Hey folks, I'm getting ready for Worlds, and the 4x4 is stumping me. I've only played against it once, and while I won (barely) I can see what a brutal list it is. I was playing a Focused Rebel Blast list, and it seems that those are the two basic lists that are on top right now, with the 4x4 having the edge.

I've seen the 4x4 beating Rebel Blast topic, and I've experienced it: when the RGs get mixed in amongst the Rebels, they are going to slaughter them and one of the best counters (Blast) is reduced, assuming there are any Saboteurs left to do it. What kind of counters are there? Is there a way to beat the 4x4 without going 4x4 and just taking the mirror match?

I was thinking a take on 4x4 with Elite Tuskens replacing two guards, and 1 elite officer and temp alliance replacing 2 regular officers. The idea is pass on the first activation, let your opponent move out, then use your officers to move forward 2 choice tuskens. Use the elite to make the elite tuskens attack at range that it hopefully has on one enemy unit. Now your opponent must choose, attack that tusken group before the end of the first round, or let it be. (Might be near objective) at that point, your tuskens can either continue of their activation to harass at range, and your other guards to run up to objectives. Or the tuskens take a beating but one they and your other guards can return on the enemy.

How do you make elite officer do elite tuskens do a range attack? Their standard attack is a melee attack and only their special action allows them to do a range attack. So no executive order for range attack.

****. Well, I'd opt for 2 regular officers and rule by fear or the initiative bid then.

I've had a lot of success against it using General Weiss's Immortal legion with Vader's Finest on a Elite Heavy Troopers, a squad of Elite Stormtroopers, two officers and rule through fear.

I do not see it...i focus on either weiss (nobody can block los to him)or a single trooper card (to kill it in 1 turn) and no reinforcement can be played

I actually think that 2x Elite Rebel trooper list could work, Yes they would take damage agaist the Guards but they would get a focused shot with Pierce 2 (often) with aim bonus. Sprinkle with Fenn for more shooty stuff, Gideon because he is great and rebel saboteur for added blast etc. Marksman cards to ignore LOS stuff.

I've had a lot of success against it using General Weiss's Immortal legion with Vader's Finest on a Elite Heavy Troopers, a squad of Elite Stormtroopers, two officers and rule through fear.

Interesting. I've played General Weiss and just had him torn down by 2 RGs and a RGC. The stormies were able to put a little hurt on them, but were for the most part busy with the rest of the list. I guess if half the list had to focus on Weiss, the stormtroopers could probably take down the other four RGs and the officers.

Watch me get walloped by 4X4! Stunned, and then stunned again, and then stunned, and then after that I was stunned...

Not sure it would have helped, but I'm still working on that new pass rule and don't get to play too often.

He also beat someone else in the first round:

Those Wookiees can stand up to the damage of 4x4, but the Stun is still rough. And then you get stunned again. Then, after you get stunned, you get stunned.

In all seriousness, I'm a pretty weak player, and the list is good. I'd rather play Mercs than Empire or I'd be playing it myself. Not super competitive with this game. But I've seen it beaten many times. Particularly by Rebel Saboteurs. Blast can really mess up any list if they clump together, which is exactly what Guards want to do because of Protector. So even if they separate so you can't Blast them, they have given you an advantage in that they are willfully reducing their own defense.

Here is what I'm seeing from both of those games: you both accepted even fights. Essentially you both allowed the 4x4 to fight 1on1 or 2on2, and the RGs are very likely going to win that fight.

How does this idea sound for fighting against the 4x4? Pass or use support actions initially to get their officers to move RGs and start their deployment. When you have to, activate a multifigure group and split that group into two different directions, being careful to keep them more than 6 squares away from an unactivated RG. Once the RGs start committing, go the way fewer of them are, or more likely towards one half. With your much weaker flank, try to stun the RGs or otherwise tie them up while the rest of your list goes to town on the other half. Kill the officers with support characters like Jyn. Keep your large force bunched up, preferably around C-3P0: no gaps that would allow RGs to step into the middle of your group. After you've torn up one flank, you should be able to take care of the second.

It's likely that for most games, you'll have to sacrifice an objective. The biggest problem I'd see for this is the Data Heist mission, since that is just sooooo many points. Likely the only solution to that is to sacrifice one figure to tie up one of the terminals for a turn while you go after half the RGs.

You're starting to describe the list that stacks Evades and Cunning. Leave no gaps, make everything hard to hit, and hope they bring the fight to you. If they do, you'll take out about 2 guards a round, take very little damage, and not be stunned due to all of the innate evades.

As you describe, this falls apart as soon as you have to go after an objective or move. Also C3PO is a weak link in the chain.

Mine was the 1st round match. I made one pretty bad play mistake and when I had my focused sabs, I wasn't rolling the surges. I came up short on range on one attack, the dice definitely weren't with me.

I wouldn't say I went 1 on 1, except with Biv. The idea is for the Wookies to be meat shields for the Sabs, which they did... I just didn't roll even average on the attacks for the sabs-- even focused. I'll have to go back and watch it, but I want to say I attacked twice with focused E Sabs and got 0 surges. That's pretty hard to do.

Anyway, it's 3am here, and I am suffering from a severe lack of sleep--- maybe I'll post something more constructive and coherent when I wake up.

Mine was the 1st round match. I made one pretty bad play mistake and when I had my focused sabs, I wasn't rolling the surges. I came up short on range on one attack, the dice definitely weren't with me.

I wouldn't say I went 1 on 1, except with Biv. The idea is for the Wookies to be meat shields for the Sabs, which they did... I just didn't roll even average on the attacks for the sabs-- even focused. I'll have to go back and watch it, but I want to say I attacked twice with focused E Sabs and got 0 surges. That's pretty hard to do.

Anyway, it's 3am here, and I am suffering from a severe lack of sleep--- maybe I'll post something more constructive and coherent when I wake up.

I'll admit, I didn't watch too much of your match, but from what I saw there were pretty even numbers going through the control room and the central area. What you're saying does make sense, though: we play dice games, and if you can't get the dice to behave, then you're screwed. That is why I love Luke, and I need to remember to keep him near my Sabs.