So yesterday I TO-ed a friendly store tournament with the new MOV rules. It did not turn out well. Small based ships had a HUGE advantage. Two players were running bro-bots and almost all of their wins were only partial wins because of the new MOV. One of my losses was to a bro-bot build and I felt dirty at the end of the game. He couldn't kill off my last ship (Meranda) and I had done half damage to both of his. The final score was 57 to 49, even though he still had BOTH of his ships and killed 2 out of 3 of mine. I shook his hand, told him he wiped the floor with my list, and gave him my condolences.

If you haven't played with the new MOV yet, even if you're happy about it now, you won't be once you get a few games under your belt. This was a poor change. The system was fine as it was. Now it is more complicated and unfair to large base ships.

What if I have played with it, fairly extensively, and I still like it just fine? And so does everybody I've played with face-to-face since the change, and so do the developers at FFG?

What if I have played with it, fairly extensively, and I still like it just fine? And so does everybody I've played with face-to-face since the change, and so do the developers at FFG?

Glad you like it... you won. It's the rules now. I'm not here to argue. I didn't even run large ships. Just didn't like the way I felt after a few games.

The system was fine as it was.

It obviously wasn't.

What was the length of rounds you were playing? Why couldn't he kill off Miranda?

If anything I think that the 50% hull/shields rule shoudl have been applied to all ships, not just huge ships. There are some really hefty small ships out there now, and I don't really see a good reason for a Punisher with 1 hull left still counts as being untouched at the end of the game, for example.

I don't think anyone will lament a few less large based ships clogging up the top tables. Don't suppose those flying fat turrets have been feeling too bad when ending the game on 1hp whilst a couple of healthy ships couldn't quite finish the job!

Overall it promotes more diverse lists... This is a good thing.

What was the length of rounds you were playing? Why couldn't he kill off Miranda?

70 minutes.

I played King Maker after loosing my 2nd ship. I had one ship down to the half way mark, so I ran Miranda in such a way that I could regen shields and he was getting bad (or no) shots at me unless he took big risks. At time, Miranda was alive, and both of is IGs were at or bellow half health.

Next someone is going to tell me I did something wrong.... but what more could I do? Miranda had to play to her strengths at the end and see if she could get lucky.

Two Brobots shouldn't have a problem killing Miranda. If you're SLAMing to arc dodge, it should really only be dodging one of them, leaving you with 1 mitigation (C3-PO) against either an HLC or a Mangler, both with a TL at minimum. So they should easily do 2 damage a turn if you're SLAMing to arc dodge. If you're not SLAMing, then you get to regen a shield, but you have both shooting at you for 4-5 damage. It shouldn't take more than 3 turns of 2 on 1 for the brobots to kill Miri. If your opponent couldn't line up the shots with them, then he shouldn't win. Miri isn't that maneuverable.

If anything I think that the 50% hull/shields rule shoudl have been applied to all ships, not just huge ships. There are some really hefty small ships out there now, and I don't really see a good reason for a Punisher with 1 hull left still counts as being untouched at the end of the game, for example.

Perhaps, and this might happen. Makes the game much more complicated though.

I don't think anyone will lament a few less large based ships clogging up the top tables. Don't suppose those flying fat turrets have been feeling too bad when ending the game on 1hp whilst a couple of healthy ships couldn't quite finish the job!

Overall it promotes more diverse lists... This is a good thing.

I doubt it. I predict a return of the TIE swarm and BBBBZ. IG, Firespray, and the Darth Vader crew card are the biggest looser here. Maybe some would argue that bro-bots was too powerful... but I don't think anyone was complaining about the FIrespray.

What was the length of rounds you were playing? Why couldn't he kill off Miranda?

70 minutes.

I played King Maker after loosing my 2nd ship. I had one ship down to the half way mark, so I ran Miranda in such a way that I could regen shields and he was getting bad (or no) shots at me unless he took big risks. At time, Miranda was alive, and both of is IGs were at or bellow half health.

Next someone is going to tell me I did something wrong.... but what more could I do? Miranda had to play to her strengths at the end and see if she could get lucky.

You didn't do anything wrong at all. I am, however, amazed that someone can misplay so badly as to allow Miranda to escape with not one, but both BroBots still up and running. Especially since it sounds like you weren't SLAMing so much as to get your shields back. He fully deserved the terrible MoV loss.

Also, as to the topic of the post, my local league has been playing with almost the exact same rule for close to four months. We haven't had any complaints, and nor have we seen big ships disappear from the face of the earth. BroBots and fat turrets are still rightly feared, Palpatine Shuttles are starting to arrive in force now that people are realising how good they are, Firesprays still make an appearance, and people are still experimenting with the Hound's Tooth. The new rule is fine.

What was the length of rounds you were playing? Why couldn't he kill off Miranda?

70 minutes.

I played King Maker after loosing my 2nd ship. I had one ship down to the half way mark, so I ran Miranda in such a way that I could regen shields and he was getting bad (or no) shots at me unless he took big risks. At time, Miranda was alive, and both of is IGs were at or bellow half health.

Next someone is going to tell me I did something wrong.... but what more could I do? Miranda had to play to her strengths at the end and see if she could get lucky.

Well like you just said, your opponent had an opportunity to take big risks in order to kill Miranda and obviously chose not to.

Did your opponent not realize that these rules were in place? If they are in that position of needing to destroy your ship in order to win then they should work hard to do so.

In that situation, who cares if one of your IG's dies trying to kill Miranda? As long as one IG lives you win.

It seems as if the IG player needs to consider new tactics in the new meta. That is after all part of the point.

Good. I'm happy all of the bro bot players got robbed of full wins. Now they'll know what it's like to play a swarm or really most other small ship based lists and contain MoV as well as a colander. Gasp, 2 ship lists might actually get modified wins! Can't have that!

This is no different than any other list.

Much like the Phantom nerf, this nerf only turns an OP thing into something a little less OP/balanced. The thing itself is still good but now it's no longer an autowin so it disappears from the meta for the most part because people think it's bad.

I gotta echo Vorpal and others. I have played with it and I do like it better.

He fully deserved the terrible MoV.

This isn't just about MoV. The BroBots lost because of the scoring. Two half dead BroBots lost to Miranda. I don't think this is the same thing your group has been doing.

Got to agree with all the other posters here; two BroBots should have wiped the floor with Miranda. If your opponent flew conservatively and failed to finish her off, then that's on them.

And again, this is no different than three full-health Academy Pilots losing to a 1-hull remaining Fat Han prior to the change.

Suck it up, fatties: you're no longer going to be able to play hide and seek - you're going to have to work for your victories now.

Based on this scenario only, I would say that the new rule is working as intended to balance the game a little.

What would have happened with the old rule? Once down to only Miranda, both IG would have just played very defensively, waiting for the game to finish to score the easy win and then move on. Meanwhile, the Miranda player would have had no chance to win at all and the only thing it could do was trying to survive to save himself from an horrible MoV.

Now with the new rule, the IG player had to continue to fight to have a full win, like you know, actually playing the game. Since the IG had to commit themselves, the Miranda player still had a chance to blow up one and steal the win.

Maybe it's just me, but the new rule seems more fun and balanced. The IG player needs to adapt to the fact that the easy win will be harder to get now.

He fully deserved the terrible MoV.

This isn't just about MoV. The BroBots lost because of the scoring. Two half dead BroBots lost to Miranda. I don't think this is the same thing your group has been doing.

That's exactly my point. The guy had two BroBots chasing one opposing ship that is quite a bit slower than either Bot and he couldn't kill it. As a dedicated BroBot pilot, I am having trouble fathoming how this is possible. The only explanation I can think of is a total misplay on the part of the BroBot pilot, in which case he deserved the loss.

Also, why the uproar about this when three full health B-wings have been losing matches to 1-health Hans and Chirpys for months now?

EDIT: And yes, this is almost exactly what my group has been doing. We limited it to large ships worth 40 points or more, but for the sake of this scenario it would have resulted in the same situation. The difference seems to be that our players are willing to actually go for the kill rather than throw the game by playing over-defensively.

But it's nice to know that someone on the other side of the world knows what's happening at my group better than I do.

What was the length of rounds you were playing? Why couldn't he kill off Miranda?

70 minutes.

I played King Maker after loosing my 2nd ship. I had one ship down to the half way mark, so I ran Miranda in such a way that I could regen shields and he was getting bad (or no) shots at me unless he took big risks. At time, Miranda was alive, and both of is IGs were at or bellow half health.

Next someone is going to tell me I did something wrong.... but what more could I do? Miranda had to play to her strengths at the end and see if she could get lucky.

The time limit according to the Tournament Rules is now 75 minutes. There is no more leeway for the TOs to change the time limit. Given another 5 minutes for another round or two he might have been able to kill Miranda.

It IS a shame that this rule further weakens Firesprays. And I'd have been OK with the rule being applied to expensive small ships too (I think if you apply it to EVERY small ship you lose the benefit of having the rule in the first place, which seems to be to make allowances for how difficult it is to hurt ships that are loaded with stacked arc-dodging/defensive abilities).

But Brobots and fat turrets actually having to outfly the opposition to earn their wins? Oh no. Shame. How awful. You mustn't.

I've lost to too many one hull fat ships to think this is a problem. Brobots should be turning Miranda to space debris in 2 rounds.

What if I have played with it, fairly extensively, and I still like it just fine? And so does everybody I've played with face-to-face since the change, and so do the developers at FFG?

Glad you like it... you won. It's the rules now. I'm not here to argue. I didn't even run large ships. Just didn't like the way I felt after a few games.

My point wasn't about winning or losing (it's not a contest). My point was there are lots of people who have played with the rule and still like it, so the assumption that lies behind your original post is a bad one.

It IS a shame that this rule further weakens Firesprays. And I'd have been OK with the rule being applied to expensive small ships too (I think if you apply it to EVERY small ship you lose the benefit of having the rule in the first place, which seems to be to make allowances for how difficult it is to hurt ships that are loaded with stacked arc-dodging/defensive abilities).

But Brobots and fat turrets actually having to outfly the opposition to earn their wins? Oh no. Shame. How awful. You mustn't.

Not really. I doubt many games involving Firesprays go to time. And really, that is where the rule comes into play. Large ships just have to ensure they kill everything. I fail to see an issue with that.

But Brobots ... actually having to outfly the opposition to earn their wins? Oh no. Shame. How awful. You mustn't.

One thing: BroBots have to outfly the opposition to earn their wins. They might not look it individually, but as a list they have an alarmingly low amount of health and it runs out real quick if you fail to outfly the opponent. I would actually rank them up there with Interceptors as one of the hardest ships in the game to fly properly, and much like interceptors they do not tolerate mistakes.

One thing: BroBots have to outfly the opposition to earn their wins. They might not look it individually, but as a list they have an alarmingly low amount of health and it runs out real quick if you fail to outfly the opponent. I would actually rank them up there with Interceptors as one of the hardest ships in the game to fly properly, and much like interceptors they do not tolerate mistakes.

Yeah, don't let Vader or Juno get into range one with prockets for a start.

Not really. I doubt many games involving Firesprays go to time.