Why oh why FFG, why isn't the second TLT shot only happening if the first one missed?

Reduced number of damage per turn but still good odds of actually scoring one, even against Autothrusers, Fell, and IGs.

It could even be a point or two cheaper.

the only thing I wished is that TLT had a minimum range so it wouldn't be a dumb PWT and could actually be played around

...hang on a minute!

(also one damage a ship is ass even if it is a pseudo-gunner turret for cheaper. It would come out, bleary eyed into the world of the 2-ship meta, and then get sat on by a fattie)

Why oh why FFG, why isn't the second TLT shot only happening if the first one missed?

Reduced number of damage per turn but still good odds of actually scoring one, even against Autothrusers, Fell, and IGs.

It could even be a point or two cheaper.

Because.. Ion Turrets would be way way better than?

The TLT isn't really OP'ed not for the points, but if it only fired when you missed it would be fairly pointless. 1 point of damage just isn't worth much unless it has something else to offer like the Ion effect.

Why oh why FFG, why isn't the second TLT shot only happening if the first one missed?

Reduced number of damage per turn but still good odds of actually scoring one, even against Autothrusers, Fell, and IGs.

It could even be a point or two cheaper.

Because.. Ion Turrets would be way way better than?

Range 3.

The TLT isn't really OP'ed not for the points, but if it only fired when you missed it would be fairly pointless. 1 point of damage just isn't worth much unless it has something else to offer like the Ion effect.

It would still be really good against arc dodgers as they can't hide at range 3 and would take more shots without tokens.

I love how we see such opposite viewpoints on this thing. For some, "autothrusters are your friend", "they'll never hit Soontir", etc.

For others, the sky is falling.

The truth is that it's a much-needed boost for HWK's, a possible boost as well for Y-Wings (which didn't necessarily need another boost), and a correctly priced legitimate new tool.

Personally, I think it's a welcome addition to the menu. It will have an impact on the meta, but it won't dominate it. There are plenty of counters, but it should lessen the number of 2-ship builds out there. TLT swarms LOVE to see 2-ship builds.

What I really like is that this game's rock/paper/scissors meta is being successfully turned into a rock/paper/scissors/Spock/lizard meta. That's fantastic as it weakens everything relative to something else. This places a lot of importance on being the superior pilot and knowing how to face even your hardest counter. That's good for the game.

The problem is that TLT will narrow the meta. No one will fly a Decimator any more as you will autodie in two turns vs. 4 TLT Ys.

Ys and HWKs really need a r3 turret but not this strong.

TLT should be aimed at arc dodgers, not 0 or 1 agi ships.

I don't think the sky is falling but I fear the TLT spam will narrow the meta, not widen it.

It would still be really good against arc dodgers as they can't hide at range 3

They'd have autothrusters which would mean you'd be very unlikely to land a hit.

I played 2 K-Wings this weekend at a small tournament, Miranda with TLT, a Warden with Conners and Farlander. The TLT performed quite well, but was not the monster some people fear it to be. I played against TLT's as well and again they were nice but not broken.

I found they're very effective against low agility targets so they should prove to be a threat against a Fat Han, Dash or RAC. But even against Defenders it was ok but not amazing.

I cant wait to pull the lose a secondary crit with this, that always makes me SO happy.

I cant wait to pull the lose a secondary crit with this, that always makes me SO happy.

Play with the new damage when it drops. That crit is gone. It's been merged with Weapons Malfunction to just give one less red die to all attacks.

4 TLT is a lot of points for low agi and PS ships. It will not be a thing.

I cant wait to pull the lose a secondary crit with this, that always makes me SO happy.

I think it will narrow it for a few local OP events as everyone finally gets to officially try the latest flavor, but then what? TLT vs TLT swarm is a dice-fest, not a lot of fun. Swarms can eat it alive, because TLT ships have low agility. Ordnance is potentially very useful vs it as well. Bro-bots is something I haven't yet faced with my own TLT's, but I suspect those low agility ships will have a hard time vs HLC's, high health, AND autothrusters.

And a Deci will absolutely not die in 2 turns, unless the pilot doesn't know what he's doing. Not every TLT shot rolls hits, Ysanne provides an evade vs one low-hit roll in round 2, and the first TLT ship should die before he fires the second time, assuming you've got both your ships in range and focusing fire. The Deci will last a minimum of 3 turns. For that matter, why would the Deci even get shot at by all 4 at the same time? He should be managing his range better than that. If the Deci just flies straight at the TLT swarm and takes fire from all, that's on the pilot, not the ship.

The TLT isn't really OP'ed not for the points, but if it only fired when you missed it would be fairly pointless. 1 point of damage just isn't worth much unless it has something else to offer like the Ion effect.

It would still be really good against arc dodgers as they can't hide at range 3 and would take more shots without tokens.

What you're describing is a 2-3 point turret. Against low-Agility targets, it's very weak: 1 damage, with no control. Against targets with high Agility and low hit points, it's stronger because 1 damage is a bigger fraction of the whole--but it creates the same weird incentive Gunner sometimes does. If Fel is likely going to take 1 damage anyway, and can't take any more than that, why spend any tokens to dodge the first attack?

The problem is that TLT will narrow the meta. No one will fly a Decimator any more as you will autodie in two turns vs. 4 TLT Ys.

If 4x Y-wings + TLT is a relatively high-frequency list in the metagame, people might start to move away from Decimators. Decimator + Gunner + Vader is almost certainly on its way out. On the other hand, someone like Oicunn is in pretty good shape to ram one Y-wing, end up in Range 1 of another one, and along with the other 50 points in the list, pound six kinds of hell into the remaining pair before they can fire.

Ys and HWKs really need a r3 turret but not this strong.

I don't see why not, as long as the cost is reasonable.

TLT should be aimed at arc dodgers, not 0 or 1 agi ships.

Ships with 0 and 1 Agility are just as much of a staple of the Wave 5-6 metagame as arc-dodgers are, if not more.

I don't think the sky is falling but I fear the TLT spam will narrow the meta, not widen it.

I have a whole post up that details some ways you can deal with them.

I cant wait to pull the lose a secondary crit with this, that always makes me SO happy.

That's going the way of the Double tactician Lambda, sadly. On the other hand, 2 dice TLTs are kind of pathetic.

But you have a 50% chance of having an action make the crit go away.

For that matter, why would the Deci even get shot at by all 4 at the same time? He should be managing his range better than that. If the Deci just flies straight at the TLT swarm and takes fire from all, that's on the pilot, not the ship.

I think there are a lot of people who have been... I won't say spoiled by the current metagame, but have lost sight of the larger game outside of it. If every list you face is two ships wide, you can maybe afford to joust with your expensive turret: it's only going to take one or two attacks, after all.

The fact that you can't expect to cruise into Range 3 with Chiraneau and hope to come out with a whole hide anymore--that's going to come as a slap to the face of a lot of players. I hope they stick with the game, though, because there's a larger and more complex experience waiting for them if they do.

TLT spam is driving (somewhat) back towards swarms

among the causalities (sometimes) are low agility ships, including B-wings (although they are more efficient than TLT Ys ) and fat turrets (though, with high PS + boost and dumbass turrets that work at range 1 with a bonus I doubt it's auto-loss),

among the winners are fast ships (which includes everything with thrusters, and the trusty ole tie fighter)

hypothetical X-wings with boost, thruster inq ties, and stronger ordnance all also benefit from the inclusion of TLT by giving them easy targets

also Vorpal is a beautiful bastard for putting things in perfect terms

If anything TLT's can make the Meta wider. TLT's can prove to be natural predators for two ship lists and if those become less prevalent, that makes more room for other lists.

4 TLT is a lot of points for low agi and PS ships. It will not be a thing.

Those low agi ships also generally have a combined 32 HP, paired with one evade die (two at range 3). They are a thing when flown well, but they can also still be outflown. Autothrusters and swarms will keep them in check.

4 TLT is a lot of points for low agi and PS ships. It will not be a thing.

Those low agi ships also generally have a combined 32 HP, paired with one evade die (two at range 3). They are a thing when flown well, but they can also still be outflown. Autothrusters and swarms will keep them in check.

They could also create a wedge for things like ordnance to show (back?) up.

a few forumites seems to be rekindling a love for the jonus bombers with the release of EM

I'm not a fan of ordnance in its current state outside a very select few pilots, but jonused CMs will rip right throw low agility

a few forumites seems to be rekindling a love for the jonus bombers with the release of EM

I'm not a fan of ordnance in its current state outside a very select few pilots, but jonused CMs will rip right throw low agility

I'm just waiting for the Speical Forces TIE to drop and give Imperials a ship that can take a Turret upgrade. I'm just hoping that they aren't more than 20 points each so that Jonus can run with 3 of them toting TLTs.

One other thing I found this weekend at the tournament (which I won 3-0, making me 6-0 for the week :)Flew Vader w/X1 ATC, RAC and a tie on Wednesday) is Conner Nets used properly are brutal.

Used one to mess up a shuttle, it was stressed, dropped a net on it, drove it into a debris field giving it a 2nd stress. Really screwed with the other guys plans.

TLT isn't as bad as everyone is making it out to be. The only list really skewed in power by it's introduction are lists with multiple Y-Wings in it. Even then, we haven't seen Wave 7 on tables long enough to make any real claims as to how the meta has/will change or what is unbalanced.