Bossk is 4:1 against Bobba Fett for me. That 180 arc is pretty hard to get out of and I'm running Palob w/TLT + BG alongside Bossk. He strips Fetts evades/foci and bodyguard gives Bossk an extra evade. Bossk is all about his load out and his wingman. For my money Bossk gets more out of almost any wingman than the firespray!
I like that usage of Bodyguard, I don't see it used much but that is a very good combo.
Bossk is 4:1 against Bobba Fett for me. That 180 arc is pretty hard to get out of and I'm running Palob w/TLT + BG alongside Bossk. He strips Fetts evades/foci and bodyguard gives Bossk an extra evade. Bossk is all about his load out and his wingman. For my money Bossk gets more out of almost any wingman than the firespray!
I like that usage of Bodyguard, I don't see it used much but that is a very good combo.
Thanks! Can't take credit for coming up with running Palob with Bossk, but I decided to try him with bodyguard and it works really well. It just feels so awesome to steal someone's focus and then spend it to give Bossk an extra evade dice. Palob also forces opponents into certain actions, they tend to lose the ability to act defensively as their foci and evades get taken. Makes them more predictable and easier to focus down with Bossk and the TLT.
I can't get behind the argument of Firesprays being overpriced. That rear arch, awesome dial, evade, and 2 greens has to cost something. Base YV is 29 and the base Firespray is 33. Four points is buying a lot!
Except the base Scum Firespray is 35.
And the Scum version is PS 5 with an EPT and an Illicit. You're getting a lot for those 2 points.
You're getting very little for those points if you aren't taking upgrades. You're essentially paying 2 points for VI at a PS level that doesn't make much difference. The Imperial Firesprays are a high enough PS that they beat the cheap generics and are out of Predator extra dice range and the Scum ones still don't beat Aggressors.
Okay now I think I have a new tourney list to try out.
Mandalorian Mercenary (35)Recon Specialist (3)Trandoshan Slaver (29)Feedback Array (2)Trandoshan Slaver (29)Feedback Array (2)Total: 100This just feels mean. I used to run two Bounty Hunters and a Shuttle, this keeps the same sort of spirit. It's a lot of health.
I'd probably got with K4 instead of Recon Specialist as insurance against losing my actions because I'd be afraid that a lot of matches will end with a big scrum full of ships colliding.
Okay now I think I have a new tourney list to try out.
Mandalorian Mercenary (35)Recon Specialist (3)Trandoshan Slaver (29)Feedback Array (2)Trandoshan Slaver (29)Feedback Array (2)Total: 100This just feels mean. I used to run two Bounty Hunters and a Shuttle, this keeps the same sort of spirit. It's a lot of health.
I'd probably got with K4 instead of Recon Specialist as insurance against losing my actions because I'd be afraid that a lot of matches will end with a big scrum full of ships colliding.
In my opinion, 2- and 3-turns are a Firespray's best maneuvers. K4 is great if you're not being chased, but otherwise it opens you up to a world of pain (i.e. swarms and arc-dodgers) if you're doing a bunch of greens without EU.
I'd also be inclined to swap those Feedback Arrays for Tacticians or Outlaw Techs. With two Slavers, you can castle very easily even in the middle of the map. Feedbacks are going to be used rarely if ever at R1 rear 180 only.
I can't get behind the argument of Firesprays being overpriced. That rear arch, awesome dial, evade, and 2 greens has to cost something. Base YV is 29 and the base Firespray is 33. Four points is buying a lot!
Except the base Scum Firespray is 35.
And the Scum version is PS 5 with an EPT and an Illicit. You're getting a lot for those 2 points.
You're getting very little for those points if you aren't taking upgrades. You're essentially paying 2 points for VI at a PS level that doesn't make much difference. The Imperial Firesprays are a high enough PS that they beat the cheap generics and are out of Predator extra dice range and the Scum ones still don't beat Aggressors.
If you are not taking upgrades on Scum Firesprays, you should by flying Imperial Firesprays.
I disagree with you on not beating Aggressors. Firesprays, more so than any ship, can force Agressors into bad situations because of its front and rear fire arcs. While I don't tend to fly double Firesprays, I have and find it all too easy to exploit the front arch only limitation of the Agressor. Kath, in particular, eats Agressors for breakfast.
My Kath and 2 Blacksun Enforcers build has never lost to a Brobots build and has faced that list more than any other.
Want to really give Brobots a hissyfit? A Scum Firespray with Expert Handling (and K4) is nearly impossible to avoid and provides lots of great R1 shots. This is brutal with Kath out the rear arch!
If you are not taking upgrades on Scum Firesprays, you should by flying Imperial Firesprays.And the Scum version is PS 5 with an EPT and an Illicit. You're getting a lot for those 2 points.I can't get behind the argument of Firesprays being overpriced. That rear arch, awesome dial, evade, and 2 greens has to cost something. Base YV is 29 and the base Firespray is 33. Four points is buying a lot!
Except the base Scum Firespray is 35.
You're getting very little for those points if you aren't taking upgrades. You're essentially paying 2 points for VI at a PS level that doesn't make much difference. The Imperial Firesprays are a high enough PS that they beat the cheap generics and are out of Predator extra dice range and the Scum ones still don't beat Aggressors.
I disagree with you on not beating Aggressors. Firesprays, more so than any ship, can force Agressors into bad situations because of its front and rear fire arcs. While I don't tend to fly double Firesprays, I have and find it all too easy to exploit the front arch only limitation of the Agressor. Kath, in particular, eats Agressors for breakfast.
My Kath and 2 Blacksun Enforcers build has never lost to a Brobots build and has faced that list more than any other.
Want to really give Brobots a hissyfit? A Scum Firespray with Expert Handling (and K4) is nearly impossible to avoid and provides lots of great R1 shots. This is brutal with Kath out the rear arch!
Bossk and 2 TLT Y has smashed Brobots for me, never lost to them either.
Point of pedantry regarding the arcs:
YV-666 has a 180 degree arc. The Firespray has two 80 degree arcs (roughly) which is 160 degrees. However, due to the two additional edges of arc I believe the firespray ends up with more coverage.
Point of pedantry regarding the arcs:
YV-666 has a 180 degree arc. The Firespray has two 80 degree arcs (roughly) which is 160 degrees. However, due to the two additional edges of arc I believe the firespray ends up with more coverage.
Point of even greater pedantry: the YV doesn't have a 180-degree arc, but rather a single primary arc at approximately 80 degrees and two auxiliary arcs of approximately 50 degrees each.
Point of pedantry regarding the arcs:
YV-666 has a 180 degree arc. The Firespray has two 80 degree arcs (roughly) which is 160 degrees. However, due to the two additional edges of arc I believe the firespray ends up with more coverage.
Point of even greater pedantry: the YV doesn't have a 180-degree arc, but rather a single primary arc at approximately 80 degrees and two auxiliary arcs of approximately 50 degrees each.
Because I heard that you like pedantry, the ships you are referring to are actually the YV-666 and the Firespray-31 and not the YV and Firespray. That distinction may not be important now but you never know when FFG might introduce one of the other YV models or include a Firespray DL-87 (or even a CS-33 for that matter) Stun Rifle.
Edited by WWHSD
Point of pedantry regarding the arcs:
YV-666 has a 180 degree arc. The Firespray has two 80 degree arcs (roughly) which is 160 degrees. However, due to the two additional edges of arc I believe the firespray ends up with more coverage.
Point of even greater pedantry: the YV doesn't have a 180-degree arc, but rather a single primary arc at approximately 80 degrees and two auxiliary arcs of approximately 50 degrees each.
On topic: Do forum users think the greater coverage of the Firespray's arc is significant when comparing the ships?
Off topic: From FAQ: Outmaneuver '...The auxiliary firing arc of the Firespray-31 is a firing arc'. Your comment is a granular (and obvious) observation of the arcs make up. Your input is appreciated: no stone unturned etc. However I was hoping to enlighten those, including OP, who had not realised the arcs were different in angle AND coverage.
Interestingly The YV-666 is not mentioned specifically in the Outmaneuver card's section but I would read this as an example of a aux arc rather than a reason the ignore the YV's.
Edited by ScaredOfCrows
Point of pedantry regarding the arcs:
YV-666 has a 180 degree arc. The Firespray has two 80 degree arcs (roughly) which is 160 degrees. However, due to the two additional edges of arc I believe the firespray ends up with more coverage.
Point of even greater pedantry: the YV doesn't have a 180-degree arc, but rather a single primary arc at approximately 80 degrees and two auxiliary arcs of approximately 50 degrees each.
On topic: Do forum users think the greater coverage of the Firespray's arc is significant when comparing the ships?
Off topic: From FAQ: Outmaneuver '...The auxiliary firing arc of the Firespray-31 is a firing arc'. Your comment is a granular (and obvious) observation of the arcs make up. Your input is appreciated: no stone unturned etc. However I was hoping to enlighten those, including OP, who had not realised the arcs were different in angle AND coverage.
Interestingly The YV-666 is not mentioned specifically in the Outmaneuver card's section but I would read this as an example of a aux arc rather than a reason the ignore the YV's.
The text in the Outmaneuver FAQ is explaining that Auxiliary and Primary arcs both count as arcs and that if something needs the Primary arc it will come out an say so. The Firespray is only being used as an example.
Edited by WWHSDSlavers are interesting, and they have the same problem as Firesprays: They're just that little bit squishier than I'd like for their points.
Of course, with Dengar coming, I would hate to see a Scum C3P0 show up and make everything fat... but given the two ships that could do with a little durability both have extended firing arcs, I wonder if something could be done there, perhaps...
It might be neat to see a defensive upgrade that only works when the attacker is in your arc. That would work well with both the Firespray and YV and it also has some synergy with Dengar's ability. If it isn't faction restricted, it might see some play on Shuttles and YT-2400s (without the title).
large bases do not need to be made fat in order to be viable. in fact, a lot of generics make some fairly funny anti-ace tech:
Darth Vader on shuttle/Deci
Bossk+Gunner on a slaver or K4 + HLC moralo
Int agent + anti pursuit on a Space Fringer
and the ORS...took slimfast and became a Warden Squadron Pilot (Conner nets!)
and soon, generic torpedo-boat pogosticks
Point of pedantry regarding the arcs:
YV-666 has a 180 degree arc. The Firespray has two 80 degree arcs (roughly) which is 160 degrees. However, due to the two additional edges of arc I believe the firespray ends up with more coverage.
Point of even greater pedantry: the YV doesn't have a 180-degree arc, but rather a single primary arc at approximately 80 degrees and two auxiliary arcs of approximately 50 degrees each.
On topic: Do forum users think the greater coverage of the Firespray's arc is significant when comparing the ships?
Off topic: From FAQ: Outmaneuver '...The auxiliary firing arc of the Firespray-31 is a firing arc'. Your comment is a granular (and obvious) observation of the arcs make up. Your input is appreciated: no stone unturned etc. However I was hoping to enlighten those, including OP, who had not realised the arcs were different in angle AND coverage.
Interestingly The YV-666 is not mentioned specifically in the Outmaneuver card's section but I would read this as an example of a aux arc rather than a reason the ignore the YV's.
The text in the Outmaneuver FAQ is explaining that Auxiliary and Primary arcs both count as arcs and that if something needs the Primary arc it will come out an say so. The Firespray is only being used as an example.
Violent reiterative agreement then!
Where is the love for the T-slaver Bossk?
I could have sworn that was going to be the go to build. Bossk + Gunner + Tactician is a nasty little combo that seems pretty **** efficient to me.
My biggest concern is watching people fly the 666. To me, this ship is screaming to be used exactly like a shuttle. As an edge of the board, slow turning creeper that takes the shots he can get and provide medium to long range fire + stress.
What I don't get is watching how many people set the ship up in the middle of the board. This is NOT a middle of the board ship people.
It's a slow turning bus that needs to start on the boards edge where it can maximize it's strengths (180arc) while protecting it's biggest weakness (backside fire). This isn't a 21 pt shuttle that you can afford to have missing combat rounds.
I've seen so many people fly this ship like it was some kind of high manuvering jouster and it makes me completely shake my head.
Re: Outlaw Techs or Tacticians on the Trandoshan Slaver...yes they're solid. I have no problem with them, but if I'm keeping the YV as cheap as possible, I want the Feedback Arrays. Tactician, Outlaw Tech, K4, any sort of Crew that works for firing at things, they work better in tandem than they do alone. And of course they only work in your firing arc. If I take a Slaver and stop it in the scrum, I want to be able to be effective regardless of what's in base contact or arc. I want to be able to block and fry an arc dodger without question. They have the health to burn down anything I want with Feedback Arrays alone, and that makes approaching them a much trickier prospect. That perception of threat is more valuable to me than greater action economy that still requires me to be pointed the right way. It's the Doomshuttle approach.
I think a PS 1 pilot for both generic and scum Firesprays would see a ton of play. Both are a touch out of reach to JUST fly naked. Imperial Firesprays may be up to 2pts overcosted and scum by at least 1. Imperials could get a up to a 4pt crew of choice and scum a 1pt EPT or illicit for only 35pts. That feels just right for me. Bonus: the Imperial Firespray 31 would cost 31pts...an error I made often in list building when it first cam out.
What is the most BROKEN thing you can think of with that reduction?
And the Scum version is PS 5 with an EPT and an Illicit. You're getting a lot for those 2 points.I can't get behind the argument of Firesprays being overpriced. That rear arch, awesome dial, evade, and 2 greens has to cost something. Base YV is 29 and the base Firespray is 33. Four points is buying a lot!
Except the base Scum Firespray is 35.
Not if you aren't filling those slots. I fly my Firesprays light. Generally just RecSpec or Tactician.
And the Scum version is PS 5 with an EPT and an Illicit. You're getting a lot for those 2 points.I can't get behind the argument of Firesprays being overpriced. That rear arch, awesome dial, evade, and 2 greens has to cost something. Base YV is 29 and the base Firespray is 33. Four points is buying a lot!
Except the base Scum Firespray is 35.
Not if you aren't filling those slots. I fly my Firesprays light. Generally just RecSpec or Tactician.
That's the way to do it, light and nimble. Don't stick to greens, don't be afraid to K-Turn, take hard 3 turns when you can best surprise someone, and the Firespray does good work.
Haven't been able to really break in the YV the same way yet but the "fly it like a Shuttle" approach works well.
