So I like imperials. How does one use their speed and maneuverability to an advantage? My view is, when you're running you can't fire. And second, despite having slightly faster dials,running around the outside to try to get around an opponent is useless when they have a shorter turn to make on the inside. So i get that they can boost and barrel roll and those are great combat tricks but how do you gain positioning with them?

When my Bs faced 3 interceptors, my opponent closed quickly. I mean 2nd turn range 1. Even though the Bs had the inside the interceptors moved last and with boost and barrel rolls stayed at R1 most of the time and usually out of arc.

A lot depends on your ability to anticipate your opponent's move. That's the key. Also the closer you are to an opponent the less distance you need to travel to get out of arc.

The thing about Imperials (especially Interceptors) is that they really don't want to get shot at, so it's OK to not have a shot, as long as you're opponent doesn't have one either (obviously, turrets are an issue but that's why auto thrusters came around).

I enjoy flying these glass cannons because they are such a challenge. Sure, you can get Range 1 in arc of a B but if you don't kill it on that first engagement, your Interceptor is going to pop.

depends on the squad, really

generally:

Long Range

-your arc gets wider the further the target is from your ship, letting you catch enemies in it more easily

-range 3 gives extra green dice; thrusters

Close Range

-your arc gets more narrow the close the target is from your ship, making it easier for that ship to boost/roll out of that arc

-range 1 gives extra red dice

using your speed and maneuverability to your advantage rests largely on controlling the distance from your target based on who you're flying against

I havn't run interceptors (fragile, green-dice-dependent buggers), but I have run a basic equivalent in 5 A-wings. The first thing you have to do is identify your effective range against your target.

Against B-wings, I want to be far away. 4 agility is a far bigger swing than 2, and 4 dice at range 1 will pop As like bubble-wrap

Against Aggressors, I want to get in close. Thrusters will shaft me otherwise.

the rest is just leveraging your beautiful dial to maintain the desired range. This can involve a lot of hitting and then running away to regroup so that you can concentrate your fire at an ideal range, rather than just K-turning immediately back into the fight.

boost/roll are good arc-dodging tools, but people seem to constantly forget two essential applications

1. boost/roll can set up different approach around a cluster of obstacles

2. boost/roll can set up blocks that would have otherwise been impossible

I guess they are more difficult to remember than arc-dodging, though, since arc-dodging is almost always reactionary (Higher ps against lower) while the above two involve thinking ahead and trying to predict your opponent

Well, hard to talk about things in a vacuum (of space!), but I can try.

For one thing with Imperials, the first pass is nasty. So, I like to break up my ships into 2 or more groups. I'll set them up on different sides of the table and send them off at middle speed to see who my opponent goes for. Once he's committed to one force, I can slow them down and go 5 forward with the others. If I need to, I can do a 1 turn to the side and try to barrel roll out of the way to ensure I'm out of firing range. That's my favorite thing to do with speed.

It's not just speed, but also 1 sharp turn + barrel roll. That's a pretty good move. Heck, the 1 sharp turn is pretty nice, too. Not a lot of ships have it.

If you watch the video on YouTube for the "Rule of 11", it helps you gauge when you get in shooting range for various ships. That's when speed can really help you out. Sometimes you want to be at R3 and sometimes you want to be just outside and then zip in close.

EDIT: For Rule of 11, I've found it great to be just out of R3 and then zip in as fast as you can. If you have low PS, then you get your action, but then they will probably bump you. That's always a good trick.

The thing about Imperials (especially Interceptors) is that they really don't want to get shot at, so it's OK to not have a shot, as long as you're opponent doesn't have one either (obviously, turrets are an issue but that's why auto thrusters came around).

I enjoy flying these glass cannons because they are such a challenge. Sure, you can get Range 1 in arc of a B but if you don't kill it on that first engagement, your Interceptor is going to pop.

Basically how I also fly A-Wings too. If you can make sure you get shots without the other guy getting a shot, it's usually better than taking more shots while getting your fragile ship shot up in return (Corran/Miranda excepted, since they usually can just regen damage).

When I run imperials I'm usually forcing an opponent to make a decision. Around here we have a "Soontir" lesson/trap. That is, Soontir + anything... Soontir is usually far and away from the rest of the fleet. if you fall for the Soontir Trap, you have made the mistake and the rest of the fleet flanks you from behind while Soontir turtles up every turn. If you chase the rest of the fleet, Soontir makes you pay for it by flanking with massive damage (which is why our group prefers Soontir with Targeting Computer instead of Stealth Device). There are many strategies around how to fly it!

If I'm running Defenders, its usualy with HLC. "Stay at range" usually means one banks + barrel roll to keep the opponent in arc for 2 turns. Once at range 3 with a focus token, then one turn at range 2 when they come forward. If they go all the way forward on 2 defenders you have the same 4 dice from the primary.

Lots of good advice on flying imps in this thread!

You need to stay at longer range but look like you are not trying to stay at range. Fly casual.

I'm still a little confused on this.

If I'm trying to stay at range three, I'm picturing myself flying in a circle around the board with the enemy closing on the inside circle.. or me flying straight away and once I turn I lose my range advantage.

I know up close I can pull very tight manuvers to get around their arc, but with a TLT + feedback array list, getting in close is tough, and hurts.

That or I'm picturing jousting and then turning.

In short I still don't understand how you can stay at range three and still turn enough to shoot without getting caught. I know they're fast, but my experience trying to outrun or run around someone is I just get caught and give them my rear.

I can picture getting in close and out maneuvering enemies pretty easily, but I cant seeing being about to dictate range and firing at the same time unless you have a rear firing weapon. The minute you turn they can close distance no?

If you have an Interceptor, with a 5-Straight plus boost, you are halfway across the board on the first move.

A lot of positioning is about anticipating where your opponent will move and being able to move first to either block them or move after and use abilities to position out of their arc. 360 turrets are a major problem for Interceptors that you have to consider.

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

There are times you want to stay at R3 and there are times you don't want to be at R3. I guess it depends on your list and what you are facing.

If you have Autothrusters, you like R3, or at least being out of firing arc. Standard Tie Fighters don't need to be at R3.

If you face TLT's, being at R1 is a good thing.

Yes, it is hard to stay at R3. The example given was with a Tie Defender that has a 1 Bank. That means you can bank, and then barrel roll backwards and still be about the same facing (kind of). Other than that, you can't really stay at R3 and stay in target very easily. Perhaps....depending on how you came in and where they went, etc. As long as it's not straight at each other.

Overall, though, I think varying speed is best used when you have different groups approaching the same target. That's when good speed works.

One question might be what ships you are flying with? Are you going with Interceptors or regular Tie Fighters? How many? That might help overall. Or are you asking in general? Then you have to break it down into specifics.

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you get stress from push the limit, you can't use his free barrel roll, right?

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you get stress from push the limit, you can't use his free barrel roll, right?

With Turr, you push off of his free post-attack action. Push allows you to take an extra action (on your action bar) off of any action, not just those in the 'Action' step.

In regards to staying at range 3, what I've found most often works (with A-wings, mind) is the "Ole!" Joust

A normal joust is two sides come at each other, trade dice, k-turn, trade dice, green, trade dice etc

The "Ole!" Joust is a fake-out. It goes, vaguely, like this

Range 3:

token up, trade dice

The round before the K-turn:

a little tricky to set up, but the gist is this

Instead of moving to trade dice at Closer range, you want to do the opposite

1.) Arc dodge (Ole!)

2.) Block. You don't get shot by whoever's in b2b contact with you (Ole!...just don't try it in real life because that works a little differently)

Awings normally lack roll, so blocking is far easier for them than arc dodging

Note you don't have to (and probably won't) dodge ALL the dice, just enough to force the opponent to spread damage instead of killing off ships

The kturn:

So you got some Options here

If your opponent only has 4ks, chances are a 5k Will land you at range 3 (or outside)

Another option is just taking a page from Monty python and just booking it. Run away with any ships in danger of being diced, while keeping any safe ones around to hmer the enemy

All of these choices become much harder to implement with enemy ships cluttering the table, so use obstacles to your advantage. Obstacles are your friends (just don't go through em )

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you get stress from push the limit, you can't use his free barrel roll, right?

With Turr, you push off of his free post-attack action. Push allows you to take an extra action (on your action bar) off of any action, not just those in the 'Action' step.

Yep! Turr flies straight at someone (of lower PS) and fires. Then, he can boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc! I have used Turr with a mix of high and low PS pilots. Try to get the high to fire at you and save your Focus for that shot. Try not to take the hit. Then, get out of there so that the lower PS ships can't concentrate their fire.

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you get stress from push the limit, you can't use his free barrel roll, right?

With Turr, you push off of his free post-attack action. Push allows you to take an extra action (on your action bar) off of any action, not just those in the 'Action' step.

Kinda like the opposite end of advanced sensors plus ptl. Thanks for the clarification

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you get stress from push the limit, you can't use his free barrel roll, right?

With Turr, you push off of his free post-attack action. Push allows you to take an extra action (on your action bar) off of any action, not just those in the 'Action' step.

Kinda like the opposite end of advanced sensors plus ptl. Thanks for the clarification

Absolutely - Sorry I did not make it clearer in the beginning.

If I am playing lower PS ships, my typical order is to move into range and focus. Then after firing, take the free boost or barrel roll and use PTL to get one more action.

This works well enough in a lot of situations, with Brobots, Swarms, and other groups that don't have PS more than 6.

Staying at range is kind of a misnomer. You really can't stay at range with all your ships anyway. If your first engagement is at range 3, they'll move toward you and you can't generally just fly backwards, or move fast enough to get around.

So, I typically see it approached a few ways ways.

1. Squads that have a mixture of optimum ranges (or at least some ships that mostly don't care what the range is). Ships that can fight in close with the enemy do so, and will either keep the force distracted, or work to block the ships. Either way, your ships that need to work on the outside now have time to work the edges without as much harassment.

2. For all evasive squads, it is often a long range engagement, followed by a rush to range 1. At close range, if you are higher PS, you are going to try to arc dodge. If you are lower PS, you are going to move to block them, but in reality to prevent them from shooting you moreso than to take away actions. You render a ship completely worthless for a round by putting the only ship it can shoot in base to base contact with it. So sometimes, even if you are a high PS, action dependent ship, a bump can save you if the only ship that can shoot you is in base contact. Almost always take a non-exchange if you can get it over exchanging at R1. Following this exchange, it always is situational if you can get around on them, but one of the best moves is just to cut an run fast. Jump over their formation and boost away. They'll lose a ton of ground if they K-turn, giving you time to set up for another pass at the ranges you want. The important thing is not to try to get shots off 100% of the time. So long as you aren't receiving fire, not firing is not an issue.

Another important factor in this is to hopefully set up the first and second rounds of contact so that you are at an angle to your opponent. Doing so gives you better arc dodging opportunities, and also often leaves a bank or hard turn to one side you can make that they often cannot follow with a hard turn of their own(being at an angle, they need to turn more than you).

I like Turr Phenir with Push the Limit. My general strategy with lower PS ships is to move within range 1 for the initial attack and then after firing boost and barrel roll out of their firing arc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you get stress from push the limit, you can't use his free barrel roll, right?

With Turr, you push off of his free post-attack action. Push allows you to take an extra action (on your action bar) off of any action, not just those in the 'Action' step.

You still get stressed correct? I may use PTL on him too.

As for the topic: I'm asking in general, but it's in response to playing against my friends list last night.

I'm going to be running echo with fel and phennir, or fel with phennir and jax. I was testing against his list which was a scum list with two TLT, one on a Y wing and on a hwk, and then a z95 and talon bane. All but talonbane had feedback array.

First game I tried to stay away and run to try to find a more favorable position. Echo died easily and I could not move fast enough around the board because again, he had center and therefore a shorter turning radius.

Second game I tried going in, he correctly predicted this, dropped a seismic charge and then killed my dudes. I tried to run past his group with 5 + boost because I enaged at range three, but couldnt get far enough.

Too be fair he said he made it to kill lists like mine, but I feel like unless I'm in point blank, i have no idea what I'm doing as far as positioning. Or playing with range

I'm still a little confused on this.

If I'm trying to stay at range three, I'm picturing myself flying in a circle around the board with the enemy closing on the inside circle.. or me flying straight away and once I turn I lose my range advantage.

I know up close I can pull very tight manuvers to get around their arc, but with a TLT + feedback array list, getting in close is tough, and hurts.

That or I'm picturing jousting and then turning.

In short I still don't understand how you can stay at range three and still turn enough to shoot without getting caught. I know they're fast, but my experience trying to outrun or run around someone is I just get caught and give them my rear.

I can picture getting in close and out maneuvering enemies pretty easily, but I cant seeing being about to dictate range and firing at the same time unless you have a rear firing weapon. The minute you turn they can close distance no?

I was testing against his list which was a scum list with two TLT, one on a Y wing and on a hwk, and then a z95 and talon bane. All but talonbane had feedback array.

This list might be easier to handle once your friend stops cheating and putting feedback array on ships without illicit slots (the Y-wing in case you're wondering) .

Also try flying interceptors with Push the limit and autothrusters if that's what you like. They are basically auto includes on them, and generally make them much better ships.

I could have been mistaken about the y wing. No reason to assume he's cheating

How do I stay at range?

A healthy fear of pepper spray and the defined guide lines of the restraining order, usually.

Rock placement goes a long way. I've been playing a lot of xizor lately and seeing some slower ships. When the engagement gets harry I run along the outer edge, they cant take tighter turns without ending up on rocks. It's harder in timed rounds but definitely do able

Rock placement goes a long way. I've been playing a lot of xizor lately and seeing some slower ships. When the engagement gets harry I run along the outer edge, they cant take tighter turns without ending up on rocks. It's harder in timed rounds but definitely do able

Ahh good idea!