$84.43 not including tax that is 1 FO Tie, 1 T-70, Ghost, Inquisitors Tie, and Punishing One.

draconian

"This is not the word you're looking for."

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/draconian

2. (often lowercase) rigorous; unusually severe or cruel:

FFG forcing the purchase of 2 Star Vipers because you need Autothrusters is most certainly draconian. Forcing the purchase of a $90 Tantive IV because you need C-3PO and R2-D2 is most certainly draconian. And most recently, forcing the purchase of the $100 Raider to fix the TIE Advanced is a bend over job using sand as lube.

Like I said, I buy it, and it is my disposable income. It doesn't mean I have to be blind to the draconian douchebaggery of FFG.

Take stand and only buy for a certain faction, and/or limit the number of ships you purchase. Until you finally cave to the draconian business practices of FFG by packing the cards in ships you don't want or need.

Alas, I buy it, but talk about getting screwed.

Or go to eBay and pay $7 per card, on average.

-snip-

Isn't there a way to put users on ignore? I'm tired of image spam on every thread.

OT: It's an expensive wave for sure, though it's still within my budget.

Are you forced to buy the ships? Well, no, of course not, however some people may view this as being priced out of a hobby they love and have invested heavily into. Maybe an individual could justify spending a certain amount of money per year on X-wing, but what if that price keeps increasing?

-snip-

Isn't there a way to put users on ignore? I'm tired of image spam on every thread.

Yes there is. I've had him on ignore for ages now for similar reasons. Unfortunately, it isn't as easy to find as it could be.

Go to your account area then "Edit Profile" and then "Ignore Preferences". You have to add the users you want to ignore.

On topic... I can't afford this next Wave. Well, I could, I easily have the £££s, but I just don't want to spend that much. This was originally a "cheap" game, compared to others. It is still cheaper than some, but it is no longer cheap.

Bundling of small ships with huge ships is getting really tiresome. Not everyone plays Epic, yet to collect the standard ships you must buy Epic only ships. It's annoying. Why not an Aces box with repaint TIE Advanced, repaint TIE Fighter and the new pilots and upgrades from the Raider and Gozanti? I'd buy two straight away. That then also reduces the price of the huge ships so that they look more reasonable to someone thinking of making the foray into Epic play.

On top of that, this is the biggest wave ever. Especially if you consider the new core set. If it's out around Christmas then perhaps I'll get one or two ships as gifts.

Actually this is the cheapest wave for me so far (not counting the Carrier because Epic doesn't quite fit in the Wave schedule); one Ghost, one Punishing One, two TIE/ad Prototypes, two Mist Hunters, two T-70s, two TIE/fo. Came in much less than Wave VII, and just under Wave VI. How is this worth complaining about? If anything, FFG is miles better than when I felt...well, not "forced" of course but easily "compelled" to pick up four B-Wings and then three Lambda shuttles just to have the Advanced Sensors on most of them. 3x AS Blues with Biggs! What a meta that was.

Come on guys, have a bit of perspective. You're entitled to your opinion but try and keep positive, this is my only hobby and so I don't mind the buy-in, but at the same time I'm aware that FFG has been making things easier over time, not harder.

Will drive 20 minutes to Coolstuffgames, which price matches their website. Plus I'll have it in hand before website preorders even ship.

Which Cool Stuff? I live in SE Florida.

FFG could be nicer in the way they bundle their products. They could be much nicer about it. Bundling the TIE Advance fix with the Raider was a particularly diabolical decision on their part. But according to the one-eyed folks on this forum, we should all just be happy about it.

FFG's method of distributing upgrade cards is friendly to players who buy at least one of everything, and not particularly friendly to anyone else. You'll get no argument from me there.

What's irritating is when people come on here and present it as (a) a massive injustice and (b) some kind of surprise. I'm forced to buy two StarVipers! It's cruel that they make standard dogfight players buy the Raider!

It's like watching my toddler throw a half-hour tantrum over the fact that he doesn't get to eat watermelon and nothing but watermelon for breakfast: his complaint is valid (he wants watermelon and can't have it), but the level of drama and investment is way out of scale with the actual injury, and it's not as if he was allowed to have watermelon for breakfast the last time he asked, or the time before that.

I don't know, maybe forums for Magic players regularly see people who are shocked--nay, scandalized--to find that cards are distributed in random packs. But over here it's pretty tiresome. If you want to play casually, just proxy the upgrades you want. If you want to play competitively, your options are either to go ahead and adopt the one-of-everything collecting model or to start borrowing/trading/buying the things you think you need as singles. Those are the same choices you had in Waves 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6.

I think it's just this wave 7 and 8 being in the year of Star Wars and a bunch of products catching up all at once. They have to make the most of it. Doesn't help that they were almost out of recognizable small ship's and had to do two 20$ dollar small ship's. This will be a great time in the meta too I think. There's a lot of stuff to play with. It's been a looooong time since we had this much change to digest.

Expensive wave. Good thing you don't have to buy all/any of it

Gonzati especially is only advertising kallus and tie fighters outside of epic

Misthunter and pogostick are coming with a lot of scum only crew/mechs . hunter has tractor beams and pogo has some stuff + new guidance w.e that comes with the inq tie

Inq tie has your deadeye + tracers + guidance thingy in on convenient little package

Ghost is a plodding gimmick with most likely a bunch of rebel only (or Rebels only ) crew

If you purchase according to faction, apart from the cheapest ship in the wave, you'll be good

FFG could be nicer in the way they bundle their products. They could be much nicer about it. Bundling the TIE Advance fix with the Raider was a particularly diabolical decision on their part. But according to the one-eyed folks on this forum, we should all just be happy about it.

...but the level of drama and investment is way out of scale with the actual injury...

Is it, though? Because typing a few words on a forum seems pretty proportional to the injury. I think the disproportionate part is the response of the forum (to generalize) to any criticism of FFG. FFG makes a good product, but it's far from flawless, and accepting it without reservations doesn't help anyone. And, while I quoted you, Vorp, do know that I wasn't addressing this whole post at you, nor at you solely.

Maybe it was the choice of words that seemed disproportionate moreso than voicing discontent at all. Honestly? If I had a major problem I'd email FFG (or Frank Brooks or Alex Davy) directly. They seem to have their heads and hearts fully into X-Wing and would at least give a cursory glance at a complaint, I feel.

And no, FFG altogether isn't flawless by any means, but I haven't felt mistreated as a customer, fan, or competitor whatsoever. Every major gripe I've ever genuinely felt has been addressed pretty well so far, as long as one considers the constraints of their business model (never rereleasing a product with new cards/cardboard, never releasing a product that is only cards and/or cardboard, making second versions of existing product visually distinct from the extant product...).

As an example, here in Oz, we pay through the nose.

• Correlian Corvette about $120 AUD
• Imp Raider " $130 "
• Core Set/S&V " $65 "
• Rebel Transport " $90 "
• YT1300/Imp Shuttle " $48 "
• Tie/X-Wing (etc) " $25 "
• StarViper " $32 "
• Aces " $48 "

So buy what you want/can afford. No one is making you buy everything.

So yeah, not cheap as some. But that's the same for everything. Everything costs more here in Oz. Cost of living on a remote island. And before you say buy overseas online, shipping to Oz is horrible. And they're just passing a law stating that we'll have to pay GST for a lot of things bought on line. Yay.

Cheap wave for me. $49.90 (or it would be if I used 'murican dollars and not Her Majesty's pounds sterling).

Of course, when the Gozanti arrives, that'll be a different matter.

FFG makes a good product, but it's far from flawless, and accepting it without reservations doesn't help anyone.

Has anyone said it is? I'd rather be able to get the Tie Advanced fix in a Tie Advanced 2.0 pack rather then the Raider, which I was going to buy anyway. It's also not like FFG is completely deaf to it, they did after all include good upgrades in other packs, such as PtL in the Imp Aces or AdvSen in E-Wings.

Back to more on topic...

Wave 7 and 8 will be the cheapest ones for me. Wave 7 cost me $80, and Wave 8 will cost me $80-100 I'd guess.

I actually agree and I don't like having viable upgrades for standard play exclusively in the epic ships. At the very least they should make those upgrades available in other packs. I got a Raider because hopefully I get to play some epic matches in it, but I can see the complaints of people who never plan on playing epic. I never bought a CR-90 and don't plan to. Too bad I can't really fly the Falcon without one competitively.

FFG could be nicer in the way they bundle their products. They could be much nicer about it. Bundling the TIE Advance fix with the Raider was a particularly diabolical decision on their part. But according to the one-eyed folks on this forum, we should all just be happy about it.

...but the level of drama and investment is way out of scale with the actual injury...

Is it, though? Because typing a few words on a forum seems pretty proportional to the injury. I think the disproportionate part is the response of the forum (to generalize) to any criticism of FFG. FFG makes a good product, but it's far from flawless, and accepting it without reservations doesn't help anyone. And, while I quoted you, Vorp, do know that I wasn't addressing this whole post at you, nor at you solely.

Typing a few words on a forum isn't the problem, though--as Tsiegtiez says, it's the choice of language. Maybe Chucknuckle and WeWantTheFunk are both being hyperbolic, but I prefer to think that words mean things.

Bank of America, Chase Manhattan, and other lenders recently made a business practice out of fraudulently repossessing homes to which they had no title and, occasionally, where there wasn't even a mortgage. That's worth a boycott. When I was a kid, Exxon dumped 30 million gallons of crude oil into (comparatively speaking) my backyard--and they spent most of my adult life attempting to dodge financial responsibility for the cleanup and damages. That's worth a boycott.

On that scale, WeWantTheFunk urging players to "take stand" and refuse to buy from FFG until they change their "draconian" business practices seems... absurd. Oh, woe is me--I spent $13.77 on a fighter I might not run, so that I could have access to Autothrusters for tournament play! I had to go on Ebay and spend $16.75 to run Vader competitively!

FFG's distribution model for upgrades is a perfectly transparent process: the contents of each expansion are fixed. (It's not like you're making random blind buys in hopes of pulling an ultra-rare TIE/x1 title.) And moreover, the price is capped: no one can charge more than $15 for a copy of Autothrusters, because at that point it's cheaper just to view the Starviper expansion as a $15 pair of upgrade cards that comes with a free model.

So what all this boils down to is people complaining that it costs more than they'd like to stay competitive in X-wing: please, FFG, can you package your upgrades in a way that allows me to pay less for the content I want to purchase? And you know, I really do understand how frustrating that is. I've even talked to FFG about my concern that they may be pricing new players out of the game entirely, and that moving toward an a la carte model might help future-proof the game's growth. What I'm not doing is ranting about it on the forum, both because it's not likely to succeed and because I can't find a way to put it that doesn't make me sound selfish and entitled.

FFG could be nicer in the way they bundle their products. They could be much nicer about it. Bundling the TIE Advance fix with the Raider was a particularly diabolical decision on their part. But according to the one-eyed folks on this forum, we should all just be happy about it.

blah blah blah heavy handed defense of FFG

Is it, though? Because typing a few words on a forum seems pretty proportional to the injury. I think the disproportionate part is the response of the forum (to generalize) to any criticism of FFG. FFG makes a good product, but it's far from flawless, and accepting it without reservations doesn't help anyone. And, while I quoted you, Vorp, do know that I wasn't addressing this whole post at you, nor at you solely.

blah blah blah heavy handed defense of poor vocabulary

Actually, I said you can only take a stand so long, before you have to cave to be competitive. And, just because I choose a word that is outside of your comfort zone, doesn't mean it was the wrong word.

And the magnitude of righteous indignation on behalf of FFG because I said "draconian" is unequivocally rollicking. Moreover, the mitigation of the paucity of apprehension of words is coordinately as uproarious.

Apologists gonna apologize.

So what all this boils down to is people complaining that it costs more than they'd like to stay competitive in X-wing:

I'd go a step farther... There is no one single card you need to have a competitive list. There may be cards you need to make a given list competitive, but there are enough competitive lists out there that no one can ever truly say they're forced to buy anything, other then the ships they want to play with.

So people need to weigh their options, is flying a Tie Advanced competitively worth the cost of a Raider? (Which you can get for as little as $69 on MM or CSI) If it's not then you just have to accept that you won't be flying Advanced competitively. That's not anything rises to the level of actual harm, just a lack of one option.

Same goes for C-3PO, no one needs him, you don't even really need it to fly the Falcon. It's nice and works well, but you are by no means forced to spend the money to get him.

So again while I might wish they did their cards some other way. I've seen games that are much less player friendly. Anything with random boosters for example, or the price GW charges for their models. Even Warmahordes, FoW or Infinity is going to cost as much if not more then X-Wing per list.

If anything it speaks to just how spoiled we are in X-Wing. Here we complain about having to buy a ship for a different faction, but in most other games, most people buy stuff for a single list or two and that's all they play with.

One last thought, people seem to lose track of the fact that this is in fact a luxury item, we're not talking about food and clothing or even household goods here. I find it very hard to agree that we're being taken advantage of by the cost of our toys.

Draconian is not the right word though

Manipulative perhaps even slight coercive, yes, but dracionan implies they have an authority over you that they simply do not

Amateur dramatics do not justify gratuitous abuse of the thesaurus

but dracionan implies they have an authority over you that they simply do not

True, the term is only properly used when in reference to laws or authorities. It is not used correctly when referring to a optional, luxury, hobby/toy.

Actually, I said you can only take a stand so long, before you have to cave to be competitive. And, just because I choose a word that is outside of your comfort zone, doesn't mean it was the wrong word.

And the magnitude of righteous indignation on behalf of FFG because I said "draconian" is unequivocally rollicking. Moreover, the mitigation of the paucity of apprehension of words is coordinately as uproarious.

Right, my 350-word response to you is all about how I don't understand what "draconian" means. You caught me. Moreover, I've now come to understand that my degrees, my professional publications, and my decade's worth of technical writing experience are all worthless--Worthless!--in the face of your enormous brain and its weaponized vocabulary. If you'll excuse me, I'm going to go hang my head in utter shame.

Apologists gonna apologize.

Reading comprehension isn't your thing, I guess. I'm done here.

but dracionan implies they have an authority over you that they simply do not

True, the term is only properly used when in reference to laws or authorities. It is not used correctly when referring to a optional, luxury, hobby/toy.

haha

Surmise is different than imply

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/177/troll.jpg

My work is done here

I'm waiting for the delivery of CR-90 so I can finally play C3-PO in competitive play. Oh, and my second K-Wing because it's an awesome ship, or because I need 4 TLTs. Whatever, payday is tomorrow, so I can pay off the credit card balance.

FFG could be nicer in the way they bundle their products. They could be much nicer about it. Bundling the TIE Advance fix with the Raider was a particularly diabolical decision on their part. But according to the one-eyed folks on this forum, we should all just be happy about it.

...but the level of drama and investment is way out of scale with the actual injury...

Is it, though? Because typing a few words on a forum seems pretty proportional to the injury. I think the disproportionate part is the response of the forum (to generalize) to any criticism of FFG. FFG makes a good product, but it's far from flawless, and accepting it without reservations doesn't help anyone. And, while I quoted you, Vorp, do know that I wasn't addressing this whole post at you, nor at you solely.

I don't know, they're coming to a place where FFG does not post and has said they will never post for a variety of reasons. So it can't be because they want a response from FFG. To me it seems like it's a lot of 'woe is me' pandering in public to either get troll responses. It's victim mentality purposefully seeking out abuse so they can cry more about how they're so mistreated.

All of these problems have easy solutions, you can proxy the cards, buy only the ones you need for tourney lists, etc. if you're a completionist then you're buying the epic ships anyway and that is in no way poor business or ethical practices by FFG. The biggest joke is they always quote full retail like its the only option. Why would anyone try and help or agree with anyone who refuses to even remotely help themselves?

So it can't be because they want a response from FFG.

To be fair, they don't post but they do read. I don't doubt that the change on the S&V dials was due at least in part to the posts made here on the subject.

All of these problems have easy solutions

Yeah, as you said if you play casual then just proxie them. I would be somewhat surprised if anyone has a big issue with a proxy of 3PO. Especially if was one that was halfway decent, like say color copy on a extra upgrade card.

If you play competitively, well then frankly that's the price you pay. Competitive events always cost more then casual ones, and it's just something you have to expect when getting involved.