Since we are talking about rules that don't make much sense. Considering that ship points can be converted to profit factor on a 1 to 1 basis then rolling higher on table 1.5 is always better as it gives you more flexability. Why not just have 90 points and let the players split it how ever they want

I'm all for giving players more control over character creation, so that is what I'm doing (in addition to giving them 100 "points" to distribute to their characteristics rather than rolling randomly).

I think most players would make the ship that they want and then see what they had leftover for profit factor (which is just fine as long as they realize the more the spend on their vessel, the less dough they'll have in game).

I allow for a 10 point variance. If they roll 60/30, they can move 10 points around, but no more than that.

The points represent many centuries of a Rogue Trader Dynasty, profit built up over years, if not centuries. It would make little sense to give a player a 90 point Cruiser, and those players then not have any Profit for future use.

I mean, I give players anything they want weapon wise, so long as its not unique. As for the ship, they have to work within the limits or the rules; I just let them play with 10 points if they want.

To me the roll makes things interesting, but a GM can do what ever they want.

Personally I find players are more invested in something they have to work for it. So they are going to start with a Profit of 10, and no ship. After they nearly get themselves killed getting a ship. It will be just a hull, engines, and life support. Then it will take weeks of play to get the ship build up. By that point the players will be invested in the ship, and proud of all the neat personal gear they have. It's enjoyment you don't get sending ship points.

Dalnor Surloc said:

You, sir, are cruel.

Grand Inquisitor Fulminarex said:

The players get to pick every other part of their background, why not that? And the chart's minimums and maximums would still apply - so the best ship they could get would be a 70 pointer. It just seems that all of the rolls on the chart are about "equal," so I have no qualms with letting them pick which one best fits their backgrounds.

Leopold Cygnus said:

No cruel is the horrible suprises that will lurk in the depths of their ship. Let's just say that there are a number of black decks that need to be recovered. Some of which frightened the prior crew so much they walled off access and erased any mention of the deck(s).

^

I stand corrected.

@Dalonor: not allowing a ship is cuel, no the black decks. Starting PF 10? They will not be able to aquire anything, so even if they get a ship, is still going to be a hulk, nothing more!

Allowing the players to create their ship is way better. They can equip it according to their backgrounds (mainly according to the Rouge Trader's background). The PF and SP in our case were chosen (60SP / 30 PF) by the GM accordingto the Rouge Trader's background. Also there can be limitations during the creation of the ship - we were denied the choise of Light Cruisers and Cruisers - according to the background and the desired course of the campaign.

The black deck are a good idea, also you can keep the PC's struggling to keep their ship...

A roll like that can put a quick end to analysis paralysis. If all your players want a particluar kind of ship that's one thing. But if they are creating every permitation under the sun and being all undecided then the roll can set them in a particluar direction.

Dalnor Surloc said:

So, basically, you do not want to run a Rogue Trader game?

No I just have a different way of starting a rogue trader game. They now have a good raider and a decent profit factor.

Dalnor Surloc said:

If by "different" you mean "contrary to all the fluff on what a Rogue Trader is", then I'm inclined to agree.

I let my players pick a result from that table. They ended up taking the "new rogue trader dynasty" (it made sense considering the characters). I don't see any major problems with not forcing a random roll on the table.

Our GM let us pick from the table either. We chose max ship points, min Profit Factor (fluff wise an old Dynasty that has seen better days, which was most in line with my backstory as a Noble-Born Rogue Trader). Then we spent full 70 points on our light cruiser called Eradicator Tenebris . We all thought it'll be more fun to start near-broke but with an awesome ship, and so far we're not regretting it.

Morangias said:

I really think your understanding of what a Rogue Trader is is rather limited. There are a number of examples of Rogue Traders being dirt poor, and barely scraping by. (For example Magyar Marshrek in the Dust and Ash adventure in DotD.) Most Rogue Traders inherit their warrants, and nothing says that a RT suddenly comes into a lot of wealth just because the warrant drops in his lap. Nor that the warrant entitles them to a ship. (A brand new warrant might...) If the prior RT blew all the clan's wealth on some risky endeavour and lost everything then it's easy to explain an initial 10 profit factor. (Which is actually not that poor.) Is it counter to RAW sure, but I've never let the rules get in the way of a good idea..

No offense, just saying that I wouldn't like to participate in a campaign starting like this. The notion of somehow gaining a space ship from such a crappy start breaks the suspension of disbelief for me, because ships are rare and carefully monitored by the Imperium. Plus, when I sit down to play Rogue Trader, I expect exploration, adventure and scheming, not Bob the Shipbuilder. Whatever they did before actually getting the ship working is, in essence, not a game of Rogue Trader, just an overstretched intro.

I do think it's really something the GM should work with the Rogue Trader and/or all players with, if not deside outright. But, if you want to generate it randomly, it's set up for that. The variations all work, but they do create different feels to both the game and the dynasty. We, for example, got 30 profit, 60 Ship to start with, and selected a Cruiser with an incompitant crew and almost nothing on it as our starting ship. This help us create the idea of an old dynasty that's fell on hard times, to the point where they were scaviging parts from their own flagship.

But-yeah. I think rolling, player choice or DM fiat are all fine for SP/Profit at start, but I really thing the GM needs to be involved in it because it really can set the tone for the game.