squadrons are beautiful

remember the gencon special is made to game the m.o.v system to run the gambit up to the top place

not to say at all that its engineer didn't have to, you know, actually play the **** game to get there, but the forum-generated terror of it is all smoke and mirrors

it is not a dominating list as much as a system-gaming list. It's terrifying because GSDs with ACMs are terrifying, but it's not even close to the be all, end all of Armada

it's deathly allergic to B-wings

I saw the player who came in first at Gencon with that list in a 20 person Sullust event and he came in 13th. Now dont get me wrong he is an excellent player but his list isnt the end all be all that everyone thought. He was up against equally skilled players at this event and it became apparent that all things being equal that list is good but not a meta defining build.

and now the poor dear GSDs are going to have to adapt

we've learned already that they're right scary and flexible ships, but we've also recently learned what happens when they run into a bunch of gunnery team + Akbar assault frigates (spoilers: it ain't pretty )

we're in for some turbulent, fun times where the meta is concerned

I took first in swiss with 2 Xwings, a Y-wing, and 2 B's. In the final I ran no fighters (except the mandated one ship from the new fighter pack) and won that too. It seems you can do well with fighters or without.

I won our 6 person tournament (and another game against a friend) with this list: http://armada.fabpsb.net/permalink.php?sq=r3c2o8s1f9r4s1f3r1o3f7r15r14r12r11r6r6

I'd only played 1 game prior to the tournament, just read some online about how all ship lists were winning. Meh, wasn't too worried about anything but a fighter heavy imperial fleet. (I think that the Imperial fighters are better than the Rebel ones, based on cost, and speed, though I haven't tried the theory out.) Though Round 1 made me wonder, and worry. (Made a few tactical mistakes on maneuvering.)

First was against ships only. VSD + Demolisher + 2 non-upgraded Glads. Fighters and Yavaris took out Demolisher before it got too close. Because No. Unfortunately, the other Glads made my Nebs very un-glad. Then the corvette had swung around and the fighters (Which the VSD ran headlong into) blew up the VSD (It was very close, with what seemed like the last possible shot.) I misordered engineering and squad on Yavaris, otherwise I think another of the Glads would have bit the dust. (Wouldn't have saved my Neb Bs for more than a turn at most.)

Second was vs Gallant Haven and 4 A-wings (+AFM2 and Neb B) Hadn't seen Gallant Haven, which hurt, I'd expected a single round sweep, it took 2 to take out 3 of his A-Wings with my fighters, and Tycho ran, after Killing Wedge, but left my fighters in range to kill Gallant Haven. Tycho hunted down Tycho and they both died. The rest of my fighters were damaged, but alive. Then the AFM2 barely managed to avoid the fighters or the side, and the Neb-Bs chased futility after his Neb B.

Third battle was vs 2 VSDs, 7 fighters: Howlrunner, 2 Ints, and 4 TIE Fighters. Talk about a furball. The only one that wasn't in it was the corvette, and that was because it was swinging around after having been hurt by a VSD (did get back in range on round 6) There was a station, my fighters took it, and held it, with the TIEs killing Wedge (but soaking up all but 1 of the attacks, of the 5 in range, who attacked thanks to a pair of squadron commands.) He was quickly avenged, leaving 2 regular TIEs. The furball continued, with the ships arriving. Ending up with both VSDs gone, and only losing Wedge.

In the tournament game, I ran a carrier VSD + New ships + 4 Regular Ties, Boba and Bossck (about 80 points if I recall, I had a moment of adding things up going to 360 and going, crap, what do I cut, then remembering it's 400!). Vs AFM2 + New + 2 X, 2 B, Han Han tried to plink at the ISD, not too succesfully, and the VSD spamming Squadron let me take out all of his fighters for no loss. (Sometimes activating the villians, even if they'd get rogue. Situational) The Raider went bewm, but Bossck finished off the MC80, after the ISD got a chunk of it. (Almost had a TIE fighter do it, but it missed. Could have tried again (and gotten it in squad), but I wanted it dead before the next ship fired a broadside!) We called it at that point, as the only action would have been the fighters getting Han (2 were already engaged), and us turning away from edges (all ships could do it. There might have been a turn where they could have hit the VSD, but it would have been long range, without Ackbar.)

X-wings are probably the most efficient overall rebel ship. I think in my list I probably will replace Tycho with either another X-wing or B-wing. It's all about using them efficiently. So far going: opposing fighters first in matches, then worry about ships has worked well. I think I made the opposing first round player a believer in fighters.

Edited for not-wall of text

I couldn't agree more, Biggs. I mean, I'm honestly still trying to get B-wings to work for me, but I think I'm going to be practising with two Y-wings and a single X-wing as my 'ratio'. There's no discrepancy in movement, and with things like Mauler and Fel doing automatic damage, both X's and in particular Y's can really take a beating where as A's just can't.

I'm seriously rethinking how I'm doing squadrons in the wake of Sullust. Theory-crafting is great, but it's no replacement for practice. The experience has been showing me that after turn 1, the A wing's speed isn't as enormous a factor as I had taken it to be. They are still great for pre-empting a bombing run acting as an interceptor, but we already knew that. If there is another pre-wave 2 tournament, you can bet that X-wings are going to be making an appearance, while B's may be relegated to the hangars, and the A's are there 'in spirit' (Tycho the Ghost, maybe?) while the X's roll in to protect their soft, fluffy little butts. The Y wings, oh, they're staying put. They've yet to fail me. Of course, this is all just anti-rebel experience, where as my specialist list did pretty well ruining Rhymer's Roughnecks and letting my Y's be a nuisance.

X-wings: with that many blue attacks, the accuracy result starts getting awfully scary to those aces. X-wings really are a great general purpose, and a lot of the time, it's what I'd have loved to have to keep my specialists intact... okay, my A-wings and B-wings intact. The Y-wings are a bunch of tough ol' gals.

Had 4 Awings (with Tycho) and 2 Bwings

The one that won 2 of the events here was packing 2 Whales and 10 Y wings..

I took Tycho, 2 a-wings, and 4 y-wings. I won all my matches.

Also, the tourney I went to saw two Rhymer balls face off. It was pretty epic, and ended after 110 minutes in the 4th round.

I won the swiss in my LGS small 4 man tournament with the following.

Dodonna, x2 AF2B w/ Vet. Captain, Gunnery Team & Enhanced Armament, 4As & 4Xs

Since I was right at 400, I had to pick my poison in all 3 rounds of swiss. Two of the other players ran a moderate amount of squadrons and the last player didn't run any (Screed, 2 Vic1, 2Glad2). Every game I managed at least 1 pre-emptive strike usually with the A-wings and that made a big difference in all of my games. I also ran almost exclusively squadron commands on my dials, so when my squadrons did get engaged they generally won without having to commit much back up. I never quite lost an Assault Frigate, actually I never lost a ship the entire day but I was far too close for comfort a couple of times.

In the final game I ran: Ackbar, MC 80 (I don't recall the exact upgrades but I had EA & ECM) MC30 (TRC and other things), 4 Bs, 2Xs, Han & Dash

against: Screed, ISD2, Raider1, Glad1 (Demolisher, Wulf & Engine Techs), Boba, IG-88 and Rhymer.

I killed the Gladiator turn 2 with Han, Dash & the MC30 (Ackbar + TRC is scary!!!). Lost Dash to Boba & IG-88 but killed them both Han, Dash and the Xs. Then Han ran down Rhymer while the MC80 munched the Raider. Finally the MC80 and B-wings killed the ISD2 turn 6 after 2 turns of shooting.

I play Imperials as well and I almost ran:

Motti, x2 Vic1 w/ Veteran Captain, Gunnery Team & Expanded Hangar Bay, Rhymer, 2 Adv, Howlrunner & 5 TIEs...

Needless to say I'm very excited for Boosted Comms... I don't have all the models or cards yet but I want to try:

Ackbar, x3 AF2B w/ Support Officer, Boosted Comms & ECM and 9 A-wings...

I don't really get that vibe. In fact it's even better...people are doing well with ALL sorts of lists, including no squadrons, a few, or maxed out.

Seems to be down to player preference and the local scene. Good sign nonetheless.

This.

The meta was always an illusion.

¿Que?

What Extropia is saying is that local meta matters. How can you say it's an illusion, then?

Also, the tourney I went to saw two Rhymer balls face off. It was pretty epic, and ended after 110 minutes in the 4th round.

Yup, one of those Rhymerballs was mine, and I won a previous tournament with it too. Also, my Rhymerball was pretty fat (Rhymer, Vader, Soontir and 5x TIE Bomber).

The other tournaments I went to still had a few squadronless builds. One (a 3x AFMII list) even won first place at the tournament that I ran. I promised the player that if I had been playing, my Rhymerball would have taken her apart. (she's a Rebel, I stand tall for the Empire; we banter.) Regrettably, I didn't get paired against her in order to test that proposition in the subsequent tournament.