The term is broadly applied (to Wheaton in this thread).

It is applied, derogatorily, to anyone who works towards making anything about our culture better.

There were bad apples who resorted to stupid, counterproductive tactics in every movement that has ever moved us forward as a society.

The idea that their existence means we should just stop talking about the way we treat each other is not reasonable.

My quibble is with people who claim to be for it when they demonstrably are NOT so, unless they are carefully separated it undermines the effort.

Imagine tiling a sidewalk, but half the workers behind you pry up the bricks. Why do you still allow them to claim your work as their own?

This is the distinction, when I use "SJW". Argue for equality, I'll argue with you. Argue for disingenuous sociopaths and I will argue against.

Dipping a casual toe into the branching stream...

I think of the SJW term as really meaning Social (media) Justice Warrior. As in, their primary battlefront for advancing their views of social Justice is social media. And their primary attack method is shaming, "doxing" and doing other personally destructive online things to their opponents. Like destroying the career of that Nobel prize winning cancer researcher by promulgating far and wide a tale of his misogyny that turned out to be a lie.

Maybe my take on it is simply informed by narrow exposure to only those online commentators who oppose the SJW movement. But that's my take on the difference between the broad concept and the specific usage of the label.

Okay, taking two aspirin. See everyone tomorrow. G'nite.

The term is broadly applied (to Wheaton in this thread).

And probably shouldn't be, he's not crazed cultist level.

It is applied, derogatorily, to anyone who works towards making anything about our culture better.

Sure, Nyberg was working towards making culture better(~!), and that's one in a sea of examples towards painting the specific categorisation of SJW as a wholly negative term.

There were bad apples who resorted to stupid, counterproductive tactics in every movement that has ever moved us forward as a society.

And they should be recognised as such and proven wrong.

The idea that their existence means we should just stop talking about the way we treat each other is not reasonable.

I have no particular quibble with the concept of equality.My quibble is with people who claim to be for it when they demonstrably are NOT so, unless they are carefully separated it undermines the effort.Imagine tiling a sidewalk, but half the workers behind you pry up the bricks. Why do you still allow them to claim your work as their own?This is the distinction, when I use "SJW". Argue for equality, I'll argue with you. Argue for disingenuous sociopaths and I will argue against.

It comes down to this:

Do you spend as much time championing equality as you do policing the way others choose to champion equality?

Trying to ensure that the concept of equality isn't infiltrated and inverted IS championing for equality, thank you very much. Equality cannot be built on lies.

When those people use equality as a weapon to achieve their goals, as opposed to an ideal to strive towards with integrity and honesty, then I will speak out against them.

Jesus : /

By that argument Steven Milloy is a champion for the advancement of science.

Jesus : /

Sorry, that was more blunt than I intended, debate's not my strong suit.

Regardless, we should not let such debacles leak into this forum. We are better than that, are we not?

There are people (NOT people here on this forum) supposedly trying to advance equality, who are really narrow-minded fascists.

And there are obnoxious bigots (once again, not here on this forum) who denounce anyone who stands up to them as "SJWs".

And I don't really know why we are discussing either. This is a forum for people who like playing with little plastic spaceships and making "pewpew" noises. If I want to talk equality or ethics or social policy there are a million places to do that, which don't interfere with my little plastic toy hobby. Obviously I can't stop people posting whatever they want, but my experience is that this kind of thing infecting a forum sends it toxic pretty fast once it gets a decent hold. Personally I'd really like it if people would just stop.

*edited for clarity and preventing misunderstanding.

There are people supposedly trying to advance equality, who are really narrow-minded fascists.

And there are obnoxious bigots who denounce anyone who stands up to them as "SJWs".

And I don't really know why we are discussing either. This is a forum for people who like playing with little plastic spaceships and making "pewpew" noises. If I want to talk equality or ethics or social policy there are a million places to do that, which don't interfere with my little plastic toy hobby. Obviously I can't stop people posting whatever they want, but my experience is that this kind of thing infecting a forum sends it toxic pretty fast once it gets a decent hold. Personally I'd really like it if people would just stop.

Insulting people you disagree with and then turning around and questioning why the argument is taking place, in an attempt to end it, is logically and morally bankrupt

There are people supposedly trying to advance equality, who are really narrow-minded fascists.

And there are obnoxious bigots who denounce anyone who stands up to them as "SJWs".

And I don't really know why we are discussing either. This is a forum for people who like playing with little plastic spaceships and making "pewpew" noises. If I want to talk equality or ethics or social policy there are a million places to do that, which don't interfere with my little plastic toy hobby. Obviously I can't stop people posting whatever they want, but my experience is that this kind of thing infecting a forum sends it toxic pretty fast once it gets a decent hold. Personally I'd really like it if people would just stop.

Insulting people you disagree with and then turning around and questioning why the argument is taking place, in an attempt to end it, is logically and morally bankrupt

I wasn't insulting anyone who's a part of this debate, here, on this forum. I was speaking about extremists on either side of the divide out in the wider world. And I absolutely stand by the fact that it's a debate that has no place here.

ETA: Just to be even more clear- I understand why some people denigrate the worst SJWs, and also why some of the more liberal get annoyed at anyone with a conscience being conflated with those same people. But people end up arguing against an extremist position from the other side rather than considering more reasonable opposing positions, and just talk past each other. I very much doubt anyone here actually holds any of the extreme positions, but it's going to cause a massive amount of friction when people argue as though they do.

4 pages on this?

I guess we could say we learned from Yoda about as much as Anikin did.

4 pages on this?

I guess we could say we learned from Yoda about as much as Anikin did.

Come on bruh, Yoda would've kicked Anakin's ass...

And I don't really know why we are discussing either.

Because somebody mentioned Wil Wheaton and someone else immediately decided that that was a problem.

Posting that this argument doesn't belong here is fine (it doesn't), but calling people fascists and bigots immediately before you do is oblivious at best, and trolling and instigating at worst.

And as you correlate having a conscious with being liberal in your follow up I'm leaning toward the latter.

4 pages on this?

I guess we could say we learned from Yoda about as much as Anikin did.

Come on bruh, Yoda would've kicked Anakin's ass...

Just like I said, ain't much, have learned.

Regardless, we should not let such debacles leak into this forum. We are better than that, are we not?

It exists everywhere and is a part of everything. It binds us and pen--- oh noooooooooooo!

There are people (NOT people here on this forum) supposedly trying to advance equality, who are really narrow-minded fascists.

And there are obnoxious bigots (once again, not here on this forum) who denounce anyone who stands up to them as "SJWs".

And I don't really know why we are discussing either. This is a forum for people who like playing with little plastic spaceships and making "pewpew" noises. If I want to talk equality or ethics or social policy there are a million places to do that, which don't interfere with my little plastic toy hobby. Obviously I can't stop people posting whatever they want, but my experience is that this kind of thing infecting a forum sends it toxic pretty fast once it gets a decent hold. Personally I'd really like it if people would just stop.

*edited for clarity and preventing misunderstanding.

I will have you know that my 'pew pew' noises are of the top most quality and quite varied, including such onomatopoeia as 'ska-plow', frzzz-at! and some so awesome I can't even replicate them here.

Pew pew indeed.

Posting that this argument doesn't belong here is fine (it doesn't), but calling people fascists and bigots immediately before you do is oblivious at best, and trolling and instigating at worst.

And as you correlate having a conscious with being liberal in your follow up I'm leaning toward the latter.

You realise I was the two terms I used, while possibly excessive, were aimed towards people at the two opposite ends of the spectrum? I take issue with extremists of any stripe. As I said, I doubt anyone here agrees with the extreme positions of either those who think we should restrict all freedom of expression in the name of "social justice", or people who think that you are being oppressed because someone calls you out on being a racist. Most people are relatively reasonable, but that's not how these arguments go.

But w/e, I'm not going to keep arguing this here.

Newbies asking legitimate questions get slammed a lot on this forum, I've noticed. Sure, most of their questions can be answered by looking at the FAQ, but many times things can be ambiguous, or obscure. Yet some folks treat the OP like a moron and worse won't even answer the original qustion. Being offensive and rude served no purpose other than to alienate the person who asked the question and give the responding troll the 'satisfaction' of 'educating' the person seeking answers. Not everyone who plays his game has been doing so since 2012, and not everyone is adult. If this game is to continue we need new players coming in as often as possible, even 'kids'. For me, I will be 'over the hill' soon but hopefully I won't be so cynical or grumpy that I look down my nose any someone seeking knowledge about this game I love.

TL;DR don't be a jerk.

If you have a noob question I have found that the X Wing Reddit is a better place to ask it.

Newbies asking legitimate questions get slammed a lot on this forum, I've noticed. Sure, most of their questions can be answered by looking at the FAQ, but many times things can be ambiguous, or obscure. Yet some folks treat the OP like a moron and worse won't even answer the original qustion. Being offensive and rude served no purpose other than to alienate the person who asked the question and give the responding troll the 'satisfaction' of 'educating' the person seeking answers. Not everyone who plays his game has been doing so since 2012, and not everyone is adult. If this game is to continue we need new players coming in as often as possible, even 'kids'. For me, I will be 'over the hill' soon but hopefully I won't be so cynical or grumpy that I look down my nose any someone seeking knowledge about this game I love.

TL;DR don't be a jerk.

If you have a noob question I have found that the X Wing Reddit is a better place to ask it.

An actual helpful bit of advice! Yay!

4 pages on this?

I guess we could say we learned from Yoda about as much as Anikin did.

Um, that's not the dark side, Ani is being possessed by a demon! Call Sam and Dean!

After a good night's sleep I awaken to find this discussion on going with an increase in volume. Since I haven't had a chance to google this I shall remain neutral and referee this verbal sparring match.

Everybody to a neutral corner, take a deep, slow breath and count to 30.

Yeah I don't know (or really care) what an SJW is. It's interesting to me, though, that the argument over it has itself underscored several of the points I made in my OP. So much fear, so much pain, and so often all we do is visit them on others in a desperate attempt to obscure those feelings in ourselves. It's especially telling how angry that point makes some who have responded. I'm not trying to jump anyone's case here. Just the opposite, actually - I'm saying I share this challenge with you, and telling each and every person that reads this that you find in me both absolution and encouragement. But only if you can be brave enough to admit that we can all do better.

Eventually I was able to determine from context that sjw is social justice warrior and this has something to do with gamer gate and ultimately that this is of no consequence to anyone really.