...in order for it to cost 8 points?

The idea here is simple. A hypothetical Title card for the TIE Fighter to represent the TIE Light Duty from SWG.

The goal is to make this Title worth -4 point. So that, theoretically, you could fit a full squadron of 12 into a 100 point list.

So the question becomes, how *****y does this card have to be in order to justify a -4 point cost to the TIE Fighter?

Is -1 Attack enough? Would it also need -1 Hull? Opinions.

-1 agility should suffice.

-1 agility should suffice.

Umm, no. You have just created the ultimate in the Howlrunner Swarm. You cannot have 2+ Atk if you are under 12 pts.

1 Atk, 2 Agi, and 2 Hull.

1 atk, 2 agi, 2 hull, removal of barrel roll, removal of 5 forward and 1 hards. that's pretty terrible, is it not?

1 atk, 2 agi, 2 hull, removal of barrel roll, removal of 5 forward and 1 hards. that's pretty terrible, is it not?

Yeah, but that feels like a lot more than 4 points worth of terrible.

1 atk, 2 agi, 2 hull, removal of barrel roll, removal of 5 forward and 1 hards. that's pretty terrible, is it not?

Yeah, but that feels like a lot more than 4 points worth of terrible.

I feel like 12 of those makes up for it. Maybe give them 2 actions a turn.

1A on ships would just be too poor. Maybe -1 Agility and -1Hull.

1A on ships would just be too poor. Maybe -1 Agility and -1Hull.

2 attack is too much though, If they want to keep 2 attack they need to sacrifice a LOT of other stuff. All the stuff i said plus more.

Like 2 attack with 12 ships is 24 dice a turn. They need to be severely handicapped in other areas to be able to keep that attack value.

ew 1 attack.

upon thinking about this more. doubtful this game needs a ship like this.

I don't think there should ever be a ship that only costs 8 points. But I could see a 10 or 11 point TIE/D (the droid fighter). 2 attack, 2 agility, 3 hull, 0 shields.

Dunno why no one has suggested messing with dial. Put some red on that thing, like right there at the 1-turns for a start. And the 5 straight. And maybe a couple more areas.

Give it a title called T.I.E. fighter that gives a 'no attack' token when stressed. This represents the power drain on the ship that was fixed later with the TIE and the /ln model when a separate power generator was installed. Dunno if that's worth -4 points but it can't be a ship that's worth 12 or 11 points any more.

2 Attack, 4 agility, 1 hull. It's also a bit more realistic in terms of how TIEs are represented in the movies.

I like the one hull idea. Sure you could have a killer howl runner swarm but 1 assault missle would wreck the whole list. I can see it possible but agree it isn't needed or useful. Now some 1 hull ships with like 4 agi 3 attack power for a 15-20 window of points and I see opportunities.

12 of them with 2 attack would be pretty **** strong, even with only 2 Hull and agility. So i guess it would have to be 1 attack...

I don't think the game needs it. There might be a specific support ship or 2 in the future that can be 10-11pts and still offer value but I can't see an attack ship fulfilling that role. I think the closest I can get would be 2/2/2/0 no actions and a z dial for light duty.

For droid I still like 2/3/2/0, whites only on the dial, BR and TL and evade for actions, and "droid" trait: ignore stress, ignore non-droid pilot abilities. Might even have a tech slot.

Dunno why no one has suggested messing with dial.

Mainly because messing with the dial is kind of a pain in the butt for a Title card.

I'm sure it doesn't, and I couldn't care less.

"TIE Light Duty starfighters had inferior components, lighter armor, and less firepower in order not to be too dangerous to novice pilots. This reduction in firepower also helped to put less stress on fragile reactors and superstructures."

Rolling 1 attack die is a bit harsh. Assuming it needs to be a Title card and not just a new ship, then how about something that says it may not make Primary Weapon Attacks, but gains something like the TLT, but that can only attack once, and only in its fire arc (OK, so that'd be a single laser cannon ) If that adds too many odd effects, just make the title say "you may never inflict more than one hit result or critical hit result in each Attack".

It's almost as if the designers knew 12 points should be the lowest points a ship should be...

If you feel that 2 Attack is too much, and 1 Attack is too little, how about 2 attack but it can not fire next turn?

Back at GenCon 2014 Alex Davy said they wouldn't make ships under 12 points.

A single point is worth more on a cheaper ship, because the more you have the more times that cost is replicated. That's why the +2 PS generic for TIEs and Z-95s is only one point more.

When you drop to 11 points, you remove that point from eight ships if you're running a full swarm. That results in a 9 ship squad. 10 points? 10 ship squad. 9 points? 11 ship squad. At 8, you could run 12 of these things. Plus, 12 ships in a standard game slows it down a lot, and gives you insane blocking power.

Rolling 1 attack die is a bit harsh. Assuming it needs to be a Title card and not just a new ship, then how about something that says it may not make Primary Weapon Attacks, but gains something like the TLT, but that can only attack once, and only in its fire arc (OK, so that'd be a single laser cannon ) If that adds too many odd effects, just make the title say "you may never inflict more than one hit result or critical hit result in each Attack".

That's still 12 damage a round, and with TLT-style dice backup.

-1 Attack I'd say is an absolute necessity. I'd also give it -1 hull and remove the Barrel Roll action.

I've got to echo the sentiment that the TIE/ld doesn't really fit the game though as the TIE fighter is the points floor.

I imagine a TIE with 2 Att, 2 Def, 2 Hull, 0 shields will see a few dropped in the first round of combat before they even fire.

Maybe make them PS0 with said inferior dial?

The highest total attack value a list can have as it stands is 16, which is an 8 swarm, a squad of four HLC Scyks or four Sigma phantoms. If the TIE Light Duty has 2 attack, it throws 24 dice a round. The low quality training TIE becomes the deadliest list in the game.

Even if every ship you have drops one, if you've got four ships then you've still got the firepower of a full TIE swarm coming at you.

-1 Attack I'd say is an absolute necessity. I'd also give it -1 hull and remove the Barrel Roll action.

I think this is probably the answer I agree with the most. It seems fair for -4 points. It fits the lore.

Plus, removing the Barrel Roll helps with the slowing down of the game with 12 ships that you mentioned. Your movement phase is limited to taking your move then throwing on a token.

I don't think FFG would be comfortable with more than 8 ships in a game, to be honest, and I think that's good.