5 y-wings is a herd, not a swarm. Kind of like 4 albino space cows for the imps.

It's all subjective really. You can fly 8 ties in 2 lumps of 4 (basically 2 largish base ships with 4 attacks each) and it's not much of a 'swarm' until it breaks formation. Swarms for me are more about how you fly, not what. But I guess it's important for what you fly too, because MOV.

If you wanna call 3 or 4 TIEs/Zs a miniswarm then go ahead. I'm pretty sure most people will try to fly that in some kind of formation instead of coming at ya from all over.

The "Rebel Swarm" as of Wave 3 was BXXYY

A mini-swarm is quite alright: 4-5 ships.

A swarm has always been a minimum of 5 ships for the Rebellion, as they didn't have access to better than that until Wave 3.5 (Rebel Aces gave them their first 15 point ship).

To embrace my own asininity, Z's were out before Rebel Aces.

I consider BBBBZ a swarm (mini-swarm, whatever) because you forgo upgrades for more ships and blocking potential.

*Facepalm*

Right. 3.5 was Imperial aces, and Epic.

I can't believe I read all these comments.

Who cares what it's called? of course, unless it's in the rules.

IMO: Any group of three or more that actually attack one target each round is "swarming". If the 'swarm' isn't attacking the same target together... I don't consider it a swarm.

That said, I dont fly swarms... I blow em up.

this topic.

To me, the difference between a swarm and a mini-swarm is determined by the number of points it takes up in your list, not necessarily the number of ships. So an ace is backed up by a mini-swarm, but if most of or all of your points are taken up by low-PS relatively cheap ships with few or no upgrades it's a swarm. 5 Academies flying with Whisper is a mini-swarm, but 5 naked Kirrraaxzzzsss or BBBBZ is a swarm.

Your mileage etc etc. Of all the stupid things we've argued about on this board the last couple of weeks, this is among the stupidest.

this topic.

this topic.

who are those guys? They look like they are wearing pajamas and they work at a holiday inn.

they call it. a .. mini swarm.. isn't that cute.. hahah

Let's try that on other words:

Mini-tornado

Mini-grenade

Mini-shredder

Mini-destroyer

Just doesn't really sound as scary without the "mini-" does it? Let's be honest, a swarm starts at 7 ships.

Minigun.

My only comment on this thread is that mini-swarms--both as a concept and as a term--date to Wave 2, and were firmly estaoshed by Wave 3.

Wha... really, the whole point of calling something a 'Mini' anything is just to say, 'it's not as big as the regular version'. So having a mini swarm is fine, a swarm is 6-8 ships, and a mini-swarm is usually 4-5.

However, I will also agree it depends on what is in the swarm as well. 4 Zs? Mini-swarm. 4 Bs? NOT a mini-swarm. Partly because of how much they cost, but also because B-wings don't feel like they swarm. Sure they can surround and block just like a Z, but they don't have that 'buzzing around your ear like a gnat' kind of feel to them.

*I do think the same number of ships in swarms/mini-swarms can apply to squads greater than 100 points, depending on how they are flown. If you spread 4 Zs out as wingmen for fatter ships, then no, not a mini-swarm, but if they're flown together, in formation or just loosely at the same target, then yeah, mini-swarm.

**Also, I just 'liked' Riker's facepalm, and then went ahead and replied to this slightly ridiculous topic anyway.

You mush respect the purity of the hive, to be a swarm it must be a mono ship build you can't just take five ships of any old type and call it a swarm.

Ya I agree, although like has been said bbbbz is a "mini swarm" a true swarm In my opinion is 6-8. BBBBZ is a mini swarm and usually it's a referred to that way here. Some people may just assume people understand its a "swarm" type list not that it is a "true swarm" list. I think maybe that's what your referring to? When people just say "swarm" in reference to 5+ ship lists. Secondly the term "swarm" in this game represents swarming your enemies with lots of ships. 2-3 ships are common builds so when you use 5 that's a little less than double-actually double your opponents number of ships thereby "swarming" them. Those are my interpretations at least.

Sorry to be nitpicky, but ever since Super Whisper and 4 TIE Fighters became a thing, groups of 4-5 ships started to be called, "mini swarms". At a certain point BBBBZ came along with the 2 ship meta and now BBBBZ is considered a swarm because it doesn't have a fat turret and it has more than 2 ships in it. 5x Kirfghnbvxz is called a swarm too.

6 is the threshold for a swarm. 6 A-Wings, 6 Bombers, 6 HWKs (lol), 7 M-3A's, 4 Z-95's & 2 Starvipers, etc. are swarms. Your 4 B-Wing list with a z-95 tacked onto it isn't.

Like the posts above, this is the stupidest thing I've seen on here. What a useless argument. Who died and appointed you the official in charge of X-Wing terminology? Call it what you want, others will do the same, regardless of what you say.

Oh, and according to Websters, a swarm is "a great number of things or persons, especially in motion". Since when is 6 a great number? Just another argument that it is all relative and immaterial. Just have fun flying and forget about semantics.

Call it what you want, don't argue over what to call it.

Always considered a list to be a swarm if it was comprised of all the same ships whatever the ship was. Mini swarm was 4 of the cheapest cost ships to add volume fire and blocking to a tooled-up single ship. Less that 4 ships, even if all the same, like 3 Defenders, is not a swarm IMO.

I think the mini swarm, in the given example, was the 4 ties. The list was always 'Phantom WITH the Mini Swarm.'

Swarm starts at 5 and goes to 8, mini swarm is 3-4.

Jacob

They are 100 point(ish) lists. I guess it depends on how those points are distributed among the little pieces of plastic on the table. If half your list is four ships while the other half is a single point sink it depends I how you fly that 'miniswarm', because you can fly those 12 point guys as one blob and it's basically a 2 ship list. Eh. Semantics.

5 squints is still a swarm. 4 ptl squints is still a swarm. Bbbbz is definately a swarm. 3 defenders or squints is an elite task force, it may focus fire but I just can't call it a swarm in any sense.

Sorry to be nitpicky, but ever since Super Whisper and 4 TIE Fighters became a thing, groups of 4-5 ships started to be called, "mini swarms". At a certain point BBBBZ came along with the 2 ship meta and now BBBBZ is considered a swarm because it doesn't have a fat turret and it has more than 2 ships in it. 5x Kirfghnbvxz is called a swarm too.

6 is the threshold for a swarm. 6 A-Wings, 6 Bombers, 6 HWKs (lol), 7 M-3A's, 4 Z-95's & 2 Starvipers, etc. are swarms. Your 4 B-Wing list with a z-95 tacked onto it isn't.

Like the posts above, this is the stupidest thing I've seen on here. What a useless argument. Who died and appointed you the official in charge of X-Wing terminology? Call it what you want, others will do the same, regardless of what you say.

Oh, and according to Websters, a swarm is "a great number of things or persons, especially in motion". Since when is 6 a great number? Just another argument that it is all relative and immaterial. Just have fun flying and forget about semantics.

Call it what you want, don't argue over what to call it.

You know what's stupid? Calling anything that has more than 2 ships in it a swarm.

They can call a 4 ship list a swarm if they want to. They'd be wrong.

6 is the max number of Bombers and A-Wings you can fit at once and that flies much like a 7-8 ship swarm.

"I'm going to argue with you to get you to stop arguing."

Since rebels.

Language evolves. If more people are calling five-ship lists swarms, new players just coming in will call them swarms, and then maybe an 8-ship list will get a new name (uberswarm? horde? who knows?)

more to the point, I feel like "mini-swarm" is more commonly applied to a swarm-like mob of cheap ships fliying alongside a higher-point ship. Xizor and 5 Zs, Whisper and 4 TIEs, etc. If I hear "mini-swarm," I assume they have a higher-point wingman/leader. If the entire list is cheap ships, it seems more common to call it a swarm.

My arbitrarily made up opinion is 6+ of any combination of ships, excluding huge ships.

I think perhaps we should create Swarm categories and definitions. Yeah?

Something like...

Swarms

Mini Swarm: 5 ships (excluding large ships)

Swarm: 6-7 ships (excluding large ships)

Large Swarm: 8+ ships (excluding large ships)

Pure Swarms

Pure Mini Swarm: 5 ships of same type (excluding large ships)

Pure Swarm: 6-7 ships of same type (excluding large ships)

Pure Large Swarm: 8+ ships of same type (excluding large ships)

Modified Swarms

Modified Mini Swarm: 5 ships

Modified Swarm: 6-7 ships

Modified Large Swarm: 8+ ships

Debate solved!

The details of this relatively unimportant topic can easily be resolved with a crap load of confusing, complicated labels.

Swarm (except no substitutes)= TIE x 8, everything else is a waste ( Howlrunner is overrated)

Z Swarm = Z-95 x 8

A swarm = a-wing x 6 (not exactly efficient)

Fat swarm =TIE Bomber x 6

Crap Swarm = HWK x 6 (the Flock)

Scyk swarm = M3-A x 7

There you go. Hopefully noobs aren't confused. I know I am.

Since two ship lists became a thing.

You know what's stupid? Calling anything that has more than 2 ships in it a swarm.

So only 1 and 2 ship lists are swarms?