What about a 0 point Title or Astromech that allows a second modification at -2 points?

If we ever get a 0-point Astromech, this card goes through the roof.

I don't understand all the whining. This card is a great improvement for the T-65. For the cost of an astromech you would likely be taking anyway, you have much greater survivability. Yes, you can't take EU, but that's your choice.

I consider the 'fix' done, and will be real happy to see the coming astromech.

RoV

A note on the integrated astromech. It say you may discard 1 of your astromech cards. At present now ship has 2 astromechs. It seems to be telling use that in the future we will see 2 astromechs on a ship!!!

I am going to lay out an argument for why this is actually a very elegant fix for the T-65. I feel like integrated astromech accomplishes two simultaneous fixes, one mathematical and one thematic.

First the mathematical component. While I am the first to point out the limitations on Mathwing, the process has merit. I will reference Major Juggler here, as he is the expert. Major Juggler made this argument about the X-Wing back at the end of last year (December 04, 2014) on a Team Covenant Blog:

They actually only need about +1 cost, with +1 hull. This would simultaneously made them worth taking, while preventing 5 in a list. This would have repercussions on the B-wing later, which would need an additional durability boost and cost tweak to make it thematically more in line with the X-wing.

Integrated Astromech accomplishes exactly this with a 1 point astromech, even if you never use the astromech's ability. Mathematically, the X-Wing now has the jousting value that it needs. While it does lose the astromech to access that last ability, that is only if the one point of pseudo-hull is going to save your ship.

Thematically. In the fluff, X-Wing's always have their astromechs. I have always been bothered by how few of them see regular play. This fix incentivizes players to bring an astromech on their T-65 without going the route of a cost reduction to field them. Now X-Wings are able to get the jousting values they need while increasing the thematic inclusion of astromechs.

Well done FFG.

A note on the integrated astromech. It say you may discard 1 of your astromech cards. At present now ship has 2 astromechs. It seems to be telling use that in the future we will see 2 astromechs on a ship!!!

All discard effects are worded like that (ie. discard 1 of [thing]). It doesn't mean anything.

Also, from a cold game balance point of view, so long as R2-D2 and R2 Astromechs both exist, no Rebel ship is ever getting 2 astromech slots.

A note on the integrated astromech. It say you may discard 1 of your astromech cards. At present now ship has 2 astromechs. It seems to be telling use that in the future we will see 2 astromechs on a ship!!!

All discard effects are worded like that (ie. discard 1 of [thing]). It doesn't mean anything.

Also, from a cold game balance point of view, so long as R2-D2 and R2 Astromechs both exist, no Rebel ship is ever getting 2 astromech slots.

It could theoretically be done if they worded it in a way that prevented using *unique astromechs as part of the pair, or it specifically stated "you may not equip any astromech with a squad point cost greater than three"

A note on the integrated astromech. It say you may discard 1 of your astromech cards. At present now ship has 2 astromechs. It seems to be telling use that in the future we will see 2 astromechs on a ship!!!

All discard effects are worded like that (ie. discard 1 of [thing]). It doesn't mean anything.

Also, from a cold game balance point of view, so long as R2-D2 and R2 Astromechs both exist, no Rebel ship is ever getting 2 astromech slots.

Also, R2 and BB-8.

There are a lot of options with this, R2-D6 with a one use EPT or one that becomes much less valuable late game like Draw Their Fire, generic R2s for easy stress clearing, R5s or R3-D6 if you want to double down on survivability.

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

Because the T-70 would rather take Autothrusters.

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

Because the T-70 would rather take Autothrusters.

Bam. Which begs the question, why is it in the T-70 pack?

Most annoying that the T-65 'fix' ships in the T-70 blister, and there's only one of them. I'm really not going to go run out and buy four T-70s so I can strengthen a T-65 swarm.

(That it is supposed to be the X-Wing 'fix' is apparently by the limitation on it. I mean, what harm would throwing this on a Y-Wing or E-Wing do? It's not exactly overpowered...)

Y-Wings aren't hurting for durability. E-Wings could have also used it, and I can't come up with a good reason why it shouldn't.

This is a solid buff, though. For basically one point, you can have Rookie Squadron pilots with every speed 1-2 green move, and the ability to discard their droid to prevent lethal damage or a nasty crit.

It also doesn't really help the higher-PS named pilots, as they usually want Engine Upgrade instead of this.

Well, couldn't the higher PS aces take this and R7-T1 for a boost, action efficiency and the increased durability?

Most annoying that the T-65 'fix' ships in the T-70 blister, and there's only one of them. I'm really not going to go run out and buy four T-70s so I can strengthen a T-65 swarm.

(That it is supposed to be the X-Wing 'fix' is apparently by the limitation on it. I mean, what harm would throwing this on a Y-Wing or E-Wing do? It's not exactly overpowered...)

Y-Wings aren't hurting for durability. E-Wings could have also used it, and I can't come up with a good reason why it shouldn't.

This is a solid buff, though. For basically one point, you can have Rookie Squadron pilots with every speed 1-2 green move, and the ability to discard their droid to prevent lethal damage or a nasty crit.

It also doesn't really help the higher-PS named pilots, as they usually want Engine Upgrade instead of this.

Well, couldn't the higher PS aces take this and R7-T1 for a boost, action efficiency and the increased durability?

Blue Ace does not grant you permission to use his astromech if you're just going to eject it.

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

Because the T-70 would rather take Autothrusters.

Bam. Which begs the question, why is it in the T-70 pack?

Because it is an option if you don't have/don't have the points for Autothrusters.

I like the fix, but I do hope for a title which allows the X-wing to barrel roll. I mean they are not changing the engines, so boost doesn't work for me, but adding barrel roll to all T65's (Perhaps they add some thrusters to help the maneuver) this gives them a solid place in the game. IMO

I too am shocked it doesn't work for the E-wing, but I guess I understand.

Would be nice to have an extra free shield on the E-wing low PS guys too.

Most annoying that the T-65 'fix' ships in the T-70 blister, and there's only one of them. I'm really not going to go run out and buy four T-70s so I can strengthen a T-65 swarm.

(That it is supposed to be the X-Wing 'fix' is apparently by the limitation on it. I mean, what harm would throwing this on a Y-Wing or E-Wing do? It's not exactly overpowered...)

Y-Wings aren't hurting for durability. E-Wings could have also used it, and I can't come up with a good reason why it shouldn't.

This is a solid buff, though. For basically one point, you can have Rookie Squadron pilots with every speed 1-2 green move, and the ability to discard their droid to prevent lethal damage or a nasty crit.

It also doesn't really help the higher-PS named pilots, as they usually want Engine Upgrade instead of this.

Well, couldn't the higher PS aces take this and R7-T1 for a boost, action efficiency and the increased durability?

Blue Ace does not grant you permission to use his astromech if you're just going to eject it.

.....What?

I like the fix, but I do hope for a title which allows the X-wing to barrel roll. I mean they are not changing the engines, so boost doesn't work for me, but adding barrel roll to all T65's (Perhaps they add some thrusters to help the maneuver) this gives them a solid place in the game. IMO

I too am shocked it doesn't work for the E-wing, but I guess I understand.

Would be nice to have an extra free shield on the E-wing low PS guys too.

It would help to bypass eating one of those crits that bypasses shields and could potentially one shot full health Corran.

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

Because the T-70 would rather take Autothrusters.

I think that's debatable - Autothrusters end up being largely useless against a number of builds (not that we see those builds much, but hope springs eternal, right?)

But let's leave that aside for the moment. How does "The T-70 has even better upgrade options" translate to "It's better to take a T-65 with this one"?

Because if you're going to argue that Autothrusters is a better upgrade than the Integrated Astromech, and we generally accept that the T-70 is a better ship, how does this do anything to recommend the T-65? About the only thing to recommend it would be cost, and keeping a potential 4X build... which the Integrated+R2 lets you do.

we don't accept that the t-70 is a "better" ship, assuming that vague all inclusive definition of "better" that comes without any further context

naked, the blue novice w.e is actually worse (ito jousting efficiency) than the rookie

I think it's fairly good paired with R2. I'm a little disappointed that you only see one per pack in the announcement.

[Edit] - Also I think it is very thematic too. Better still.

Do you think FFG will change their mind and have at least two per pack?

naked, the blue novice w.e is actually worse (ito jousting efficiency) than the rookie

I can't tell if you're trying to highlight the limitations of jousting efficiency as a meaningful number, or if you're actually serious here. But either way, it doesn't seem like a very serious discussion, so I'll just be moving along.

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

Because the T-70 would rather take Autothrusters.

Bam. Which begs the question, why is it in the T-70 pack?

That's... not what begging the question means (Begging the Question is a logical fallacy involving circular reasoning in which the proof is basically tautological). That being said, it's in the T-70 pack because it actually does help the generic blue squadron x-wing, and because FFG (probably) won't be releasing any more x-wings any time soon in all likelihood.

naked, the blue novice w.e is actually worse (ito jousting efficiency) than the rookie

I can't tell if you're trying to highlight the limitations of jousting efficiency as a meaningful number, or if you're actually serious here. But either way, it doesn't seem like a very serious discussion, so I'll just be moving along.

Low PS pilots are lousy arc dodgers, and the T-70 is too expensive to block with. So, yeah, jousting efficiency is pretty important to the Blue Squadron Novice.

Gah, Double Post while trying to edit >.>

Most annoying that the T-65 'fix' ships in the T-70 blister, and there's only one of them. I'm really not going to go run out and buy four T-70s so I can strengthen a T-65 swarm.

(That it is supposed to be the X-Wing 'fix' is apparently by the limitation on it. I mean, what harm would throwing this on a Y-Wing or E-Wing do? It's not exactly overpowered...)

So... why would you ever put this on a T-65?

Anything this can do to improve the T-65, you can also do to improve the T-70. For the same cost. So the extra 3 points of the T-70 (which gets you another shield and MASSIVELY better mobility), which was often called the "right" price compared to the overpriced T-65, gets the same buff. How does that not leave the T-65 still overpriced?

Because the T-70 would rather take Autothrusters.

Bam. Which begs the question, why is it in the T-70 pack?

If not the T-70 expansion pack, where should FFG have placed it? Where would it have made more sense to be? They couldnt place it in the T-65 packs...Just curios as to an alternative!!!

I think it's sorta rubbish. Won't get me to play more T-65s at all.

Overall, very underwhelmed with both the T-70 and TIE/fo expansions unless they are only $10 USD (hint: they won't be).

what HE said. In a word... underwhelming.