Hey all,

Having been introduced to FFG by Imperial Assault, I managed to buy a couple of X-Wing cores two days before the new one was released (admittedly I live in the UK, so couldn't have gone to a Target). Timing is everything. I had no idea the game existed until about 3 months ago, so be gentle.

I think I love it. My wife and I have played a couple of very simple games (just the intro twice and then the same ships but with fuller rules), and all the base mechanics are loads of fun.

However, I am a pretty hardcore OT fan and (despite a healthy PC TIE Fighter obsession when I was younger) don't find myself very excited by any of the non-OT ships (so after about Wave 3 / Aces). Nor am I particularly interested in the idea of breaking into the epic scale stuff; we tend to like a cleaner, quicker game and it feels a bit shoe-horned in, to my admittedly uneducated eye. We also don't have a 6 foot table!

I'm not a competitive player, so this is purely in the context of wanting to play with family and friends: just how wrong is my OT-only position ? Are there going to be interesting mechanics we're missing out on by sticking to the early ships? Any balance issues we should look out for, or might need to supplement with cards or ships from later waves?

And if this is a hopelessly general question, tell me so and I shall come back when I've played for a few months rather than a few hours!

Any help appreciated.

Nothing wrong with your position. Play what you like. There are toys and tech you don't get and some of them are quite fun, but I would never suggest buying what you don't want.

Edit - stupid autocorrect

X-wing --> currently, the most maligned ship of the lot. Stiff, but not stat-efficient to overcome its lack of maneuverability. Thankfully, both Biggs and Luke can overcome its surprisingly fragile profile.

Tie Fighter --> the gold standard since day one, still incredibly viable (if you trust your dice more than I do...)

A-wing --> requires Rebel Aces if thinking competitively. Inefficient as a straight dice-tosser, so needs good manuevering to get the most out of. Speedy, tricky, and durable but not particularly frightening (apart from Jakes with proton rockets) I find them to be incredible fun, especially if you love creating traffic jams on the board. the proto-type pilot is one of the best blockers in the game

B-wing --> the rock of the rebellion's church. Tough and efficient, these guys sadly replace the X-wing (not because they're op, the X-wing was just poorly designed ) as both a cornerstone of many squadrons and as one of the most versatile ships in the game due to the many upgrade slots they pack. Take em naked or specialize them to taste, as long as you don't overload them with points they're golden

Y-wing --> similar to the B, only stiffer for its lack of barrel roll. Inefficient when naked, but highly customizable through the turret slot and upgrades released in Most Wanted and the K-wing expansion (which unfortunately does mean you'll have to hunt the cards down if you want to play competitively with more than just an ion turret). Very reliable and versatile little bugger, just don't mess with the inefficient named pilots unless you got a plan in mind.

Tie Advance --> formerly the worst ship in the game, now highly viable due to the release of the Raider (has upgrade cards and new pilots). If thinking competitively, these guys will eat into your budget.

Tie Bomber --> stiff, but very solid. Surprisingly efficient when run naked, but the nature of ordnance and the distribution of bombs across ship expansions means you'll have to do some planning to hunt down upgrades if you're thinking of running bombers competitively as something other than beefy tie fighters.

Tie Interceptor --> requires Starviper for auto-thrusters if thinking competitively. Very speedy and maneuverable, but also a "**** up and you're done" type of deal. Very unforgiving if misplayed, unless you beg your dice for mercy.

Yt-1300 --> ugh...I hate the implementation of the ship's turret in this game (very lazy game design, imo) but the **** thing's solid. Can't have a star wars game where Han isn't amazing, right?

Firespray --> unfortunately, the imperial variants are considered very underpowered. Scum and villainy released new pilots in Most Wanted, but only for the Scum and villainy faction.

but defenders are totes canon and fought at endor!

Buy the ships that you want to play with.

Don't buy ships you don't want, to get upgrades that you do want.

Heck you don't really even have to buy the X-Wing expansion in order to use the additional pilots that come with it (although the ship token comes in handy)

Scans of all the upgrade and pilot cards are available online and their text is included on most squad building apps

http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/X-Wing_Miniatures_Wiki

http://xwing-builder.co.uk/build

oh forgot (for shame )

Shuttle --> very chunky and point efficient, but with a cripplingly bad dial. Not something you will see in bulk (ala B-wings) outside of silly (silly awesome) lists, but a very potent gun platform if you can work around how horribly it turns

popular variants such as the Doom Shuttle (vader crew) and buzzsaw (fire control system, gunner) make it exceedingly accurate even without actions, which let you do silly things like bump your own shuttle to keep it in play

the pack also comes with some amazing upgrade cards, especially for the empire

Thanks for the answers all, and esp for the rundown ficklegreendice. Also those scans will be amazingly helpful, thanks Funkleton.

Surely there are no Defenders onscreen in Jedi? Actually my twelve-year old self already thought the Defender looked ridiculous in the video game, and my thirty-five-year old self doesn't feel any better about it

Expanded universe says they were that's good enough for me.

Expanded universe says they were that's good enough for me.

Fair enough

I was already starting to feel like the X-Wing itself was an odd duck, so I'll pick up some B-Wings and others to broaden our experience a bit. Already had A-Ws and Interceptors ordered due to positive stuff online, so it should be a much more interesting palette soon.

You guys are the best, cheers.

You are not alone.

I started playing with a OT only mindset but slowly eu stuff crept in (imperial aces, z95s etc) as to me they were things i saw as 'legit' from tie fighter and not the novels nonesense.

But then when you play a lot of other people there are occasionally ships you buy for the cards... for example i play tie interceptors a lot and i have two starvipers i've used once that i bought for 'auto thrusters'.

But playing in a group of like minded mates like I do makes this less of an issue, for home games we use 'xwing builder' web site and print out the lists so we dont need upgrade cards.

I suggest you do the same if you dont fancy the obscure eu stuff.

I totally felt the same way as you for a long time but the EU stuff grows on you and some of it (z95s, defenders etc) to me is sort of OT (ish) because I saw TIE fighter and xwing as legitimate parts of the OT film franchise as they were set between ANH and Jedi.

All the thawn, vong etc etc books left me cold so i know where you're coming from.

where abouts in the UK are you? If you're near the east midlands my mates and I will happily play OT only games.

Simon and I did a huge 'endor' game recently where you could only take stuff and pilots that were at endor (no Biggs, no phantoms etc etc)

You will find this board very tourny centric BTW, a lot of people would fly a cotton reel on a stand if the stat line was good and it was 'points efficient' as they honestly dont seem to care about the mythos/lore of star wars. For example my mates and i never play 'rebel vs rebel' etc as its frankly ridiculous when Luke in an xwing is shooting at luke who is the gunner on the falcon on the other side

edit: as for the new core set, i'd try and get a spare damage deck of one of the many people who will buy several for the ships, ditto new rules etc as you probably dont want the ships and those of us that bought multiple cores back in the day have duplicate damage decks, rules etc we never use.... the only useful things than the ships are a second set of templates and more dice

Some OT ships become a lot more interesting with cards from other sets. I would proxy these sorts of cards. Specifically, I'm thinking the BTL-A4 title for Y-wings that lets them fire both Turret and Primary weapons, but only in the front arc. There are others, though.

Thanks for the answers all, and esp for the rundown ficklegreendice. Also those scans will be amazingly helpful, thanks Funkleton.

Surely there are no Defenders onscreen in Jedi? Actually my twelve-year old self already thought the Defender looked ridiculous in the video game, and my thirty-five-year old self doesn't feel any better about it

You're welcome.

I used to think the Defender was by far the most awesome and menacing looking model in the game - that was before it was edged into second place by the TIE Punisher

But that's all a matter of taste - whatever ships you buy or don't buy you'll still have fun

OK cool, I'll take a look through the card lists on the web after a few weeks and maybe print a few proxies to test out.

I've only ever been in to the original trilogy. I did try to read one of the EU books once, but lost interest before I even finished the first chapter. I got into this game because "sweet, star wars ships!", but I kept playing and collecting because it's fun. As long as the ship looks like it could show up in the star wars universe, I don't care where what book, comic, or video game it came out of.

So really, if you enjoy the game, you're doing your self a disservice by skipping over ships you haven't seen on screen.

TBH if you print the whole list in printer friendly form before your game on xwing squad builder you dont need to print the cards out as it prints out the list with the card text on it if you set it to 'expanded text'

I've only ever been in to the original trilogy. I did try to read one of the EU books once, but lost interest before I even finished the first chapter. I got into this game because "sweet, star wars ships!", but I kept playing and collecting because it's fun. As long as the ship looks like it could show up in the star wars universe, I don't care where what book, comic, or video game it came out of.

So really, if you enjoy the game, you're doing your self a disservice by skipping over ships you haven't seen on screen.

Horses for course though isnt it?

Like I dont mind the EU these days but still can't stand same faction matches as its not 'star wars' to me and 'training exercise' is lame.

For some people if it wasnt on the OT screen, its simply no star wars.

Like i can buy into 'mara jade' as i used to play 'masters of tera kasai' on the playstation, it was star wars tekken... but other EU characters mean *nothing* to me.

Its like if you don't like the look or feel of a ship, unless you're just interested in winning and having a maths exercise with the aid of pieces of plastic you're never going to want to fly them are you?

But for some people playing IG88b + IG88D vs IG88b + IG88d is the height of xwing, they dont care that its a total travesty of narrative, what they care about is effective ships and efficiency.

<my2cents>

It's not like I'm anti-EU, but I've not spent a lot of time with it and what I've experienced lacks imagination and texture compared to the OT. For example I read the Thrawn trilogy recently (I think he's in a bunch of books but I mean the 3 starting with Heir to the Empire) and really enjoyed them, especially the amazing Leia stuff, even as my inner literary critic let out one continuous bloodcurdling scream.

</my2cents>

So I guess it's just I want a feeling of Star-Wars-iness that I only really get from the OT. I accept that there'll be really good mechanics hiding in the other ships, hence the topic, in case I'm missing anything unmissable.

Gadge: there's no way I'll talk my wife into using a squad builder app so it'll have to be proxy cards =)

Welcome to the game.

Personally, I felt like the game was at its best just before wave 4. That leaves you with X's, B's, Y's, A's, the Falcon (and the HWK...), TIE's, Interceptors, Bombers, the Slave I, and the Lambda shuttle. All of these were seen in the the movies, save the HWK-290/"Moldy Crow" and back in these days, the rules were nice and simple.

Then wave four kicked in, and brought us the Phantom (and I guess a couple other ships...). The cloaking mechanism really messed things up for a while, and meant you had two lists: a fat Falcon, or a PS9 Whisper & escorts. Wave 5 added a couple new large ships, the Decimator and Outrider. The former was the Imperial "equivalent" to the Falcon, and the Outrider is just kinda...there. It's kind of a unique ship, in that it gets a cannon turret thing.
Then came wave 6, and brought us scum. As an OT purist, you'll definitely stay away from here. A pack to convert ships to scum, the not-hugely-recognizeable StarViper, and the very-obscure Scyk. Meh. Wave 7 dipped even deeper into weirdness.

I recommend just printing out the cards you want. Buy the ships you like. If you don't wanna play competitively, there's no reason to.

Honestly, the squad builder is actually *easier* than laying out cards. Give it a go.

I find it really helps in lists where you've got a *lot* of cards i front of you like A wing lists where you've got

chardan refit, test pilot , one EPT, a second EPT and a modification in front of four ships! Much easier having a piece of A4

It also rarely lets you make illegal combinations which is possible to accidentally do with cards

But im a luddite in other ways so i totally get it if your wife doesnt like stuff like that

Welcome to the game.

Personally, I felt like the game was at its best just before wave 4. That leaves you with X's, B's, Y's, A's, the Falcon (and the HWK...), TIE's, Interceptors, Bombers, the Slave I, and the Lambda shuttle. All of these were seen in the the movies, save the HWK-290/"Moldy Crow" and back in these days, the rules were nice and simple.

Then wave four kicked in, and brought us the Phantom (and I guess a couple other ships...).

Again for me the HWK fitted in because of 'dark forces' being a very good game at the time, pre prequels and narratively felt like part of the OT, the defender and z95 in that wave fitted because of tie fighter and xwing....

the phantom was the problem child for me, in every respect.

It was a cool game mechanic idea that just became annoying and list dominating.

Welcome to the game.

Personally, I felt like the game was at its best just before wave 4. That leaves you with X's, B's, Y's, A's, the Falcon (and the HWK...), TIE's, Interceptors, Bombers, the Slave I, and the Lambda shuttle. All of these were seen in the the movies, save the HWK-290/"Moldy Crow" and back in these days, the rules were nice and simple.

Then wave four kicked in, and brought us the Phantom (and I guess a couple other ships...).

Again for me the HWK fitted in because of 'dark forces' being a very good game at the time, pre prequels and narratively felt like part of the OT, the defender and z95 in that wave fitted because of tie fighter and xwing....

the phantom was the problem child for me, in every respect.

It was a cool game mechanic idea that just became annoying and list dominating.

I'm with ya there. I never played Dark Forces, but I was very much in love with XWA as a kid, and remember the Defender. Dunno where I first saw the Z-95, but the HWK was new to me.

Welcome to your new favorite obsession. It'll happen. Don't kid yourself.

I started just buying all imperial and my buddy all rebel. We'd proxy, we'd just print off cards, whatever worked. We both then started getting just a few from the "other" side. Scum now has is buying in on all 3. I'm still focusing mostly on imperial and around 1 of each for scum and 1 of each small for rebels. I still don't have a falcon or outrider (but my birthday and Christmas are coming along), and I just got my Raider!

That was a long long round about to get to this; the game plays well at whatever level you play it at. From the kitchen table, casual game stores, to the highest level of tournament play it just works. The only risk is to your pocketbook and if who you are playing suddenly netlists or jumps into the more competitive pool.

I'm a teacher so most of my games lately and in the near future are 1-2 ship each for each of 4-5 player battle

Royals or all the Padawans VS the Master at ~150pts (they really really really want to beat me someday). Since I supply all the minis, I get to decide what power level we play at and I don't let the phantom, Super Fel, R2-Dcorran, or chirpy ruin their day (capt. Oicuun in 150pt against them sometimes).

Again, welcome, and enjoy. That's the real key to this, and most, games.

I keep meaning to see if 'good old games' have Dark Forces still, it was epic back in the day.... star wars fps where you steal the death star plans in the first mission! Got a bit 'fantastical' towards the end but very atmospheric.

I have a feeling it would seem crushingly terrible if i played it now given how FPS gmes have improved.

That said i replayed tie fighter this year and its still excellent.

yeah,, dark forces hasnt aged well at all

Interesting how much perspectives vary depending on where our Star Wars experience is based.

I'm an OT guy, but liked some of the early EU stuff, especially the X-wing series. I played a lot of the early Star Wars games -- X-wing series, Rebel Assault I & II , Shadows of the Empire , Dark Forces -- so while I prefer OT ships, I like having a few of the later ones around that fit my gaming experiences: Z-95, HWK-290, TIE-Phantom, YT-2400 (and, heck, the TIE/fo and T-70, because if you squint they might as well be the OT ships). The Defender I still think is silly despite having played it in TIE Fighter, though .

1. There is no wrong position on it. Play and buy whatever you like!

2. Interesting machanics: honestly yes, a lot of the later expansions do ahve interesting maneauver possibilities and or upgrade cards that arent existant in the OT only packs. Still i would first stick to those for balancing. If you start mixing only some new things into the older releases you might get some serious balancing problems that noone of us can estimate having played everything whenever it came out.

Later on if you have more understanding how the game works and it maybe is getting a bit more boring to play i would suggest using one of the squadron builders for interesting options available to your OT-Ships through later packs. However spread it out evenly. Dont only buff (get more stuff for) the B-Wing and get nothing for the TIE-Advanced.