What do you think? I had a dream where some new stats and new moves of old ships had been revealed, and I kind of got scared that next time I might be having a nightmare instead. So with the things that we know but can't really talk about, do you think we might be getting a power creep in our favorite game? Is this the beginning of the end?
Edited by mtreinAre we getting a power creep in x-wing?
of course there might be some power creep. Why else would you buy anything new if it was exactly the same as or worse than something you already own?
The T-65 X-Wing was over priced according to math wing.
The TIE Fighter is just where it needs to be.
The new ships cost more and do different things. I feel they are appropriately priced.
No I don't think there is power creep.
Remember that these new ships are supposed to be more advanced versions, in our game at least, they won't replace the old ones.
Now to await the T-65 X-Wing "fix".
of course there might be some power creep. Why else would you buy anything new if it was exactly the same as or worse than something you already own?
That's GW thinking there and I really hope ffg never operates like that.
In my opinion, power creep is only an issue if ships start getting undercosted in relation to older ships. The new [redacted] looks like it'll fly a lot like an A-Wing, and is costed appropriately. The new [other redacted], might be costed appropriately, if you consider what it is replacing as being overcosted currently.
No.
This has been another issue of Short Answers to Simple Questions! Tune in next time...
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(Spoiling my own gag, here.)
No, I don't think there's a reason for concern. The X-wing has a bit of ground to make up (1-2 points), and after taking that into account the leaked stats seem to justify the leaked cost for its descendant. The descendant of the TIE fighter is reasonably close to an A-wing, and Prototype Pilots aren't exactly infesting the metagame right now. So I believe, and have reason to believe, that all will be well.
Edited by Vorpal SwordWe've already had power creep. Super Phantom in wave 4 (which even post nerf is still obnoxious), wave 5 as a whole, dual IG's. Certain pilot abilities and certain card combos like gunner/corran + FCS, RAC and predator, "I didn't take an action this turn but here is a hit hit hit crit for the 3rd turn in a row."
The fact that the neo-xwing is going to be actually playable (and still probably get nuked by 2 ship power lists anyways) and that the imperial's get a semi-prototype pilot isn't power creep.
No.
of course there might be some power creep. Why else would you buy anything new if it was exactly the same as or worse than something you already own?
Ideally new releases give you more options rather than more direct power.
No.
This has been another issue of Short Answers to Simple Questions! Tune in next time...
***
(Spoiling my own gag, here.)
No, I don't think there's a reason for concern. The X-wing has a bit of ground to make up (1-2 points), and after taking that into account the leaked stats seem to justify the leaked cost for its descendant. The descendant of the TIE fighter is reasonably close to an A-wing, and Prototype Pilots aren't exactly infesting the metagame right now. So I believe, and have reason to believe, that all will be well.
You forgot this:
Only if you consider new capabilities and mechanics to be power creep. Every new ability in this game also seems to come with a commiserate cost. Otherwise, things still seem to be balanced pretty well.
Consider that the majority of areas in which people can say, "That's power creep" are usually upgrades that boost ships from the first three waves of the game. TLTs, Autothrusters, C3PO, X1 title with ATC, Extra Munitions, Tracer Missiles.
Yes.
But sadly, the power creeps went away after the bilgewater event. They were a cool addition to LoL.
We've already had power creep. Super Phantom in wave 4 (which even post nerf is still obnoxious), wave 5 as a whole, dual IG's. Certain pilot abilities and certain card combos like gunner/corran + FCS, RAC and predator, "I didn't take an action this turn but here is a hit hit hit crit for the 3rd turn in a row."
The fact that the neo-xwing is going to be actually playable (and still probably get nuked by 2 ship power lists anyways) and that the imperial's get a semi-prototype pilot isn't power creep.
AT and six hit points go a long way against large PWT ships.
Yes there's power creep and the introduction of it is literally inevitable.
As far as X-Wing, though: no.
"Power creep" is another way of saying "under costed for its effects, relative to other ships in the game".
Think about it this way: if the new X-Wing had the same base cost at PS 2 as Han Solo does, you should be able to immediately see that it would represent a power slide um Tallon Roll , um, decrease in relative power.
The New X-Wing actually looks to have a poorer baseline efficiency as a pure jouster than the T-65.* But it also has a couple interesting tricks to keep it from being a pure jouster.
Most of the upward swing of power in this game has been to bring underperforming ships up to parity with the TIE Fighter from Wave 1.
*yes: the t-70 has a statline that would cost the T-65 8 points to buy. But those upgrades are only worth about 2 points when out on a T-65.
The TIE Phantom was going that way, but FFG fixed it. As a whole the game is getting better. Old ships get new goodies to keep them in the battle.
FFG is one of the best companies in the entire industry, and X-WING is awesomeness.
Errors get fixed asap. No CREEP... just a few oopsies that go away.
The New X-Wing actually looks to have a poorer baseline efficiency as a pure jouster than the T-65.*
*yes: the t-70 has a statline that would cost the T-65 8 points to buy. But those upgrades are only worth about 2 points when out on a T-65.
Can you explain - I didn't understand that last line at all.
of course there might be some power creep. Why else would you buy anything new if it was exactly the same as or worse than something you already own?
Because it cost less? Because it had different strengths and weaknesses and it fulfilled a different roll?
Can you explain - I didn't understand that last line at all.The New X-Wing actually looks to have a poorer baseline efficiency as a pure jouster than the T-65.*
*yes: the t-70 has a statline that would cost the T-65 8 points to buy. But those upgrades are only worth about 2 points when out on a T-65.
I also vote no on Power Creep. I know a few players that still only have Wave 1 (maybe some Wave 2) ships and still compete in tournaments.
As a player do I WANT all of the new stuff? HECK YEA I DO!!! I don't feel as if I HAVE to have it though. I enjoy that about X-wing.
Can you explain - I didn't understand that last line at all.The New X-Wing actually looks to have a poorer baseline efficiency as a pure jouster than the T-65.*
*yes: the t-70 has a statline that would cost the T-65 8 points to buy. But those upgrades are only worth about 2 points when out on a T-65.
The T-70 is rumored to have an extra hit point and the boost action. Adding those things to the original X-wing via modifications would cost a lot, but how much they would cost as upgrades isn't the same thing as what they're actually worth.
At three points more the [redacted] is out right better than the T-65, and not by a small margin but we know the devs are aware of the issue so will do something about it but as of Sep 4th the original namesake of the game goes from under performing to outrightight bad.
But the humble tie/ln is still good it remains cheap and effective and in no danger of losing its place in game.
We are not getting a powercreep. It was already there, all the time, having started in Wave 2...
Edited by John TenzerCan you explain - I didn't understand that last line at all.The New X-Wing actually looks to have a poorer baseline efficiency as a pure jouster than the T-65.*
*yes: the t-70 has a statline that would cost the T-65 8 points to buy. But those upgrades are only worth about 2 points when out on a T-65.
MJ did some number crunching about expected survivability given dice and HP. What he found (as I recall) is that the shield upgrade on a T-65 isn't worth the 4 points you pay for it.
That extra shield will simply melt off before it can give you enough extra time on the board to do some damage.
The Engine Upgrade is a similar case: taking it adds points to add an action that doesn't directly add to your offence or defense. The X-Wing dial isn't great for arc dodging, and Boost is mostly useful for that.
I could be misremembering the math.
No. I think it was more of a new game and so the first few ships were a little bit off points-wise issue. However, they were never so bad as to be completely unplayable except for the TIE Advanced.
The only thing that has me worried now is the Twin Laser Turret and that may be overblown. In FFG I trust. Their products are of fine quality, are reasonably priced, and none are unplayable.