well, I'm back from sullest and the hype is real

The 4th round saw Akbar and Vader going at it and holy crap does Akbar hit hard

Having seen the power of Akbar for the first time, and having been playing Yavarised Bs for a long **** time now, I wanted to take a gander at the Counter Shrimp (mc30) which, let's be honest, is basically a love child of the two

Setting Riekan aside for this post (because his ability really deserves to be table tested, though I imagine he'll be disgusting with Turbo-laser reroute cr-90s), the shrimp really seems a decent fit with at least Garm and MM, but it is an obvious fit with Akbar

Under him, Scout Frigates take their broadsides up to redredredred plus a fifth off of concentrate fire. With gunnery team, two evades and two redirects, those armaments alone are enough to make the Shrimp a long range terror that just so happens to pack some nifty black dice as insurance.

fly 3 of them escorting Home One

go 2 and 2 with gunnery fatties and shrimps

the possibilities are readily evident and exciting

But I have some concerns,

After having worked with Yavarised Bs for a long while now, the Scout Frigate's black dice honestly seem...underwhelming. Yeah, it's 5 dice off of a small base ship, but two Yavarised B-wings are a-better-than-ISD-front-arc split across enough attacks to mitigate defensive tokens.

We also have to deal with the fact that the Shrimp is not suited to close-combat like the aggressive Gladiator, which has relevant defensive tokens at a cheaper asking price (ACM GSD-1s clocking in at the same as a Torp Frigate naked). People may that umbrage with me comparing cross faction, but let's be real: the GSD is the Shrimp's competition and possibly the primary reason to take a shrimp in the first place.

Anyway, the Shrimp does not seem built nor priced to be an efficient close-ranged terror, and it certainly has no Demolisher equivalent. So, what're we really working with here?

Probably the biggest pro of the Shrimp is simply that it's not awkward like the Nebulon even though it shares the exact same nav chart; speed 4 excluded. Now, I love the Neb to death but it is a very difficult ship to fly properly. While the shrimp certainly won't be cake, it does at least have the decency to expose its strong-arcs like it's big-bro, the Assault Frigate.

That doesn't seem like a lot on internet-paper, but in games it'll make a world of difference. The Yavaris + B-wing combo is the strongest damage source Rebels can offer, but it is stiff and not terribly suited to tackling ships that don't like diving onto your face. The shrimp, however, not only has the nav chart & speed (it's got Neb turns at speed 3!) to match these long range craft, but it's got the tokens and shields to perform at those ranges as well.

What we're looking at, it seems, is a skill-intensive generalist that needs to exploit the crap out of range control in order to operate at peek effectiveness. Initiative will probably be a must, given you can swing in with the Shrimp and then activate first, dump black dice on some poor bastard, and then Zoidberg your way to safety.

Or, you could make them come to you with Akbar

I'm pretty excited about these guys, partially for the new playstyles they offer (love B-wings, but I need a break!), partially because I think they'll be maligned after the initial hype when they prove to be difficult to play.

or maybe I just want the Turbolaser Reroutes and I need an excuse to buy two...

Currently, I'm mulling over upgrade choices because this thing is expensive but offers so much variety. I believe, at the moment, that we'll have to eye these:

Gunnery Team - basically auto-include with Akbar; really abuses his ability

Advanced Projectors - your substitute for brace, basically

Turbo-laser Reroutes - very excited for this card in particular. Probably not something you'd use with Akbar (shrimps get expensive with just gunnery and projectors!), but possibly something to use when taking the Scout with MM or Garm or even Big-D

Raymus - double strength navigates (or a free reserve token) for all your range controlling needs, plus re-rolls with CF, +1 shield during repairs, and your chance to act out all your fantasies of being an Escort Neb

I do wonder, however, if the ordnance slot is worth it. This isn't a ship that lives and breathes at close range ala the GSD, so I'm not sure how ideal it'll be. Of course, we all know Big-D is drooling over those assault torpedoes...

Excellent write up. I had to lol at myself though...my eyes glazed over when you started comparing it to B wings. I really think thats a matter of personal preference and list building type. For a no-fighter list, this guy is AMAZING. For someone like me who is ok with sacrificing a ship to get damage in, also amazing. Plus I suck at maneuvering B wings so lol, wont be switching to them soon.

Making that comparison though, it would be a shame not to point out the Independence title

You wouldn't take Foresight? Its almost advanced projectors and it doubles your evades effectiveness, especially at long range.

I like the blue version myself (blue plus black dice), though I think it will need some help to survive to get its hits in.

Im thinking assault torpedoes, ordnance experts, admonition, advanced projectors and either Lando, or have the fleet led by Mon Mothma.

Makes for an expensive ship, (90 points), though compared to a scout version with Foresight and gunnery team (84 points) doesn't seem too bad....

So, me and Mikael went at it at the Massing of sullust tonight and I took a Scout Shrimp with Gunnery Teams, Enhanced Armament (I think XI7 should go here), and Assault Proton Torpedos. This thing is a BEAST! It got into close range with its side and through my own fault I was double arcing so though I had Akbar I did not use him. I got a face up crit on a GSD and demolished its shields. This thing pumps damage like no other! I want to run 2 or 3!

+++ MC30c raid! (399pts) +++

++ Rebel Fleet (Standard) (399pts) ++

+ Assault Frigate MkII (123pts) +

Assault Frigate Mark IIB (123pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Gunnery Team (7pts), •Admiral Ackbar (38pts)]

+ MC30c Frigate (276pts) +

MC30c Scout Frigate (92pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Gunnery Team (7pts), XX-9 Turbolasers (5pts)]

MC30c Scout Frigate (92pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Gunnery Team (7pts), XX-9 Turbolasers (5pts)]

MC30c Scout Frigate (92pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Gunnery Team (7pts), XX-9 Turbolasers (5pts)]

What about versus an opponent with two ISDs? Isn't that one shot city, leaving the Assault Frigate to a terrible doom at the end?

What about versus an opponent with two ISDs? Isn't that one shot city, leaving the Assault Frigate to a terrible doom at the end?

I dont think they will be able to end it. With 4 Activations I should have the capacity to pick and choose.

Put them in cocktail sauce ;-p

You wouldn't take Foresight? Its almost advanced projectors and it doubles your evades effectiveness, especially at long range.

honestly, not sure

it's an easy addition with MM, for sure, and probably going to be worth including for 2 points over projectors

problem is it leaves one of your hull-zones untouched like a bad-itch, and considering you're going to be broad-siding it's probably going to be the far side (3 shields)

not sure I'd ever go above two upgrades, though. Low 80s is already pushing the boundaries of Afmk2, which is a far more stable ship

I got 2 lists that needs testing when they come out

First is Akbar on an AF with another AF (gunnery) and two shrimps. (Gunnery, projectors) and 4 awings

Second is Mm on a cr-90a escorted by two more cr-90as (turbolaser reroute) then a shrimp (turbolaser reroute and projectors)

And then Raymus + foresight. Interesting implications on him, as foresight + the extra nav token should really encourage playing around with ranges

Cap off with two yt2400s and dash (or just a third generic for more bid)

I don't think I'll ever play without squadrons; not my thing

_{having run an MC30 at sullust let me say ordinance experts and assault proton torpedoes are worth their weight in gold that little ship can wreck stuff and FYI on an average roll from a ISD 2 front arc it can still survive, its really hurt but still alive enough to cause significant damage and if you get double arcs and take the torpedoes you can make a mess of even an ISD, don't discount them just because they seem expensive run it how you like and see how it works, you may be surprised I know I was that ship caused significant damage just with the torpedoes. but of course just my opinion.}

While I agree that the MC30 can fill the role of long range gunboat very well, I disagree that that is their best role in the Rebel fleet. Why? Because that is a role that Assault Frigates and MC80's already fill very well.

What they offer, that no other rebel ship can, is the chance to unload black dice en masse. In fact, they may be better suited to the close-range attack role than the Gladiator.

Again, why?

1) Blues and Blacks combine very, very well. The chance for accuracies (especially with a Home One boost) really stops those single brace tokens cold.

2) Advanced Projectors. With 11 shields available, it is guaranteed to withstand a single volley from anyone, no matter the size. That gives it the chance to survive a turn, unload its own ordinance, and get out.

3) Great speed 3 nav chart. Then use nav token to get out of dodge at speed 4!

4) Ordnance Experts. Makes your big shot count! The opportunity to reroll all black dice is.....HUGE.

It also pairs extremely well with Rieekan - ensuring you get your death volley if necessary.

Again, keys to using it up close:

A) Go first. Activate last the turn beforehand.

B) Advanced Projectors.

C) Did I mention Advanced Projectors?

D) Go speed 3.

I'm in love with this thing.

Kind of off topic with where the thread has gone but I think Yavaris B's potentially got a lot better with the Independence title for the MC80. Take a low bid so you go first, keep 3 B's back with the MC80 and use Yavaris to escort your fighter screen. This keeps the B's from getting engaged, then when the time is right near the end of the turn you speed 4 jump them into range of a big enemy threat. Yavaris activates first next round to unload with three b's into their big threat. Takes a little bit of planning but that is B-Wings. It will be a lot harder to see coming or prevent.

Yea. Speed 3nisbthe sweet spot for this ship. With the combination of a small base it can easily create a T on medium and large ships for the double arc next turn

+++ Mantis Shrimps (396pts) +++

++ Rebel Fleet (Standard) (396pts) ++

+ MC30c Frigate (332pts) +

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (98pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts), •General Dodonna (20pts)]

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (78pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts)]

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (78pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts)]

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (78pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts)]

+ Squadrons (64pts) +

YT-2400 (16pts)

YT-2400 (16pts)

YT-2400 (16pts)

YT-2400 (16pts)

+ Objectives +

Assault Objective [Advanced Gunnery]

Defense Objective [Fleet Ambush]

Navigation Objective [intel Sweep]

Likely won't work but it will be fun!

I plan to absolutely try that out

+++ Mantis Shrimps (396pts) +++

++ Rebel Fleet (Standard) (396pts) ++

+ MC30c Frigate (332pts) +

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (98pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts), •General Dodonna (20pts)]

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (78pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts)]

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (78pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts)]

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (78pts) [Advanced Projectors (6pts), Assault Proton Torpedoes (5pts), Ordnance Experts (4pts)]

+ Squadrons (64pts) +

YT-2400 (16pts)

YT-2400 (16pts)

YT-2400 (16pts)

YT-2400 (16pts)

+ Objectives +

Assault Objective [Advanced Gunnery]

Defense Objective [Fleet Ambush]

Navigation Objective [intel Sweep]

Likely won't work but it will be fun!

I'm going to try that out too versus my dual ISD list with lots of bombers I'm looking forward to trying (6-7 bombers, dengar, and T/A making up the balance of 10 total). The way I see it going down is a head to head with the ISDs at speed three (I don't see how you can avoid going speed three with the shrimp as well, as you must close the distance as two uncontested shooting rounds by the ISDs and bombers will own you). The ISDs will probably get one round of shooting before you get in range with the black dice, so you might lose one; with 6-7 bombers shooting at you, there's a very good chance one dies to bomber fire alone, or it drains the shields to your redirect can't stop two shots hitting hull. So, I think you easily lose one.

Then, you'll get to shoot with three (if only two the match is already over), hopefully all on one ISD. If not, it can burn both of its contains to prevent any face up crits. That's the key, if you can get a debilitating crit to come up, it might have a problem for a round until engineering can repair it, in the meantime perhaps you can cripple it more and get the kill eventually. However, after this one round of shooting the ISDs and you will zoom past each other if you didn't get the right crit, and the bombers stick around and probably kill another one. After three turns of shooting the YT2400s may have killed the T/A and Dengar, but if two shrimp are down then the tactic will be to just run away with the remaining fighters (although with flight controllers the bombers will be throwing 12-14 dice against probably three remaining YTs, so depending on who's ahead in fighter battle they may be able to stick around and slug it out too--shooting at ships with counter plus Mithel doing 2-3 auto damage on every squadron will be pretty brutal).

It'd be an interesting match and could go either way, but I think a massive bomber swarm will tilt the balance in favor of the ISDs, especially for any objectives that aren't full on assault mode as the bombers can go in and do some work while the ISDs just sit back and wait.

List:

Ship Upgrade Points Quantity Total

ISD-I 110 2 220

Expanded Hangers 5 2 10

Boosted Comms 4 2 8

Flight Controllers 6 2 12

Motti 24 1 24

Rymer 16 1 16

Bombers 9 5 45

TIE Advanced 12 2 24

Dengar 20 1 20

Mauler Mithel 15 1 15

394

How about one MC80 with a bunch of shrimp? That would be interesting, because it can broadside at long range and perhaps kill an ISD that you've wounded even after they zoom past the shrimp.

397 points buys you

Akbar on Home One (command)

3 Scout Shrimps with gunnery team and projectors

Home One sounds like a no brainer title when you involve that many red and black dice

I agree Home One is a great idea--it will guarantee that the ISDs' Contains can't stop the critical card (and if you get lucky you can cancel the brace too), so you have a reasonable chance of crippling one pretty bad in the exchange. If you are able to choose to mess up the engines or down all the shields, then you have a reasonable chance of being able to finish it off by the end of the match.

With Home one in the match, I feel like the best bet is to try to keep the ISDs at distance and let the bombers do some work first.

Or, I could just drop the gunnery teams for X17 turbolasers. Then the shrimp will go down hard.

Turbolaser Reroute is worth it every time.

Yeah, that would own if they try to keep distance.

BTW, I just realized that Instigator defeats Intel, as the Instigator is not a squadron, so the Heavy effect of Intel doesn't apply. So, it's a way to roll up and defeat my Rymer ball above pretty hard, at least for the turn or two before the ship dies to the bombers. One benefit of Chiraneau over Dengar would be that you can get out of the grasp of the Instigator with that ability.

Oh Silly Imperials.

You let the Enemy come to you. And then you Rabbit away (Like a total coward!)! The MC-30 can easily survive a long ranged volley from both a ISD and a VSD.

When the MC-30 Comes out. My list will be:

Fleet: 400 pts (My game group tends to bid for second player.)

MC-30 Scout - Ackbar + Foresight

MC-30 Scout - No Upgrades

CR-90A - Enhanced Armaments

CR-90A - Enhanced Armaments

CR-90A - Enhanced Armaments

CR-90A - Enhanced Armaments

Yeah, that would own if they try to keep distance.

BTW, I just realized that Instigator defeats Intel, as the Instigator is not a squadron, so the Heavy effect of Intel doesn't apply. So, it's a way to roll up and defeat my Rymer ball above pretty hard, at least for the turn or two before the ship dies to the bombers. One benefit of Chiraneau over Dengar would be that you can get out of the grasp of the Instigator with that ability.

small problem with that:

Instigator > intel

bombers >>>>>>>>>>>>>. poor little instigator

it's basically your opponent serving up a free ship

If it can delay them one turn, it might be worth it in certain circumstances. Also, Instigator plus some Interceptors might be able to kill Dengar in that one turn. Instigator plus some focused double-blue fire from ships and some interceptors might be really effective. Just think of it as a one-turn delay that you need to utilize very carefully.

Anyway, six black is not a guaranteed kill in one turn, and in fact that would be very unlikely. If timed with an engineering command or an engineering plus token command, it could survive two turns almost half the time (if someone wants to really do the calcs, love to know the actualy percentages). Keeping a Rymer ball from hitting for two turns in a bomber-heavy build would be pretty devastating as in the meantime you've probably ended up way behind in the damage war.

6 bomber dice + fingers-crossed that an enemy ship doesn't just obliterate it

that's one thing a lot of people tend to overlook when forming and facing bomber heavy builds: the ships still matter and they can really hurt like the dickens

UI just came back from at Sullust, where i ended 5th place :'(
But i got to see the final, and albeight the dice and Crit gods was on the Shrimps side.

But it went in with a Hyperspace assault right behind a ISD, then dobbelarced the S*** out of it, and after its shooting had done 20 dmg to it. Removing Front shields with a crit, side shields with a redirect and rear shields and punched a lot of dmg through. Then Home one bursted it with 8 red dice and BOOM ISD done in 2 turns.

The power of the Shrimp was revealed to me! All HAIL HYPNO SHRIMP

(The other crit was, only allowing the ISD to shot once pr. shooting round. Alas the 2 most horrible crits it could take)