My prior discussion on the Age of rebellion game I asked about playing a soldier among a bunch of force user types.

I've been recently informed that, due to "I can't explain why or else I'll ruin the story", I need to have a force rating in order to play.

I was thinking about this and decided that, what the hell, I'll make him as normal, I'll just be 30 xp short because I would take force sensitive emergent. I wouldn't even do much development in it, other than potentially taking like, one force power later on in the game.

What I was wanting to know about was that if I ended up making a lightsaber, how can I make it my blaster rifle's bayonet? Does it count as an upgrade attachment? Would it be done as a linked weapon (Still not sure how linked works) and I only use it for that if I am in engaged range?

I would also love some help on what kind of rules there are for making your own other types of weapons. Is it just based on Mechanics?

The Shoto Bayonet! I like it! I'll let others help with weapon modifications, cause there are some that do this well or are actually looking at the book, but I think this is well thought out enough to qualify... though it may turn out that the weapon is the attachment rather than the lightsaber. I will say though, the thought of entering melee with a bolted on piece of kit that costs 10,000 credits does make me cringe a bit.

Ultimately it's a great idea, Shoto Bayonet, I just have no idea if there is an existing bayonet Attatchment that could be modified to suit your needs.

On your new character concept I would say that the Sense and Enhance Powers would suit a lot.

I am not sure what the point would be, you would not be able to fight with it as well as if it were a standard lightsaber and if you tried to fight another saber user your rifle would be sunder bait. In addition it would be very obvious to any Imperials as a Lightsaber.

Not that I know much but make it a dagger/knife that could be attached to the rifle as a bayonet

that uses plasma or whatever a lightsaber is as the blade. That way no lightsaber combat/hey that's ajedi pretending to be a soldier.

Hope that helps.

I don't know if you've seen Rebels, but you could could try and make a blaster or hold out blaster that also functions as a lightsaber. Slightly more functional than a bayonet.

I would be worried that my rifle would be sundered and then you'd lose two weapons.

Bayonets make more sense when you have limited ammo, or slow reload times, and an enemy can close quickly. none of which occur often in this system.

I'd use Zeb's, from Star Wars Rebels, bo-rifle as a base. Replace the electroshock with a single or double bladed shoto.
Basically your can use it as a bayonet but you could also use it as a Lightsabre staff.

Maybe look the total weapon as sort of the opposite of what you're thinking. Bayonets would attach to rifles/muskets to make a pseudo pike weapon. How about a pike lightsaber with a one- or two-shot blaster rifle built into it?

Bayonets make more sense when you have limited ammo, or slow reload times, and an enemy can close quickly. none of which occur often in this system.

They work extremely well in FFG's Star Wars as well. It allows someone with a two handed rifle to make use of two-weapon fighting for more than just Brawl (or improvised melee), it allows someone engaged to avoid giving their opponent boost dice on their melee attacks, it allows a character who is more skilled at melee than applicable ranged skill enter engaged combat without being at a huge disadvantage without spending maneuvers to pull out a new weapon, it allows a character to still have a viable combat choice if they do happen to run out of ammo without spending manuevers etc. Especially with a shoto-saber on the end, as you effectively have an amazing anti-soak sunder machine.

My Hired Gun for example specialized in melee combat but did fairly well with a blaster. So, after working with my GM I had him strap a Vibro-knife with a serrated edge to the end of his Heavy Blaster Rifle. The effectiveness and satisfaction gained from stabbing a mook who got too close and then shooting his friend as he dropped lifeless to the ground was well worth the HP.

Our ruling was...

Bayonet Ring = 100 credits; 1 HP; Rarity 1; No Modifications

Grants a Melee weapon the ability to be attached to the end of a Ranged (Light) or Ranged (Heavy) weapon. The specific weapon is chosen at the time of attachment and cannot be changed without a mechanics check. Attacks with this weapon suffer 1 [setback Die] when not attached to a ranged weapon.

May only be attached to melee weapons of encumbrance 1 or less.

I have to ask why not just go into the seeker carreer and make your self even more bad ass with a gun? Why do you need to use a lightsaber just because you are force sensitive?

I have to ask why not just go into the seeker carreer and make your self even more bad ass with a gun? Why do you need to use a lightsaber just because you are force sensitive?

I blame George for this. In the original films we had no real expectation of a character like Yoda of using a lightsabre. Yoda embodied the Force as a mystical power and he trained Luke in how to understand and tap into that power. He didn't need a such a weapon because the Force itself what enough for him to fight the Dark Side. We never see him ask Luke to do anything with his lightsabre. With the prequels all of a sudden lightsabres were everywhere, and when Yoda pulled his out I found myself groaning along with the rest of the theater. Now you couldn't be a Jedi without one as if the whole Jedi Order had to be lightsabre wielding badasses instead of just the Knights.

Sad really...

I have to ask why not just go into the seeker carreer and make your self even more bad ass with a gun? Why do you need to use a lightsaber just because you are force sensitive?

I blame George for this. In the original films we had no real expectation of a character like Yoda of using a lightsabre. Yoda embodied the Force as a mystical power and he trained Luke in how to understand and tap into that power. He didn't need a such a weapon because the Force itself what enough for him to fight the Dark Side. We never see him ask Luke to do anything with his lightsabre. With the prequels all of a sudden lightsabres were everywhere, and when Yoda pulled his out I found myself groaning along with the rest of the theater. Now you couldn't be a Jedi without one as if the whole Jedi Order had to be lightsabre wielding badasses instead of just the Knights.

Sad really...

George did not cause this. and I did not groan when Yoda pulled his out. You still can be a bad as with out one. Cad Bane does it. Jango does it. Han does it. Maybe put your silly baggage down. If Han were to find himself force sensitive I seriously doubt he would be picking up a lightsaber, Do what is right for the character. Yoda knowing how to use a lightsaber is right for the character. Slapping a lightsaber onto a rifle as a bayonet does not seem right for the character.

Take the hunter specialization and the force sensitive emergent along with the sense force power and you can make an absolutely bad ass sniper or gun bunny. not need for the lightsaber. And also making the character unique.

I distinctly remember the bulk of the theater cheering when Yoda whipped out his saber. So experiences may vary.

I have to ask why not just go into the seeker carreer and make your self even more bad ass with a gun? Why do you need to use a lightsaber just because you are force sensitive?

I blame George for this. In the original films we had no real expectation of a character like Yoda of using a lightsabre. Yoda embodied the Force as a mystical power and he trained Luke in how to understand and tap into that power. He didn't need a such a weapon because the Force itself what enough for him to fight the Dark Side. We never see him ask Luke to do anything with his lightsabre. With the prequels all of a sudden lightsabres were everywhere, and when Yoda pulled his out I found myself groaning along with the rest of the theater. Now you couldn't be a Jedi without one as if the whole Jedi Order had to be lightsabre wielding badasses instead of just the Knights.

Sad really...

The prequels didn't make Lightsabers the go-to weapon for a Jedi, the original films and West End Games did that.

In fact one of George's original thoughts had them far more common, my big issue with the OP is just that I see no point to using one as a Bayonet. The Ref in me smells a player trying to pull one over on the ref.

I have to ask why not just go into the seeker carreer and make your self even more bad ass with a gun? Why do you need to use a lightsaber just because you are force sensitive?

I blame George for this. In the original films we had no real expectation of a character like Yoda of using a lightsabre. Yoda embodied the Force as a mystical power and he trained Luke in how to understand and tap into that power. He didn't need a such a weapon because the Force itself what enough for him to fight the Dark Side. We never see him ask Luke to do anything with his lightsabre. With the prequels all of a sudden lightsabres were everywhere, and when Yoda pulled his out I found myself groaning along with the rest of the theater. Now you couldn't be a Jedi without one as if the whole Jedi Order had to be lightsabre wielding badasses instead of just the Knights.

Sad really...

The prequels didn't make Lightsabers the go-to weapon for a Jedi, the original films and West End Games did that.

In fact one of George's original thoughts had them far more common, my big issue with the OP is just that I see no point to using one as a Bayonet. The Ref in me smells a player trying to pull one over on the ref.

My point was that, at least from my perspective, Jedi Knights were the lighsabre wielders but the Jedi order was much larger than the Knights and not all of them used one. This was one of the reasons I was disappointed with Yoda whipping one out it in a way actually demoted his character from a spiritual master and leader to just another Jedi Knight. Not that JKs are unimpressive but that it just seemed so out of character.

Plus the truth is that a lightsabre just isn't the best choice of weapon for every species, some of them just have physical attributes that don't mix well with a cut through anything glowstick.

F&D actually handles this well as basically 2/3'rds of the FU Specializations don't come with the lightsabre Skill.

Oh man, now that's a cool idea. I'm gonna gather up my books and get back to you. Initial thoughts:

1: It's kinda lame the GM's making you be a F-S. Plot? Snot. There's plenty of ways to work around it, and having someone who isn't part of the Mystic Mob thrown into the mix makes for more interesting contrast. Oh well.

2: Now onto the weapon. I think a Shoto is the right way to go here. Except it really shouldn't use the Lightsaber skill when attached as a bayonet. Few, if any, of the aspects of a traditional lightsaber that make it such a different weapon come into play. The mass of the rifle and its cumbersome aspects (not the trait, just a description) means you can't pull off the kind of whirling flippy-tricks that lightsaber duellists can. Furthermore, most of your weapon is not invulnerable like a lightsaber is. Bayonet fighting isn't just the pointy end, it's the whole thing, and frankly resembles what Brawl would be used for almost as much as Melee. The same thing could be said for knives, of course. So anyway, Melee is the skill to use. I'll elaborate more on this later if you want.

I have to ask why not just go into the seeker carreer and make your self even more bad ass with a gun? Why do you need to use a lightsaber just because you are force sensitive?

I blame George for this. In the original films we had no real expectation of a character like Yoda of using a lightsabre. Yoda embodied the Force as a mystical power and he trained Luke in how to understand and tap into that power. He didn't need a such a weapon because the Force itself what enough for him to fight the Dark Side. We never see him ask Luke to do anything with his lightsabre. With the prequels all of a sudden lightsabres were everywhere, and when Yoda pulled his out I found myself groaning along with the rest of the theater. Now you couldn't be a Jedi without one as if the whole Jedi Order had to be lightsabre wielding badasses instead of just the Knights.

Sad really...

The prequels didn't make Lightsabers the go-to weapon for a Jedi, the original films and West End Games did that.

In fact one of George's original thoughts had them far more common, my big issue with the OP is just that I see no point to using one as a Bayonet. The Ref in me smells a player trying to pull one over on the ref.

My point was that, at least from my perspective, Jedi Knights were the lighsabre wielders but the Jedi order was much larger than the Knights and not all of them used one. This was one of the reasons I was disappointed with Yoda whipping one out it in a way actually demoted his character from a spiritual master and leader to just another Jedi Knight. Not that JKs are unimpressive but that it just seemed so out of character.

Plus the truth is that a lightsabre just isn't the best choice of weapon for every species, some of them just have physical attributes that don't mix well with a cut through anything glowstick.

F&D actually handles this well as basically 2/3'rds of the FU Specializations don't come with the lightsabre Skill.

I think you are over thinking it. I think a large number of Jedi resort to a lightsaber as one of the last things they would do. But it makes sense to me for most jedi to have one.

But being a force user does not require one to be a jedi. And i think that is the bigger issue.

But being a force user does not require one to be a jedi. And i think that is the bigger issue.

Yup. Rungok hasn't said much about what kind of campaign this is (and it sounds like they don't know too much if the GM is being so secretive). Being a force-sensitive or a force-user in no way obligates one to be a Jedi and/or use a lightsaber; that does seem to be the common expectation though (and my guess is the overwhelming majority of actual Jedi have a lightsaber, regardless of their skill with it).

Rungok, you might want to run your soldier-with-the-Force idea past the GM just in case their planned story is something meant more for movie-style Jedi (I've got a bad feeling about this "super-secret-must-be-a-Force-User-story" thing). The character and weapon (and the style of fighting that implies) wouldn't fit in very well with a more traditional Jedi plot, and could easily rub some people the wrong way.

As to how to represent a lightsaber-bayonet in the rules, there aren't any melee-weapon attachments for ranged weapons in any of the books I have (and I have all of the combat-oriented ones). The under-barrel ranged weapons from the AoR Core and Hired Guns point to them being pretty much a straight translation of their standalone versions. I'd recommend something pretty close to OfficerVan's "Bayonet Ring", although I'd suggest it being a "Bayonet Lug" and being an attachment for the ranged weapon (Ranged-Heavy only) instead.

For the weapon's profile, just take a shoto add that it's two-handed, apply any Cumbersome quality the weapon it's mounted on has, and ignore any "hilt" attachments (Duellist, Balanced, Personalized-Superior, etc) to the lightsaber while it's mounted. Perhaps adding Defensive 1 as a modification to the attachment to represent reinforcing the rifle itself so that it's sturdy enough to be used to block attacks. If the Sunder quality is triggered against it, it should affect both weapons. As I said before, when wielded as an attachment for a rifle the skill to use it should be Melee, not Lightsaber, and it shouldn't benefit from Lightsaber-specific talents; you simply can't do a lot of things that make lightsaber fighting special with a rifle sticking off the hilt.

My point was that, at least from my perspective, Jedi Knights were the lighsabre wielders but the Jedi order was much larger than the Knights and not all of them used one. This was one of the reasons I was disappointed with Yoda whipping one out it in a way actually demoted his character from a spiritual master and leader to just another Jedi Knight. Not that JKs are unimpressive but that it just seemed so out of character.

Plus the truth is that a lightsabre just isn't the best choice of weapon for every species, some of them just have physical attributes that don't mix well with a cut through anything glowstick.

F&D actually handles this well as basically 2/3'rds of the FU Specializations don't come with the lightsabre Skill.

Lucas did a lot of things but you really can't blame him for the lightsabre love and everyone using them. That was established well before Lucas returned to do the PT. By the point that we get to Yoda whipping one out we had consumed a lot of EU that made lightsabre combat a thing. But every Jedi using a lightsabre was a pretty well established thing long before Yoda does it. If anything by the time Lucas has Yoda doing it he is only just going along with what the fans expected from a Jedi Master at that point.

It's also worth noting that Yoda did not go for his lightsabre first like Anakin and Obi Wan. He instead attempted to use the Force first and foremost. But when it was clear that ones understanding in the Force would not resolve the conflict he then went for his lightsabre. Being a spiritual master and leader doesn't mean that you won't fight, just that fighting is not your first go to option.

Wow I'm glad to see there was some great discussions that came of this!

Talked to the (Ref? DM? ST? what's the term here?), and no, I'm not trying to 'pull one over' on him. I had initially intended on playing the soldier character before he had dropped the 'force sensitivity' requirement on me, and he was well aware of it. (I admit the intro cinematic for the Republic side in ToR that focused on the soldier was part of my desire to find out if it would be possible. I mean, holy crap. Dude pulled a knife while being lit up with force lightning AND ALMOST STABBED THE GUY)

I asked about the lightsaber as an attachment because I get the feeling the Ref was going to put us all through a point where we *have* to make a lightsaber, like it's a requirement or something to progress. While I'm opposed to being forced into that kind of situation, I was trying to see if I could make something out of it that would be plausible for my character. And yeah, I'm pretty sure if ordered to, the soldier would at least try to make something useful out of it even if he had no intention of using any kind of lightsaber combat.

I agree with how it should work, and I think Melee makes more sense with it too. Thanks.

Wow I'm glad to see there was some great discussions that came of this!

Talked to the (Ref? DM? ST? what's the term here?), and no, I'm not trying to 'pull one over' on him. I had initially intended on playing the soldier character before he had dropped the 'force sensitivity' requirement on me, and he was well aware of it. (I admit the intro cinematic for the Republic side in ToR that focused on the soldier was part of my desire to find out if it would be possible. I mean, holy crap. Dude pulled a knife while being lit up with force lightning AND ALMOST STABBED THE GUY)

I asked about the lightsaber as an attachment because I get the feeling the Ref was going to put us all through a point where we *have* to make a lightsaber, like it's a requirement or something to progress. While I'm opposed to being forced into that kind of situation, I was trying to see if I could make something out of it that would be plausible for my character. And yeah, I'm pretty sure if ordered to, the soldier would at least try to make something useful out of it even if he had no intention of using any kind of lightsaber combat.

I agree with how it should work, and I think Melee makes more sense with it too. Thanks.

You're welcome, glad to help! Was more worried that he's trying to "pull one over" on you, actually. I'm not a big fan of secrecy about the general premise of a campaign; way too many ways for that to go wrong.

Game Master (or GM) is the usual term, although I've been called Galaxy Master and even God Man once or twice!

As far as Force Powers go, Sense is always a good investment, and Enhance might be helpful. Neither of them are very flashy, and you can include them without the character being aware they're F-S at first, just thinking they're "lucky".

Wow I'm glad to see there was some great discussions that came of this!

Talked to the (Ref? DM? ST? what's the term here?), and no, I'm not trying to 'pull one over' on him. I had initially intended on playing the soldier character before he had dropped the 'force sensitivity' requirement on me, and he was well aware of it. (I admit the intro cinematic for the Republic side in ToR that focused on the soldier was part of my desire to find out if it would be possible. I mean, holy crap. Dude pulled a knife while being lit up with force lightning AND ALMOST STABBED THE GUY)

I asked about the lightsaber as an attachment because I get the feeling the Ref was going to put us all through a point where we *have* to make a lightsaber, like it's a requirement or something to progress. While I'm opposed to being forced into that kind of situation, I was trying to see if I could make something out of it that would be plausible for my character. And yeah, I'm pretty sure if ordered to, the soldier would at least try to make something useful out of it even if he had no intention of using any kind of lightsaber combat.

I agree with how it should work, and I think Melee makes more sense with it too. Thanks.

It wouldn't be Melee but still Lightsabre. The Lightsaber skill encompass all types of Lightsabers and any kind of variant thereof. It's also to your advantage to use Lightsaber skill. In addition to opening up the possibility of not relying on Brawn as your attribute through the 6 fighting forms but it also means that you're only raising one skill as opposed to 2 to be competent with a single weapon. After all if your rifle is sundered and you pick up the lightsaber bayonet to use if it's tied to Melee you are no longer able to use that lightsaber as well as you were before. So in order to remain competent you'd need to raise Melee, Heavy Blasters and Lightsaber. It works out better just to have to raise 2 as opposed to 3 skills.

Also if your basing your combat style on the Commando from KotoR he's likely to keep a saber dagger in his armor for getting up close but not and then when they think they've disarmed you you reach into your coat and just stab him with a small saber shoto. Whhy Hide it on the end of the gun when you can charge someone and let the drop their guard down only to be shanked in the end by a shoto sized blade that comes from no where.