I've got to echo the sentiment that the TIE/ld doesn't really fit the game though as the TIE fighter is the points floor.

That depends what you think the game is there to do; is it a abstract competitive thing, with an interesting Star Wars skin, or is it a way of simulating Star Wars fighter combat? If you think it's the latter, then there's absolutely a reason to think up stats for this thing* - it exist in the setting, after all. It'd be like leaving T-34s out of a WW2 game because otherwise the Russian player could bring hundreds of them and break the game.

Yes, it breaks the competitive game; whether that's sufficient reason to exclude it is a matter that can be discussed. I suspect I'm in a very small minority, though.

​

*OK, OK; this depends on your opinion of the "canonicity" of the 3rd-party inventions. Still, we've already got the TIE Defender, Punisher, K-Wing and Decimator, so why not this?

That depends what you think the game is there to do; is it a abstract competitive thing, with an interesting Star Wars skin, or is it a way of simulating Star Wars fighter combat? If you think it's the latter, then there's absolutely a reason to think up stats for this thing* - it exist in the setting, after all. It'd be like leaving T-34s out of a WW2 game because otherwise the Russian player could bring hundreds of them and break the game.

So does the DIE-wing, and the flimsier prequel craft, all of which are reasonably cheaper than a TIE fighter. In terms of designing something you'd release to the game at large, you've got to consider balance. The problem under 12 points is you either become unbalanced by the exponential rise in ships as you drop in points, or the game mechanics start to break down when you put their stats too low.

If you have a 2 attack ship, then your firepower goes through the roof as you drop in points. If you make it a 1 attack ship then some high agility ships are all but immune to it. They'll chew up Decimators but a phantom could probably solo a 12 fighter squad of them. The 1 attack die ship is simply impractical, and the 2 attack die ship becomes too powerful when spammed.

Had DarthEnderX not specified that he'd want to be able to run 12 of them, I'd have suggested making the TIE/ld limited in number such that you could only field two of them. I'd then maintain the 2 die attack but strip it down to a 2 hull, 2 agility (not as much of a debuff as it sounds when you consider it retains Evade) ship without Barrel Roll.

Some quick thoughts I had:

If 2 attack seems too many, and 1 attack not enough, what if it had 2 attack but the Title said "At the end of the Combat Phase, assign a Weapons Disabled token to your ship if it does not have one. Your ship gains Action: Remove one Weapons Disabled token from your ship." You could still have 2 attack, but they would be unmodified*, and you're not shooting if you're stressed, or bump, etc. You could even throw in something like "you do not get range combat bonuses when attacking" if necessary.

Speaking of bumping, if there's a worry that too many of these would be a bumping, parking lot nightmare, how about something like a reverse Arvel Crynyd? "Ships touching you may declare you as the target of an attack." And maybe even "Ships touching you may perform actions as normal."

All this said, I kinda agree with others that this ship doesn't fit in in the standard, competitive format. But for casual play, scenarios, epic play, it could be interesting.

*Mostly. I know, Squad Leader, Fleet Officer, etc.

I suppose another way to get "1.5 Attack" could be to say that Critical Hit effects count as blanks for this ship.

1.5 attack would still mean a swarm of 12 has 18 attack dice. The hard part of designing a TIE light duty is to prevent it from being a more effective combatant than the TIE while working in the very limited low point design space.

I'm thinking from the "simulationist" side of things, and specifically for special scenarios. I'd be quite happy with a "not for tournaments" label on this thing.

In that case, is balancing it for spam necessary at all? If it's a scenario special rule rather than a freely equippable upgrade then just grab some Academy Pilots, knock the statline to 2/2/2/0, remove the barrel roll, increase the pilot skill by 2 (it's easier to fly) and off you go. No point adjustment necessary.

Don't even bother with a point cost.

My take:

(only -3 points, though)

Could go "You do not receive range bonuses" outright to represent the downgraded everything.

Don't forget to include the impact on Epic games as well. A 100 point swarm of these things could take down a Huge ship in a single turn without some sort of mitigating effect.

Lol

A one attack ship would not be worth the hassle.

Sure it might make a good blocker but for 7 points I could have a HLC in m list and use an ever trusty academy pilot as a blocker that can also contribute in the attack phase.

A one attack ship would not be worth the hassle.

If it's not too good for the HWK, it's not too good for the TIE/ld

1 Attack

1 Evade

1 Hull

no actions

... just to make sure that it isnt used ever ;P

If all the ships were PS0, would you care if they had 2 attack dice?

PS0

2 Attack

2 Agility

2 HP

8 pts

-1 hull -1 agility and take away the k turn

you can survive one pass of 12 of them. Probably. Or you can, y'know, fly your ships and not take all 12 on the nose.

If all the ships were PS0, would you care if they had 2 attack dice?

Not really. The difference between a PS1 pilot and a PS0 pilot is pretty negligible.

Don't forget to include the impact on Epic games as well. A 100 point swarm of these things could take down a Huge ship in a single turn without some sort of mitigating effect.

Epic has a rule that limits you to 12 of any small based ship, because TIE swarms are scary enough at that size.

What about PS0 2/2/2/0, but they also have "you cannot reroll attack dice"? That prevents the threat of a stronger Howlrunner swarm. If that's still too good it could be changed to "can't modify attack dice" but I think playtestng would be needed to sort that one out.

Thank goodness this will never happen.

I suppose another way to get "1.5 Attack" could be to say that Critical Hit effects count as blanks for this ship.

I like this as 2/2/2/0. No critical effects, and only 3/8 chance of actually doing damage.