One thing that need to be considered is the fact that it's going to be relatively easy to avoid the ISD's front arc by going through it to get to its side with small ships. Because the base is large, the arcs are going to be large on the edge of the cardboard and it's going to be very easy to have a small ship within it. Easier than it is today with the Victory class.

I think we're going to see a general rule of thumb in terms of killing effectiveness : Large Ships > Medium Ships > Small Ships > Large Ships.

Won't be so easy if charging past the ISD means charging into the teeth of a waiting VSD I

I agree. I meant my comment as a bone thrown to the VSD

Victory Star Destroyer -I

"I can't believe its not an ISD"

Expanded Launchers + Heavy Turbolaser Turrets + Dominator Title Card (+31 pts)

A bit of Speculation on my part, this seems like a horrible way to surprise someone who has had a bit of a sigh of relief at you NOT bringing an Imperial Star Destroyer. At 6 points Cheaper than the ISD-I, it throws out just the same amount of Dice out the front, and comes with Heavy Turbolasers to force people to spend only that Brace. With Screed as your Admiral, this Victory Star Destroyer just waits for Close Range, and if it gets it, people will die. Three Red, Up to Two Blue, and Five Black has an average damage of 8.75 per Front Salvo, with a decent chance of accuracies to nullify those defense tokens. Throw Gunnery Teams on there (and be one point more than an ISD-1) and throw that at two enemy Ships in your Front arc.

A Tactic I want to see more with it and the ISD is the Bullhorn tactic.

I think this only works when you've got thousands of Zulu, yes? So unless/until we see the ISS Shaka Zulu....

A Tactic I want to see more with it and the ISD is the Bullhorn tactic.

I think this only works when you've got thousands of Zulu, yes? So unless/until we see the ISS Shaka Zulu....

The tactic is viable in Armada.

Using the ISD as the FAC and the VSD as the main force. It would allow players to respond to where an opponent will be

this Victory Star Destroyer just waits for Close Range

And waits. And waits. And waits. Oh, no stupid Rebels around today.

this Victory Star Destroyer just waits for Close Range

And waits. And waits. And waits. Oh, no stupid Rebels around today.

sshh...

be vewy vewy quiet

we're hunting webels

eheheheheheh

One-shotting small ships is nice as well, but tbh there will also be a greater chance of wasting firepower. You are already occasionally able to oneshot small stuff with a VSDs bow arc, so the chances for an ISD to overkill its target are by far greater. With bigger ships but smaller quantities, you also have less chances to force your opponent to use or burn defense tokens. Sure you got that painful bow firepower, but the more you concentrate firepower the more your opponent may concentrate his use of tokens.

Everything worth killing is worth overkilling. I'd rather "waste" some fickle red, blue or black dice and be sure the target won't shoot back.

The cost of the ISD makes me think the VSD will still be used. Its not quite double the cost, more like 1.5x-ish, but thats a hefty price for only a few extra dice and 3 health.

I'd field 1 ISD purely because i would be SHOCKED if something survives a close up doublearc, even without cards that hope for that scenario, but i'd rather have multiple VSD with it than another ISD. Plus the squadron part, since personally i find playing squadronless to be out of character and kinda ruins part of the game (personal opinion only). The ISD can do its own thing, such as giving out free tokens with Tarkin, while the VSD's activate all of my fighters lol.

My friend and i love massing things though. Wouldnt doubt it if in the future we have a game large enough to need a 6by6 board which has multiple ISD/VSD's lol.

The vsd is still far more efficient

What you're getting with the isd is an upgrade platform

Want a real durable flagship? Vsd can do it but isd 2 with projectors can do it more

Want a way to bring a front arc of death onto your foes? Isd can do it, between wider arcs and better nav chart. It's less efficient, more precise.

Want to one shot some poor fool in a single activation? An isd's 8 dice and four squadron can do it

While this might seem silly, you have to consider the isd as a precision instrument (like a surgeon wielding a tank turret)

The vsd is more value, more bodies; more dice for the cost. The isd is a whole lot of power packed into one place; one activation. How amazing it will be depends entirely on his effectively you bring it to bear

It's an expensive, high performance monster of a model like a king tiger. The VSD is a cheaper, efficient brick of a ship so more like a t-35 if it couldn't turn for ****

Since I have 2 vsds and a limited budget, I'll be running 2 naked vsd-1s for sheer brute force and then Vader on an isd 2 to apply when/where needed

I expect i'll be running ISD with a pair of VSD's as support quite often. I just really like the combo.

ISD-2 + 2 VSD-2's comes to 290 naked, leaving 110 for upgrades, Admiral and squadrons. it's not subtle mind you, and you can always cheapen it up by using VSD-1's.

Thats a hell of a "clenched fist".

One-shotting small ships is nice as well, but tbh there will also be a greater chance of wasting firepower. You are already occasionally able to oneshot small stuff with a VSDs bow arc, so the chances for an ISD to overkill its target are by far greater. With bigger ships but smaller quantities, you also have less chances to force your opponent to use or burn defense tokens. Sure you got that painful bow firepower, but the more you concentrate firepower the more your opponent may concentrate his use of tokens.

Everything worth killing is worth overkilling. I'd rather "waste" some fickle red, blue or black dice and be sure the target won't shoot back.

Well, partly. I agree that a certain amount of "overkill" is okay, as you want things to stay dead for sure. However, wasting one of your maximum of two attacks from a 150+ flagship ISDs front battery on some persky CR90 is only fun till you realise that your VSD could have done the trick quite reliably too, with less investment. In this game you have 6 turns, and you most likely waste a turn or two navigating, so that leaves 4 rounds of blasting things. If you expect to play against a rebell swarm, I think VSDs might have an edge as you simply get more attacks (albeit each with lesser raw firepower). So efficiency-wise VSDs still are viable options.

More activations and more attacks also mean you would be able to exhaust an enemies def tokens more easily. Its like the rebells "thousand thin paper cuts" tactic, but with bricks. Like, "hundred not-so-thin-brick cuts". But then again, who cares about elegance..

Except the more maneuverable ISD is more likely to gets its front arc on the CR-90 than the VSD which is more likely to have to make do with a side arc.