt necessarily that it doesnt make sense logically (it just took 200 novels to bend the logic so it does). The point is that it doesnt make sense structurally. As in: as part of an overall story being told.

It served no purpose in the grand scheme of things. Might have well took it out entirely, and the movies would have made as much sense, if not more.

Its like if you has this elaborate plot for your players, but the bad guy is so great a manipulator that your players never, ever find anything about him. And I hen at the end, theres a big reveal "mwahaha, it was ME". Thats a sh*tty story.

A " mystery" plot is made to be unraveled. Thats the entire point; be it a murder mystery (classic Holmes), a big conspiracy (a la Watchmen) or a spyfest (some James Bond).

But the Prequels never made good use of that mystery aspect they played up. It was just some useless flavor to the plot, served no purpose and went away only when Palpatine literally force fed the answer to Anakin.

Good lord. How about making a point that the Jedi were spread across the Galaxy searching for these Siths? Maybe thats what scattered them, making them vulnerable? Maybe some fell to the Dark Side in their search? How about some believing Dooku when he tells them he supports the Separatists because he believes the Sith have infiltrated the Republic?

How about DOING SOMETHING WIH IT?

But no. Instead, we have a cryptic remark made at the end of Episode 1, a complete anticlimactic reveal during Episode 3, and a huge lot of nothing in between that is only justified because the storyteller went full-fiat on our asses.

I recently wrote an alternate universe version of the prequels, in which the Jedi were a secret society, the clones were enemies of the Republic, and Palpatine and Anakin succumbed to the temptation to use the Force to "save" the Republic by squelching an inefficient democracy.

http://thezerolevel.com/cheapskates-secrets-of-the-force-replacing-the-prequels-with-something-better/

Another potential AU I've considered is: what would happen if Arvel Crynyd hadn't crashed his A-Wing into the bridge of the Executor? Maybe the Executor's battle group defeats the Rebels at the cost of the Death Star, and you wind up with virtually every main character either dead or presumed dead and the entire galaxy ruled by small-time warlords, with remnants of the Imperial and Rebel fleets working as mercenaries.

My group is working on a similar campaign concept though we haven't detailed exactly what happened and most of the main characters survive.

In ours the Imperial fleet at Endor fights to the last ship so the rebels win but their fleet is so weakened that they are basically only able to secure a handful of worlds other then the ones they already control. The Empire fragments and the fragments start fighting, the CIS Holdouts come out of hiding and start securing chunks of space, the Mandalorians grab their sector and some space around it, various major criminal groups start carving out pocket kingdoms or expanding the ones they had. and the CSA and the various Imperial vassal states start moving to grab more power.

The current plan is for the players to be part of a privateer fleet hired by the rebellion to try and keep the other factions off balance while the Alliance rebuilds its forces.

.