Email from Frank about Conner Nets and Ion tokens.

By VanorDM, in X-Wing Rules Questions

Finally got an answer, since there's been a few topics start on this, I figured I'd just start a new one for the answer rather find one of the other topics.

In response to your rules question:

Rules Question:

Question about conner nets. At some point someone emailed you all about what to do if Leebo is used when Advanced Sensors...

Here's the email Frank sent. "Rule Question: Leebo as crew on a B-wing with advanced sensors. What happens during the activation phase, when you use Leebo before you reveal your dial, and gain an ion token? Does the ion effect change for the activation phase kick in immediately, resulting in a 1 white forward even though a player has a dial set but not revealed? Or does the whole ion effect come into play next turn? The B-wing would perform a free boost action (receiving an ion token) and then still reveal its maneuver like normal. The effects of the ion token would occur during the next planning and activation phases." This has caused a discussion on the msg boards about how conner nets work. Based on the above email from Frank, if a ship hits a conner net, the ion tokens wouldn't go into effect until the next turn. So a ship wouldn't be able to perform any actions this turn, but would perform it's maneuver like normal and then perform the white 1 straight next turn.

If a Conner Net is dropped overlapping a ship and immediately detonates, and that ship has not yet activated this phase, that ship executes the maneuver on its dial as normal and skips its “Perform Action” step. If a Conner Net is dropped overlapping a ship and immediately detonates, and that ship has activated this phase, that ship suffers the effects of being ionized next turn and does not skip any “Perform Action” step. If a ship is ionized, executes its 1 straight maneuver, and overlaps a Connor Net, all ion tokens are discarded at the end of the maneuver (including those received from Connor Net).

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks

Game Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

Bolded the answer.

Edited by VanorDM

BLAST!

I was just coming on here to post the answer I just got (which is a copy/paste duplicate of yours)

Ninja'd by :ph34r: Vanor

Edited by Forgottenlore

...and says nothing about the ion tokens if you drop it on a ship that hasn't moved yet. I assume the ion tokens land and take effect next turn? Maybe?

I swear, they must have an internal contest to see who can best avoid the actual issue being asked.

It's a shame, basically every one of those ruling makes Connor net slightly weaker, disappointing really

Ninja'd by :ph34r: Vanor

Points at title...

...and says nothing about the ion tokens if you drop it on a ship that hasn't moved yet.

That's the part I bolded. It would perform it's maneuver like normal, which means the ion tokens go into effect next turn. So that means it works the same as Leebo, which hopefully shows up in the next FAQ.

Edited by VanorDM

That's the part I bolded. It would perform it's maneuver like normal, which means the ion tokens go into effect next turn.

Unless it had already been ioned the previous round, in which case the Conner net tokens will get removed at the same time as the other ion tokens.

Wow. Yeah I just got the same email as well, I kinda understand the ion next turn thing, even though that's not quite how the rules are written, but for balance ok, sure. But not skipping next turn's action step? HUGE nerf for nets on high PS ships, half the text (and cost!) of the nets is now useless against lower PS ships, these will almost exclusively go on PS 1/2 ships now, very sad.

EDIT: Well, I guess it's not an overwhelming nerf as I originally thought, you could still drop the token in front of the ship, I often forget that mines work that way, lol. Still not great I think.

Edited by imprezagoatee

I understand the first two conditions but the third condition he's talking about I want to wrap my brain around.

If a ship is ionized, executes its 1 straight maneuver, and overlaps a Connor Net, all ion tokens are discarded at the end of the maneuver (including those received from Connor Net).

Does this mean if a ship is ionized and passes over a Connor net, it has no ion effect, you just take damage and skip action phase? That's interesting

I understand the first two conditions but the third condition he's talking about I want to wrap my brain around.

If a ship is ionized, executes its 1 straight maneuver, and overlaps a Connor Net, all ion tokens are discarded at the end of the maneuver (including those received from Connor Net).
Bolded the answer.

Does this mean if a ship is ionized and passes over a Connor net, it has no ion effect, you just take damage and skip action phase? That's interesting

What damage? But otherwise, yes, just skip the action.

Edit: I was so focused on the ion effects, I totally forgot it gave damage as well, lol.

Edited by imprezagoatee
I understand the first two conditions but the third condition he's talking about I want to wrap my brain around.
If a ship is ionized, executes its 1 straight maneuver, and overlaps a Connor Net, all ion tokens are discarded at the end of the maneuver (including those received from Connor Net).
Bolded the answer.

Does this mean if a ship is ionized and passes over a Connor net, it has no ion effect, you just take damage and skip action phase? That's interesting

Yep, basically what happens is when you hit the net the triggers all happen, damage, 2 ion and skip action, then the existing ion effect wipes away all ion tokens including the new ones.

It really doesn't make sense, in effect ion tokens only work if you have had them since the planning phase, so surely only'active' ion tokens should be removed.

Sadly that's not how it works apparently and it is what it is, another missed opportunity in my book

...and says nothing about the ion tokens if you drop it on a ship that hasn't moved yet.

That's the part I bolded. It would perform it's maneuver like normal, which means the ion tokens go into effect next turn. So that means it works the same as Leebo, which hopefully shows up in the next FAQ.

Except the part you bolded doesn't actually say anything at all about ion tokens. Which, OK, we can probably puzzle it out, but we're far enough off the actual printed rules at this point that it would have been nice to have it all explicit.

It really doesn't make sense, in effect ion tokens only work if you have had them since the planning phase, so surely only'active' ion tokens should be removed.

Sadly that's not how it works apparently and it is what it is, another missed opportunity in my book

This part actually conforms to the rules, which say that after executing an ion maneuver, you remove all ion tokens. So just like a small ship that gets two tokens from hits, you clear them all. The rules don't care when or how you got them.

I understand the first two conditions but the third condition he's talking about I want to wrap my brain around.

If a ship is ionized, executes its 1 straight maneuver, and overlaps a Connor Net, all ion tokens are discarded at the end of the maneuver (including those received from Connor Net).
Bolded the answer.

Does this mean if a ship is ionized and passes over a Connor net, it has no ion effect, you just take damage and skip action phase? That's interesting

What damage? But otherwise, yes, just skip the action.

You take 1 damage when it detonates, and get 2 ion tokens for your trouble, as well as skip your Perform Action step. But in this case the ion tokens come off again straight away.

Edited by Parravon

I think FFG made this ruling so that a player is never caught completely off guard when one of their ships gets netted. If you set a maneuver for your ship, it should never be cancelled by your opponent's actions before your ship has a chance to move. That way, you can set your maneuver dials for the next turn knowing which of your ships will be ioned.

Open the spoiler for a diagram explaining what happens if a ship gets hit by a Connor Net before activation:

Consider the following situation: Player A is flying 3 Blue Squadron Pilots in formation, and Player B has an Advanced Scopes-equipped Deathrain nearby, carrying a payload of Connor Nets.

I I I

B B B -- D

(lines indicate ship facing)

Player A sets all his BSP's dials to a 2-bank, intending for all the ships to stay in formation. But Deathrain moves first, pulling up next to the B-Wing formation and dropping a Connor Net on one of them.

I I I

B B >B< -- D

(>B< indicates netted BSP)

The unfortunate pilot takes a damage and two ion tokens, and will have to skip his Perform Actions step this round. But he will still carry out a 2-bank maneuver alongside his squadmates, as his dial was already "locked in" for the turn. The ion tokens are NOT cleared from the netted BSP after this maneuver.

/ / /

B B >B<

-- D

In the following turn, Player A will set the dials for his two leftmost BSPs, while the netted BSP must perform a 1-straight maneuver because it has ion tokens. But Player A knows this will happen, and can assign maneuvers to his other ships with this knowledge in mind.

If the netted BSP had its assigned maneuver forcibly changed to a 1-straight by the Connor Net, the final ship arrangement would look like this instead:

/ /

B B I

>B<

-- D

Player A would be blindsided by the Connor Net deployment, and his ships would be thrown out of formation. This would be very unfair to Player A, and would work differently than any other situation in X-Wing. The FAQ'd version looks awkward on paper but makes the most sense in practice.

TL;DR: The FAQ version of the rules is sensible and works a lot more elegantly in practice than the email's cumbersome wording suggests.
I posted this in the General Discussion thread regarding this subject, but I'm reposting it here to help explain the situation. This is a very confusing ruling on paper, but it makes much more sense when represented visually.

Except the part you bolded doesn't actually say anything at all about ion tokens.

Perhaps I'm reading into it. But to me the answer seems clear, because it's the same thing as the ruling for Leboo, which I quoted in the email to Frank. So RAI, the Ion effect only happens when the whole thing happens in one turn. If for any reason you get ion tokens after setting your dial they don't actually go into effect until the next planing phase.

That means the ion rules aren't just a series of steps you check off, but a process and every step of it must happen in the listed order.

This part actually conforms to the rules, which say that after executing an ion maneuver, you remove all ion tokens.

Yeah, the idea is that if you're already ionized you'd lose all ion tokens when you perform the 1 straight per the rules. How you got the extra ones doesn't matter.

IMO this isn't a nerf either. It's not much different then shooting an already ionized ship with a ion weapon. Knowing where someone will go next turn is still a very useful thing. The one downside of this is the fact that the skipping the perform action step doesn't carry over to the next round, but I don't think anyone expected that, did they?

That means the ion rules aren't just a series of steps you check off, but a process and every step of it must happen in the listed order.

I'm hoping they update the Ion rules to make this more clear, but from Frank's answer, this is correct.

The one downside of this is the fact that the skipping the perform action step doesn't carry over to the next round, but I don't think anyone expected that, did they?

I did.

It didn't say this round, so clearly it should apply the next time the 'Perform Action' step occurred, which would sometimes be next round. It's not wrong the way Frank ruled it, it's just odd.

That means the ion rules aren't just a series of steps you check off, but a process and every step of it must happen in the listed order.

I'm hoping they update the Ion rules to make this more clear, but from Frank's answer, this is correct.

The one downside of this is the fact that the skipping the perform action step doesn't carry over to the next round, but I don't think anyone expected that, did they?

I did.

It didn't say this round, so clearly it should apply the next time the 'Perform Action' step occurred, which would sometimes be next round. It's not wrong the way Frank ruled it, it's just odd.

Actually the Conner net says: "[...] skips its "Perform Action" step."

Which I agree, could be interpreted as the one on this round (if not performed yet) or the next available (if the ship already activated this round).

But, official ruling is official ruling

The result is due to the problem of what to do with the dial. The ion maneuver doesn't cancel it out and you get weird activation phase results from it (double movement and double "perform action" steps).

I hope this is in the next FAQ to help clear this up.