It changes the game from star destroyers front arc it's dangerous to don't care they have to close distance and we have superior firepower (even whitout gunnery team).

The times I tried the akbar firing lane not even an ISD could survive the damage.

Empire needs a lot of tricks to be able to make more damage than my rebels. Actually their only hope it's box my leading ship if I let them do it ...

It changes the game from star destroyers front arc it's dangerous to don't care they have to close distance and we have superior firepower (even whitout gunnery team).

The times I tried the akbar firing lane not even an ISD could survive the damage.

Empire needs a lot of tricks to be able to make more damage than my rebels. Actually their only hope it's box my leading ship if I let them do it ...

An ISD should have issues if beset by several other ships that in the end cost more points than it.

So if my 267 points of ships kills your 120 point ship my ships are not over powered.

I just sent in the following question using the Rules Question form:

" When using Admiral Ackbar's ability, can the 2 dice bonus be gained by firing only a single shot from the left or right hull zone, as long as no other shots are taken? Or must you fire at target in both the right and left hull zones? Also can the Gunnery Team upgrade be employed in conjunction with Admiral Ackbar's ability? ​"

I will let you all know when I get an official answer.

I will paraphrase the response I got from FFG. Essentially they are examining this situation and want to evaluate it further before making an official ruling. They did indicate that this would likely be addressed in the next FAQ update.

I am guessing they want to see how it affects game balance and want to observe a while longer.

Well, in my experience, it's actually very hard

But then again, it's FFG, they should have the manpower to do it even if it's hard.

Oh, I agree that playtesting is mighty hard, and balance in a complex game very elusive.

I just imagine that for such iconic commanders as Vader and Ackbar they have carefully considered the implications. If they haven't factored AFs and Gunnery teams and whatnot into the equation I'll be flabbergasted.

If they decide to go with the "must shot both sides" approach, I'm very eager to see how they intend to solve the paradoxes that leads to as explained earlyer in this thread...

If they decide to go with the "must shot both sides" approach, I'm very eager to see how they intend to solve the paradoxes that leads to as explained earlyer in this thread...

Ackbar slash only?

It would certainly make fish-face a much less desirable commander, one that I would happily leave in the box.

If they decide to go with the "must shot both sides" approach, I'm very eager to see how they intend to solve the paradoxes that leads to as explained earlyer in this thread...

Ackbar slash only?

It would certainly make fish-face a much less desirable commander, one that I would happily leave in the box.

Yes, Ackbar slash only. I got the impresion from Edsel62 post that FFG is actualy considering that as a possibllity for Ackbar.

And I agrea, I can not see my self ever using him if that would be the case. But then again, I rarely use any one other then Dodona any way. He has a decent abillity and he doesn't cost me 3 squads worth of points.

So what exactly is FFG playtesting if not how the upgrades they are releasing are intended to work.

I am guessing they want to see how it affects game balance and want to observe a while longer.

Nah, they are collecting all the questions being asked on all the various topics and will make a FAQ based on what questions get asked Frequently. Ask another question on Wave 2 before it comes out, I expect you'll get the very same cut and paste. Ask a question on Wave 1 and you should get a reply.

All you Imperial Admirals trying to nerf uncle Acky with your lawyer speak and words with too many syllables!!

Eat red dice in the face dark servants!

So what exactly is FFG playtesting if not how the upgrades they are releasing are intended to work.

My guess is that if they are actually still deciding (rather than merely waiting until Wave 2 is actually out) then they probably originally decided only the slash was eligible for the extra dice. They may have started examining the prospect of a single arc after the fact.

But hell, I don't know.

If you really need to shoot out of both arcs, presumably at a viable ship target...it sounds so incredibly contrived. I'm just going to pretend this thread doesn't exist.

So, here is the question.

Why would you let an ISD 2 with 4 red dice (average damage of 2.5) with no upgrades be better than a rebel ship with a Commander?

The ISD gets Gunnery Teams as well so it's average damage is boosted. Why should a 127 point ship be far more amazing then let's say a single Assault Frigate with Ackbar which tops out with Gunnery Teams at 117 points alone?

So what exactly is FFG playtesting if not how the upgrades they are releasing are intended to work.

My guess is that if they are actually still deciding (rather than merely waiting until Wave 2 is actually out) then they probably originally decided only the slash was eligible for the extra dice. They may have started examining the prospect of a single arc after the fact.

But hell, I don't know.

Neither prospect is at all encouraging. Deciding how you want an ability to work, testing that, and finalizing it; is exactly why you playtest. Being up in the air about an ability pre-release is a sizeable indictment of thier playtesting.

So, here is the question.

Why would you let an ISD 2 with 4 red dice (average damage of 2.5) with no upgrades be better than a rebel ship with a Commander?

The ISD gets Gunnery Teams as well so it's average damage is boosted. Why should a 127 point ship be far more amazing then let's say a single Assault Frigate with Ackbar which tops out with Gunnery Teams at 117 points alone?

Because the points for the Commander aren't only an upgrade for that one AFII? Counting all of the Commander's point cost against only that one ship's cost/ability analysis doesn't make any sense.

So what exactly is FFG playtesting if not how the upgrades they are releasing are intended to work.

My guess is that if they are actually still deciding (rather than merely waiting until Wave 2 is actually out) then they probably originally decided only the slash was eligible for the extra dice. They may have started examining the prospect of a single arc after the fact.

But hell, I don't know.

Neither prospect is at all encouraging. Deciding how you want an ability to work, testing that, and finalizing it; is exactly why you playtest. Being up in the air about an ability pre-release is a sizeable indictment of thier playtesting.

To be fair, I started it with an "if" statement. Nothing says that they don't already have their answer. We know for sure that they are waiting to release any answers until at least the wave is out.

So, here is the question.

Why would you let an ISD 2 with 4 red dice (average damage of 2.5) with no upgrades be better than a rebel ship with a Commander?

The ISD gets Gunnery Teams as well so it's average damage is boosted. Why should a 127 point ship be far more amazing then let's say a single Assault Frigate with Ackbar which tops out with Gunnery Teams at 117 points alone?

Because the points for the Commander aren't only an upgrade for that one AFII? Counting all of the Commander's point cost against only that one ship's cost/ability analysis doesn't make any sense.

All the while, upgrade cards like Tractor Beams, XI7 Turbolasers, and techniques that blocky movement hinder my ships progress.

So what exactly is FFG playtesting if not how the upgrades they are releasing are intended to work.

My guess is that if they are actually still deciding (rather than merely waiting until Wave 2 is actually out) then they probably originally decided only the slash was eligible for the extra dice. They may have started examining the prospect of a single arc after the fact.

But hell, I don't know.

Neither prospect is at all encouraging. Deciding how you want an ability to work, testing that, and finalizing it; is exactly why you playtest. Being up in the air about an ability pre-release is a sizeable indictment of thier playtesting.

To be fair, I started it with an "if" statement. Nothing says that they don't already have their answer. We know for sure that they are waiting to release any answers until at least the wave is out.

So people are upset that a Commander that costs 2 points less than 10% of my point allotment has great synergy with a 7 point upgrade that I can only take on 2 ships and both ships are already expensive and have low hull?

What's the issue? Ackbar is the Rebel Screed for wave 2. It is strong but not over powering.

As far as I can read, the context of Ackbar's ability is clear.

"Before a friendly ship's Attack Step, it may choose to attack from only its left and right hull zones this round. If it does, it may add 2 red dice to its attack pool while attacking a ship"

Let's break it down:

"Before a friendly ship's Attack Step," - which means that before I enter my attack step I have to declare the use of Ackbar's ability.

"it may choose to attack from only its left and right hull zones this round." - This means I can only attack out of these two hull zones if using this ability (not must attack out of both hull zones)

This next part is key.

"If it does, it may add 2 red dice to its attack pool while attacking a ship" - 5his means that when I declare a ship as my target during my attack step I get to add 2 red dice. This has no restrictions on what hull zone gets the dice other than the attack has to be from the left OR right HZ's.

So simply enough, every attack against a ship from my left or right hull zones will get 2 extra dice. Seems some enough. Not sure where the issue is.

Sure he does not but my second Assault Frigate still costs 79 points on top of my 117 already spent. Guess what, that is almost half my points on 2 nearly naked ships that get to use red dice which are the most unreliable dice in the game.

All the while, upgrade cards like Tractor Beams, XI7 Turbolasers, and techniques that blocky movement hinder my ships progress.

Calm down bro. You incorrectly calculated Ackbar's cost by pretending that it only applies towards the cost of one ship. Motti is a terrible deal if you stick him on a Raider and pretend like he only gives you 1 hullpoint. Well no, he gives a hull bonus to every ship in the fleet.

It's simple math, let's say you grab 4 AFIIs, then Ackbar gives you twice the benefit of Enhanced Armament for less cost per ship. You can't complain about a Commander's cost when examining his benefit only to one ship. That's all I was saying. Nothing about Tractor Beams, nothing about Gunnery Teams, nothing about stopping a conga line. Please address what I say, or don't quote me.

So people are upset that a Commander that costs 2 points less than 10% of my point allotment has great synergy with a 7 point upgrade that I can only take on 2 ships and both ships are already expensive and have low hull?

What's the issue? Ackbar is the Rebel Screed for wave 2. It is strong but not over powering.

As far as I can read, the context of Ackbar's ability is clear.

"Before a friendly ship's Attack Step, it may choose to attack from only its left and right hull zones this round. If it does, it may add 2 red dice to its attack pool while attacking a ship"

Let's break it down:

"Before a friendly ship's Attack Step," - which means that before I enter my attack step I have to declare the use of Ackbar's ability.

"it may choose to attack from only its left and right hull zones this round." - This means I can only attack out of these two hull zones if using this ability (not must attack out of both hull zones)

This next part is key.

"If it does, it may add 2 red dice to its attack pool while attacking a ship" - 5his means that when I declare a ship as my target during my attack step I get to add 2 red dice. This has no restrictions on what hull zone gets the dice other than the attack has to be from the left OR right HZ's.

So simply enough, every attack against a ship from my left or right hull zones will get 2 extra dice. Seems some enough. Not sure where the issue is.

None of this has anything to do with what I said at all. I'm not discussing different interpretations of the card. I'm not addressing the balance of different interpretations. I'm discussing FFG's play testing, and their response to people asking for a clarification.

We clearly need a clarification because the wording leaves some confusion (I don't care if you agree, so feel free not to tell me whether or not you do.) I think that probably your interpretation is correct, but we'll see what FFG will say. Common understandings have been wrong in the past.

In any case, none of this second half addresses anything I've said. Please don't quote me unless you plan to actually address me. I know I'm repeating myself, but man these non sequiturs are intense. You are way overreacting to nothing that I can determine.

Lyraeus what point are you even trying to make? Your badgering him over a position he never took. Jeez.

First off, I did not "incorrectly calculate" Ackbar's cost. Yes he works on more ships. The point was to show you a direct comparison on an Imperial ship base vs a shop that has Ackbar and throws almost the same number of dice. Which happens to be the vehicle I think we will see him the most on.

Sure he gets better the more ships you have like Motti, Tarkin, Rieekan and the like but that's not the whole point. He is 38 points! Only Tarkin has that associated cost and Tarkin's ability is good but not as spectacular to some.

What difference in interpretation can there be? He is quite clear. If they wanted him to be once per a ships activation they would have worded it like Screed, instead he is worded more like Mon Mothma. You get to do X when X occurs.

He does not state anywhere that you need to attack from both hull zones to get his benefits, he only states WHERE you can attack from. So I am confused on how this is even questionable.

Because another poster got a response that even FFG possibly considers the ability up in the air. So provided that there isn't some miscommunication between that poster and FFG, which is entirely possible (hopefully probable), there is clearly alot questionable.

You needed to have FFG explicitly tell you that you can't stack ships during deployment and that you can't measure from any ship during a single ships "Determine Course" step. You've found much less questionable things questionable.

First off, I did not "incorrectly calculate" Ackbar's cost. Yes he works on more ships. The point was to show you a direct comparison on an Imperial ship base vs a shop that has Ackbar and throws almost the same number of dice. Which happens to be the vehicle I think we will see him the most on.

Yes you did. You are comparing his Flagship against a totally different ship without a commander in a one on one basis.

When you only look at one single ship, every commander is overcosted. You mentioned your second AFII still costing 79 points - so Ackbar just became functionally less expensive (not actually less expensive, just to be clear.)

You did not correctly evaluate his cost when considering an entire fleet. That's what I was saying.

I didn't quote the rest because I don't care. The card has obviously caused confusion, that's the confusion that does need to be cleared up. I don't really care how clear you think the card reads because quite obviously many people aren't as clear, or have different interpretations than you. I don't even have a different interpretation and your being hostile about it, so I don't know what your deal is.

The point was to show you a direct comparison on an Imperial ship base vs a shop that has Ackbar

just cause

After the war Ackbar went into managing a small chain of coffee shops

This is not XI7 Turbolasers vs Advanced Projectors there is no inherent ambiguity in the relations of words here.

Fine let's make it simple.

Commander Darth Vader. His ability states when a ship is attacking so it must mean just one attack from a Gunnery Teams not both, right? Must be, by your interpretation because Ackbar is by attacking a ship as well.

Why does anyone think that in a game as flexible in Tactics, strategy, and dynamics like Armada, that the designers would make a Commander who only functions in a single method such as attacking from both sides? Where is the logic in that?

As for hostile, I really am not. I am actually confused and don't understand why people's interpretations are as such and have asked this a few times now.

I guess my context can be construed as such but it's not my intention. If it came out that way I am sorry.

Because another poster got a response that even FFG possibly considers the ability up in the air. So provided that there isn't some miscommunication between that poster and FFG, which is entirely possible (hopefully probable), there is clearly alot questionable.

You needed to have FFG explicitly tell you that you can't stack ships during deployment and that you can't measure from any ship during a single ships "Determine Course" step. You've found much less questionable things questionable.

As for the response, I got the same thing on a few questions regarding Rieekan and some other topics of interest so it means nothing as has been stated.

The point was to show you a direct comparison on an Imperial ship base vs a shop that has Ackbar

just cause

After the war Ackbar went into managing a small chain of coffee shops

If pointing out your posting history is being hostile that says alot about your posting history.