So I finally get a chance to actually play this game. Been GMing since beta of edge and have been invited to play by one of my players (he would GM). My original concept was a Trandoshan from the "Church of the New Transfiguration." (kudos to those who know what I'm talking bout) but with the release of the Gank species I had to go that route.

So I'm looking at the cybernetic weapon, which is described as "The standard cybernetic weapon appears to be a regular cybernetic arm but features a retractable light blaster pistol that can be deployed as an incidental. It is attached to the arm and cannot be removed, drop, or or disarmed"

So we know it has the light blaster pistol damage model and stats. So does the weapon have any hard points? A generic light blaster pistol is reported to have 2 hard points by itself, does it loose these 2 in order to be installed as a cybernetic weapon? I can see such a weapon with a mini scope or laser sight.

If that's not a problem, can the weapon be replaced with another weapon of equal encumbrance and rarity?Range or melee/brawl?

If so, can I use jury rigged on another item or weapon, decreasing its encumbrance by 2 (to a minimum of 1) allowing me to install/replace an encumbrance 3 weapon into my cybernetic weapon arm?

If so, can I use jury rigged again, on the same weapon essentially taking an encumbrance 4 weapon (entering range heavy territory here) down to encumbrance 1 and therefore being the correct encumbrance size for a cybernetic weapon? At this point I'm sure the weapon is no longer be disguised as an average cyber arm. But there's more,

If so, would the weapon be range heavy or range light? My first instinct would be ranged heavy. However much like the pistol grip can take a range heavy weapon down to a one handed range light skill check, the fluff can describe this weapon as literally a part of me making it easier to handle than just adding a pistol grip would a normal weapon.

In the end, is it really a problem? Is it game breaking? Would such a weapon being held in the hand instead of installed in the hand be any better for a GM/player to deal with in the end? what would you say the limitations of this weapon are?

You can do anything your GM will let you, but I personally wouldn't allow much of it because to me the arm comes manufactured that way as a single unit.

You're sort of skipping over the part of the description where it took the Blastech cybernetics experts 6 attempts to get that item to work at all, as well as the fact it says it can't be removed from the limb, which sort of precludes swapping parts out in my mind.

I believe it would be RAW to apply Jury Rigged to the Blaster in the arm (EotE pg138) and describe the effects as whatever you'd like. There may be other Talents that would apply as well.

This wouldn't allow you actually substitute another weapon but you can describe it that way.

As for applying a larger weapon, well that wouldn't work as you describe it and currently there is no provision within the RAW to accommodate what you are asking for. Oh, and it's a bit Munckin too

I would go for Jury Rigging it to do more damage or drop the crit rating. We could have a conversation about a laser sight and superior customization as well I think. All that together would make it pretty darn good.

I'm going to make a couple comparisons, here, to help explain my reasonings. I see the standard weapons as the 'desktop' version of the weapon...room for expansion, tweaking, modifications, etc. The arm weapon strikes me more as the 'laptop' version; not as much room for customization...pretty much no way to modify or customize. Your hardpoints were used building the thing into a cybernetic arm.

I'm going to make a couple comparisons, here, to help explain my reasonings. I see the standard weapons as the 'desktop' version of the weapon...room for expansion, tweaking, modifications, etc. The arm weapon strikes me more as the 'laptop' version; not as much room for customization...pretty much no way to modify or customize. Your hardpoints were used building the thing into a cybernetic arm.

So let's say no to replacing the weapon. No prob right? Let's just get a lbp and use the 2 hp on it to install a wrist mount to the weapon. 275 credits and now I have an arm weapon, not disguised so much but that what a skullduggery check is for. Can only be used on light range weapons, so it's kinda like the arm weapon, but cheap. Regular cyber limb (2000) + lbp (300) + wrist mount (275). = 2,575 credits.

So is having it "hidden" inside the arm worth 1,425? Buy some synthskin (10) and let the pc roll to hide it. Let's turn it up a notch. Let's just pick up a Merr-Sonn model 53 (4hp), install the wrist mount, leaving 2 hp left. We can leave the heavy weapons for the integrated armor weapon mount attachment.

Munchkin is a word thrown about by d20 gms to describe "problems" their players generate and don't know how to deal with. Where a narrative gm would look for story potential and balance gameplay mechanics within.

So we can't put the limitation on encumbrance size alone (thanks to jury rigged). I do like the requirement that the weapon must be encumbrance 1 AND have 2 hard points. Or I suppose I could see if jury rigged can be used to change the range attribute on weapons by 1. Not only to compensate for say a shortened barrel attachment, but can you imagine a power fist with short range?

I think you're missing the fact that it isn't just hidden inside the arm, it is also replacing a limb you lost, you're adding the weapon essentially to the cost of the repli-limb. A weapon that's well hidden and can be deployed as an incidental.

I think you're missing the fact that it isn't just hidden inside the arm, it is also replacing a limb you lost, you're adding the weapon essentially to the cost of the repli-limb. A weapon that's well hidden and can be deployed as an incidental.

Shadow sheath does the same thing without restrictions of what equipment is being hidden. Cost just a bit more than the difference of 1425 (1500 total). QuickDraw gives the incedental drawing as well (can be found on attachments or as talent).

Just another means to an end. Point being there's many ways to do the same thing, each costing something, wether it's credits, hard points, limbs, etc, or a combination of them all. Im looking for a harmony between fluff and game mechanics so the GM and I aren't scratching our heads a few months from now.

Rereading the description reminds me that it doesn't talk at all bout it being "hidden". It's proprietary and uses lbp as damage model. I thinks it's the shirt sleeve that's hiding the weapon, like a mook walking up to you with a knife in his hand, and his hand in his pocket.

I would suggest you and your GM just do as you like.

In keeping with the Desktop/Laptop analogy, laptops use basic or 'stripped down' versions of components to enable them to fit into a smaller space. For example, my current laptop doesn't have a dedicated video card. It has some components that can mimic a video card, but it doesn't have the same....performance...as a true, dedicated video card.
The light blaster in a cybernetic limb is going to be the same way. Its a basic, stripped down weapon that is being fitted into a smaller space. It could very well be that a regular blaster is used, but during the process of trimming and fitting and shoehorning the thing into a cyber forearm, it is essentially reduced to a light blaster. Everyone seen the movie 'Valkyrie', where they are discussing the bomb being built. The bomb expert says that with the small fuses being used, there will be a delay of 10 to 15 minutes before the bomb goes off. One of the conspirators says 'That's hardly precise'. The bomb maker says 'This is state-of-the-art. You can have small or precise, not both'. In this instance, with this cyberlimb, you can have concealed or powerful, not both.

This is what I was thinking as well, but then it was argued that's there's no difference between a light blaster pistol and a regular blaster pistol. They are exactly the same encumbrance and rarity, the damage/crit/hp differences are shown in the price.

That bolded statement is completely wrong and misrepresenting.

That they are exactly the same Encumbrance and rarity has nothing to do with them having no difference.

You said it yourself in the next part that shows There is a difference .

Damage, Crit, Hard points:

These are the Things that Make a Difference. It is a Slightly Larger Gun. Encumbrance isn't just about weight and two guns could have the size and weight be fairly Close but still be different.

The Regular Blaster is not going to Fit into the same slot as a Light blaster. They are not Configured the same. They are not the Same shape, They are not the same size. That is Why the Regular blaster has More hard points, has a better chance to crit, and does more damage. It packs a Bigger charge for more oomph.

larger capacitor, large blast charge... Etc. yea that makes sense.

Suppose I didn't make the post clear, but let me point out that my GM and I are ok with the idea. We are looking for a way to make it fair/balanced. We aren't trying to split hairs on in hand or IN hand, but more trying to fit it into the rules since there's currently nothing bout creating/inventing items. The stuff we come up with for this Gank will be used for the other player I GM for. We are trying to figure a throwable bacta grenade too.

So far we are thinking,

-it'll cost 2 hp and must be encumbrance 1

-any attachments/mods would have to fit narratively.

Not to mention the rolls for creation, installation, modifications. Which bring up the other idea i wanted to spit ball; have character purchase cyber arm and desired weapon to be installed (only restriction is encumbrance 1). Have them roll mechanic check to combine the 2. Medicine/cybernetic check for installation. Threat/advantages spent to see what happens on the weapon. Get a triumph and maybe you kept a hard point. Get a dispair and maybe it's not accurate netting a setback on every use.

"The standard cybernetic weapon appears to be a regular cybernetic arm but features a retractable light blaster pistol that can be deployed as an incidental. It is attached to the arm and cannot be removed, drop, or or disarmed"

Okay so just my reading on this, but it seems to me that the gun pops out of the arm and goes to work. So based on that, I would allow a player to attempt to strip down a different weapon and replace the standard one. You can do it with ship HPs why not the arm? I would do it with some caveats though

- The PC would have to buy whatever the replacement weapon is per RAW

- There is a significant Mechanics check with at least one Red die. On a Despair the entire arm might be rendered unusable.

- Brawl/Melee weapons are fine to replace the pistol with, but follow the next rule.

- The replacement weapon has to be reasonably sized. If you want to replace your arm with a Sidewinder, that's ******* awesome , but you aren't hiding that ****. I think an Enc 1 is a fair limit, but I might let the PC try a heavy pistol if he modded it down. Then on Despair instead of just running out of ammo, his entire arm overheats and he isn't able to use the limb until he can do some repairs.

YMMV of course.

Okay, I re-read what it is you are trying to do and I think you've chosen the wrong way to go.

Just so I have this correct: you want to replace one of your PC's arms with a cybernetic arm that has a weapon built in but not hidden and you don't care if the arm looks natural.

So the restriction on the cybernetic arm in the CRB, light blaster, is for a hidden weapon within an otherwise normally functioning arm. You don't want that, you want a weapon arm.

Solution 1 :
You replace the arm with a normal cybernetic one as per RAW (same cost etc) but one that is obvious (ie. looks mechanical). Now you get Permission to Jury Rigg the Arm to add a Hard Point to the cybernetic arm. Next you, again with GM permission, purchase a modified version of the VX Hands Free Weapon System (Dangerous Cov) to modify the arm in order to mount one weapon. Normally this attachment costs two HPs and allows you to mount any Ranged Light or Heavy weapon with an ENC of 4 or less, but your modified version would be 1 HP and only allow a Ranged Light with ENC 2 or less.
Attach the weapon of your choice, remembering that it is affected exactly the same as any weapon you hold with the exception that if you get a Disarm result you don't drop the weapon but instead you have to spend a Manoeuvre to get it working again.

Solution 2:

Actually, its already sounding pretty fair and balanced. You have a blaster weapon implanted into a cybernetic arm. It cannot be removed, dropped, or disarmed. That's pretty impressive, right there. The trade off is that you have to use a smaller 'caliber' of blaster to use in the cybernetics.