I believe everyone agrees the squadron is "engaged" by the ruling on the card. Also, I believe everyone agrees that by being engaged, a squadron must attack an engaged squadron, "if possible". The engagement rule is restricting what an engaged squadron may do, including attack. Does it state anywhere in the engagement rule that an "engaged squadron may attack a ship"? There is no statement to that effect. The rule only states that an engaged squadron must attack an engaged squadron. The "if possible rather than a ship" does not state an engaged squadron may attack a ship. Technically there should be a comma after "if possible," to qualify that there are situations that an attacking squadron may not be able to attack. In situations where it is "not possible" for an engaged squadron to attack an engaged squadron, it does not state it may attack a ship instead, it just can't

Tycho Celchu has a specific exception to the engagement rule that allows him to attack a ship when engaged.

I highly doubt instigator will be immune to squadrons

reason being: that's broken as ****

Please consider the following:

1. An activated Tie Bomber is engaged by an enemy X-Wing. The LOS to the X-Wing is obstructed by an obstacle, thus reducing its 1 black die attack dice by 1, making it a zero dice attack. There is a CR90 in range 1 of the Tie Bomber and the LOS to it is not obstructed. It "is not possible" to attack the X-Wing, but "is possible" to attack the CR90. However, I believe that the Tie Bomber may not attack the CR90 due to the engagement rule as it is engaged with an X-Wing and I see no rule in the engagement rule section allowing an engaged squadron to attack a ship.

2. Tycho Celchu has a specific exception to the engagement rule that allows him to attack a ship when engaged.

1. - If there is an Obstacle blocking line of Sight, the Squadrons are not Engaged.

Rulebook, Page 6, "Engagement:"

* If line of sight between two squadrons is obstructed, those squadrons are not engaged even if at distance 1 of each other, though they may attack each other.

EDIT: It even goes further to say that if both Squadrons are on the same Obstacle, and in base contact with each other, they attack is still obstructed, and they are not Engaged.

Please consider the following:

1. An activated Tie Bomber is engaged by an enemy X-Wing. The LOS to the X-Wing is obstructed by an obstacle, thus reducing its 1 black die attack dice by 1, making it a zero dice attack. There is a CR90 in range 1 of the Tie Bomber and the LOS to it is not obstructed. It "is not possible" to attack the X-Wing, but "is possible" to attack the CR90. However, I believe that the Tie Bomber may not attack the CR90 due to the engagement rule as it is engaged with an X-Wing and I see no rule in the engagement rule section allowing an engaged squadron to attack a ship.

2. Tycho Celchu has a specific exception to the engagement rule that allows him to attack a ship when engaged.

1. - If there is an Obstacle blocking line of Sight, the Squadrons are not Engaged.

Rulebook, Page 6, "Engagement:"

* If line of sight between two squadrons is obstructed, those squadrons are not engaged even if at distance 1 of each other, though they may attack each other.

I highly doubt instigator will be immune to sqadrons*

I agree this can't be the intent. So, I guess the "engaged" squadrons can attack ships if they can't attack the engaging squadrons.

I highly doubt instigator will be immune to sqadrons*

I agree this can't be the intent. So, I guess the "engaged" squadrons can attack ships if they can't attack the engaging squadrons.

Except that squadrons can't attack ships when engaged. This is why Heavy and Tycho are worded the way they are.

It is most probably a rule in advance due to rules we have not seen yet...

If an upgrade card for the future said: "Squadrons may move while engaged, as long as they are not engaged by more than one Squadron." - Then Instigator makes absolute perfect sense.

The raider will be used to intercept interceptors and fighters, not bombers. Bombers have a strong anti-ship attack and a weak anti-squadron attack, while the inverse is usually true and TIE interceptors are usually regarded as garbage against ships.

Not true. They must attack engaged squadrons "if possible". Since the ghost squadrons don't exist, it is not possible. Therefore they don't have to attack them, and can attack a ship.

No FAQ needed, wording is very precise.

I disagree. If a squadron is within a distance of 1 of a ship with this upgrade it is engaged by 2 squadrons. "When a squadron attacks, it must attack an engaged squadron if possible rather than an enemy ship." It does not state if it is not possible to attack all engaging squadron it may attack a ship. It only allows an "engaged" attacking squadron to attack an engaging squadron, nothing else (ship or unengaging squadron). Another statement is required stating it may attack a ship when it is engaged. Tycho Celchu has such a statement "You are not prevented from moving or attacking ships while you are engaged." There are situations where it is not possible to attack an "engaging" squadron such as an obstruction limiting a squadron's attacking dice. These situations do not then allow the attacking squadron to attack a ship.

I do agree a FAQ is not needed because the wording is very precise. So, squadrons "engaged" due this upgrade can't attack a ship or unengaging squadrons unless they have a statement (upgrade or ability) stating they can.

That makes less sense than my confusion on Bomber rule causing extra damage, rather than enabling Crit icons in general.

If they are not engaged with any real squadrons, how can they shoot them? Are these imaginary squadrons given stats to shoot at? No, theyre not. This literally just prevents the fighters from running away (except heavies) from the corvette.

If they cant shoot what theyre engaged with, then the "if possible" statement says they can still fire at a ship because it is "not possible" to fire at an engaged squadron. Plus that would be absolutely broken as hell if non-heavies literally couldnt hit this thing and were locked in place too. This ship could easily tie up an entire screen, and until your ships kill it theres nothing you can do about it. Thats a hell of a timewaster tactic.

Quite frankly im surprised they didnt include "And cannot fire at any other ship" in there so this can literally force squadrons to deal with them and not the other ships. Considering this thing is basically a "super tie fighter" lol i mean it even looks like one.

What is the importance of black dice on fighters anyway. The double damage faces dont do double damage because 1 is always a crit, and afaik the only card involving crits on squadrons lets you reroll it not utilize it.

What is the importance of black dice on fighters anyway. The double damage faces dont do double damage because 1 is always a crit, and afaik the only card involving crits on squadrons lets you reroll it not utilize it.

On a Fighter without bomber? The trick is to count up how many useful faces it has then... a Black Die without Bomber is the most worthless die in the game, doing nothing more often than not.

black dice w/out crits = 75% of one damage

blue dice w/out crits = 50% of one damage

it is just a straight improvement on blues if the accuracy result doesn't help at all

black dice w/out crits = 75% of one damage

blue dice w/out crits = 50% of one damage

Then I will stand corrected - its not the Worst Die in the Game.

It exists to give you hope of doing something

black dice w/out crits = 75% of one damage

blue dice w/out crits = 50% of one damage

Ah, true, i totally forgot only 2 faces are void results and it has no accuracy. Derp.

The two black dice against squadrons sounds sexier now...

Also....am i missing a general rule of Counter where it uses dice you normally have? All the Squadrons with it specify how many of what dice, while the Quad Laser Turrets just say number of dice.

I would imagine with a black die.

black dice w/out crits = 75% of one damage

blue dice w/out crits = 50% of one damage

Ah, true, i totally forgot only 2 faces are void results and it has no accuracy. Derp.

The two black dice against squadrons sounds sexier now...

it's like the "They love me; they love me not" game

it's sexy...not (because raider anti-squadron battery is limited by dice ranges, so you can only shoot at squadrons in close range)

it's sexy (because it's 75% of a damage per die)

it's sexy not (because no accuracies for those buggers with scatter)

it's sexy (because ******* ordnance experts!!!!!!!!!!!!)

As a Rebel player I may grab a few Raiders. Those upgrades are pretty darn awesome.

I'd use the ship as the fighter screen to escort bombers. Its a good replacement for 4 TIE Squadrons.

Nice to finally see the TIE Star Destroyer. Q4 can't arrive fast enough.

I do have a few fears though. Many discussions here have been about the relevance of squadrons and it's hard to argue about the tournament success of squadron-less fleets. Will the Raider actually dissuade people from using squadrons more than ever?

black dice w/out crits = 75% of one damage

blue dice w/out crits = 50% of one damage

Ah, true, i totally forgot only 2 faces are void results and it has no accuracy. Derp.

The two black dice against squadrons sounds sexier now...

it's like the "They love me; they love me not" game

it's sexy...not (because raider anti-squadron battery is limited by dice ranges, so you can only shoot at squadrons in close range)

it's sexy (because it's 75% of a damage per die)

it's sexy not (because no accuracies for those buggers with scatter)

it's sexy (because ******* ordnance experts!!!!!!!!!!!!)

"Dayum guuuurl, those point defense guns are fiiiiiiiiiine!"

Nice to finally see the TIE Star Destroyer. Q4 can't arrive fast enough.

I do have a few fears though. Many discussions here have been about the relevance of squadrons and it's hard to argue about the tournament success of squadron-less fleets. Will the Raider actually dissuade people from using squadrons more than ever?

if squadrons won't be used then instigator won't be used and we'll keep seeing gsds

all instigator will do, especially if it's stupid broken (immune to squadrons), will make Jan Ors slightly more auto-include

Seeing 5+ squadrons the bigger ships are capable of commanding with a single dial, Squadrons may become more common then you think.

SW-7 Ion Turrets upgrade blue dice to 75% damage to squadrons

SW-7 says while attacking 'Ships'. So no help against squadrons.

as above, the ions do nothing

the first thing I do with every weapon upgrade is search for the "ship only" restriction etc, otherwise I'd be more excited for this

ordnance experts, meanwhile...

I am confident I will find use for most items. I try to think of ways to use them outside the box. I find it hard to picture possible combos without having it all in front of me however.

so sensor team reads "While attacking, you may exhaust this card and spend 1 die to change 1 of your dice to a face with an ACC icon."

roll two blanks, ion out one damage

tada ?

The raider will be used to intercept interceptors and fighters, not bombers. Bombers have a strong anti-ship attack and a weak anti-squadron attack, while the inverse is usually true and TIE interceptors are usually regarded as garbage against ships.

This is the big statement about the raider's anti-squadron ability. A Y-wing can just tank the damage and shoot the raider down. On the other hand an interceptor could be dissuaded from even taking a shot at all due to the counter 1 upgrade (this goes for any ship with a open offensive retrofit to some extent). I also gives Imperials an opportunity to deal with A-wings without taking counter fire.

The SW-7 ion cannons sort of passively counter the mid-range evade token re-roll when equipped on the raider-II and CR-90b. For all ships, as the game goes on and defensive tokens start dropping, it increasingly is likely that you would have more than an optimum number of accuracies; essentially giving the blue dice a 100% chance to deal 1 damage.

SW-7's make blue dice really bloody good at close-range where you don't have to block evade dice, averaging the same damage as a black die. They also sort of counter electronic countermeasures; you can get damage out of your would-be countered acc result.