After just having the worst loss ever with a squad I've had over 40 games with, just reinforces my hatred towards whisper.

She was a borderline OP ship before the nerf, and still is after.

I pray that people continue to think the nerf is a hindrance and keep whisper as a rare sighting.

I LOVE Phantoms these days.

Of the 3 aces available to us (Vader, Fel, and Whisper), Whisper is the one capable of generating the most defense (Sensor Jammer + FFF through ability and Recon Spec, vs Fel's Autothruster + FFE through pilot ability and PTL), and Unlike Fel or Vader, still has 4 agility after being hit the first time.

TLTs don't make it through the defenses of any... alone.

What they do is strip away your defensive tokens, as 3R naked has the same expected value as 4G naked. If either of you roll on the "you are hit" side of the bell-curve, you lose a token to dodge.

TLTs get hard-countered by Sensor Jammers even moreso than you'd think, as a TLT naturally wants to Target Lock rather than Focus (Only the HWK gets any mileage out of a defensive focus, and the TL's ability to carry through multiple attack phases when unnecessary becomes hugely beneficial when "To Hit" is desired over "Raw Damage").

SJ convinces your opponent to use an action they normally wouldn't be taking, and even then they'll struggle.

Vs non-TLT lists, what counters the Phantom?

Fat Han (and Chirpy) recently received a metagame nerf, and will easily be driven below 1/2 HP.

Super Dash is still strong vs Phantom, but is weak vs TLT. Still, fairly popular to fly with a TLT Miranda.

Vader/Fel suffer vs the Phantom's 4 attack, and a practiced Phantomist is very difficult to predict properly, and therefore hard has heck to arc-dodge.

The Connor's Net seems to be the Bomb Supreme, but it's not really the one that the Phantom fears most. You can decloak while Ioned, now, and can still cloak upon hitting with the ACD.

Basically, all that's left as Phantom Counters is the Feast of Crows list that SableGryphon flies.

Any thoughts on Navigator as a Phantom crew? Gives you the ability to flip your maneuver if you switch your de cloak direction, and maybe get or avoid a shot you might not otherwise.

Vs non-TLT lists, what counters the Phantom?

Fat Han (and Chirpy) recently received a metagame nerf, and will easily be driven below 1/2 HP.

Super Dash is still strong vs Phantom, but is weak vs TLT. Still, fairly popular to fly with a TLT Miranda.

Vader/Fel suffer vs the Phantom's 4 attack, and a practiced Phantomist is very difficult to predict properly, and therefore hard has heck to arc-dodge.

The Connor's Net seems to be the Bomb Supreme, but it's not really the one that the Phantom fears most. You can decloak while Ioned, now, and can still cloak upon hitting with the ACD.

Basically, all that's left as Phantom Counters is the Feast of Crows list that SableGryphon flies.

if they're taking jammies to counter TLTs, really anything can beat a phantom once it loses its amazing offense. It just becomes a question of good flying, which is actually a two-sided issues thanks to the errata

as for what explicitly counters phantoms

1.) Rebel Captive has gone nowhere. It's still sitting there, waiting to be abused.

2.) double stressing a phantom leaves it just as ****** as stressing it before it can shoot. That opens up double-tap r3-a2 and anything stress inducing at PS 10

3.) dang thing still has a measly 4 health, guaranteed damage will wreck it

I like to run 2 Phantoms with Recon specialist, Fire Control System and Stygium Particle Accelerator along side either Soontir Fell or Darth Vader.
They hit hard and with 2 Focus and an Evade they are harder to take out than you would imagine.

R3-A2 was used. It was a bloodbath. It's not as effective if you stress them after they shoot. Somewhat effective to limit their moves, but not nearly as effective as if used by a high PS pilot.

I still believe that the Phantom cripples the use of all generics, but I do concede that B-wings would have an easier time with it.

I still hate the Phantom and what it brings to the game. I will dislike seeing more of them on the table. I think the biggest problem I have with them is the 4 attack dice. It would've still been effective with just 3.

It's not just the phantom. 4TLT cripples many all-generic squads too. Try four X-Wings against them and you'll see that phantoms aren't alone in this matter.

I also think the phantoms would be just as effective with 3 attack. Why? Well, because you are paying for that attack in points, so if it gets downgraded then the point cost would have to be adjusted as well.

The fact is, phantoms have a major weakness -- they have a glass jaw. They are usually packed with upgrades to help keep them alive longer, but that just means when they fall the opponent reaps the juicy rewards. Plus not only that, they are very tricky to fly and one mistake often brings their demise.

Anyway, most lists have trouble with certain other lists, it's the rock-paper-scissors effect. Arc dodgers beat jousters, jousters beats turrets, and turrets beat arc dodgers. This is why most of the top lists at events are those that take two of the three. Sure, there are some exceptions, but for the most part a squad will do better if it can take on a variety of builds.

So really, this isn't the phantoms to blame, it's the X-Wings. They are not really a good jouster because they aren't very nimble and since you can only get four in a list they are not going to be dealing massive damage, especially since one can be taken down pretty easily -- cutting down the squad's effectiveness. X-Wings these days are more of a support ship. Integrated A will help them out somewhat, but still if you're running four of them you're kind of asking for trouble.

So really, this isn't the phantoms to blame, it's the X-Wings. They are not really a good jouster because they aren't very nimble and since you can only get four in a list they are not going to be dealing massive damage, especially since one can be taken down pretty easily -- cutting down the squad's effectiveness. X-Wings these days are more of a support ship. Integrated A will help them out somewhat, but still if you're running four of them you're kind of asking for trouble.

Not sure that feels quite right, somehow. Running 4 X Wings shouldn't be a drawback. It seems especially neglectful when some of the stuff that has has been scraped from the crusty bottom of the fanboy barrel that was the EU, gets all the player attention and breaks.

So really, this isn't the phantoms to blame, it's the X-Wings. They are not really a good jouster because they aren't very nimble and since you can only get four in a list they are not going to be dealing massive damage, especially since one can be taken down pretty easily -- cutting down the squad's effectiveness. X-Wings these days are more of a support ship. Integrated A will help them out somewhat, but still if you're running four of them you're kind of asking for trouble.

Not sure that feels quite right, somehow. Running 4 X Wings shouldn't be a drawback. It seems especially neglectful when some of the stuff that has has been scraped from the crusty bottom of the fanboy barrel that was the EU, gets all the player attention and breaks.

That's true, it shouldn't be a drawback. But I think it's a drawback because things like B-Wings are a bit underpriced for what they do. X-Wings have become a casualty of power creep unfortunately, but hopefully something like the TIE advanced title will come along to help them out.

That said, 4 T-70s have some potential. The extra shield helps, as does the ability to boost. With four points to spare, you can either give them all droids, two of them AT, or upgrade one of them to a better pilot.