my own experience so far has been that the game is pretty balanced... I'm a brand new player (only got the game this week) and have had 3 games as the Imperials. Lost the first one, won the following two (but I only won that last game down to blind luck and inexperience on the Rebel player's behalf... He accidentally rammed my SD with his Neb B but I digress). Time will tell but OP's post seems to contradict everything else I've read about this game.

Bolly, I've found the same to be true. The gladiator is ferocious, but it's also only got one job so it telegraphs what it's going to do.

I haven't seen anything so far that I consider to be unbeatable.

A 2 x Vic, 3 Glad list is close, maybe, but the gladiators arent really designed to operate with anything else.. they're torpedo boats

If we called people on their stridency, we'd be doing a lot of calling.

It's one thing to state opinions as facts, it's another to state them as facts for everyone. As you say most things people say are actually opinions and there's no need to constantly say IMO.

Most times people can infer opinion from the context. If I were to say "<food item> tastes bad" it's clear I'm speaking about my opinion of <food item>, and not claiming everyone in the world agrees with me.

That is however different then me saying "<food item> tastes bad, and there's no point in arguing with me, because everyone agrees" Because now I'm not speaking for myself I'm clearly speaking for everyone.

Is it the fact that he waltzes in here with no prior posts to his name that bothers you?

No I have an adverse reaction to most every blanket statement I see. Post count, or posting history doesn't factor in. If Sithborg or VopralSword two posters I respect greatly were to make the same sort of blanket statement that the OP did, I'd call them on it too.

(I feel like I should list more names there, because there is honestly a lot of people here who I respect greatly. You're (Mikael Hasselstein) one of them btw.)

He might just be new at this. Perhaps we should give him tips on how to troll more effectively.

No I have an adverse reaction to most every blanket statement I see. Post count, or posting history doesn't factor in. If Sithborg or VopralSword two posters I respect greatly were to make the same sort of blanket statement that the OP did, I'd call them on it too.

(I feel like I should list more names there, because there is honestly a lot of people here who I respect greatly. You're (Mikael Hasselstein) one of them btw.)

Thank you, that's very kind. And, yes, you and I have gone around the block a couple times when it comes to differences, but it's always been good. And, yeah, I wish Vorpalsword and MajorJuggler were into Armada.

I am sorry. I have Aspergers, the concept of diplomatic and understanding of other people's feelings has never made much sense to me. It's like handing out medals for participating. . . It feels wrong.

If I am blunt then everyone knows where I stand. No one can cause me of double standards, and no one can say I did not say it as it is. No guessing at what I meant either.

Sometimes we have to do things we don't like because it results in something constructive, or saves offending another person.

I won't belabour the point any more, we've both made our positions clear.

I'm with Rapscallion84 on this one. The first and foremost objective of playing this game, or engaging in forum discussion, should be the social aspect. If you're doing it to prove your greater worth than others by engaging in a plastic spaceships game, or bludgeoning someone else in type, you're really doing something very futile. Diplomacy (in this context) is about lubricating people's differences so that we can get along.

While I don't have Aspergers, I used to have issues that aren't the same as Lyraeus', but they do rhyme with his issues. When I was his age, I had some of the same faults, and I rankled a lot of people. Since then, I've come into my own more, I've matured (well... not in some respects - I do play with plastic spaceships after all), and I'm much more at ease with myself.

Lyraeus' approach makes rational sense in terms of clarity, but it doesn't make psycho-social sense. He has absolutely amazing natural analytical abilities, but I do have to smooth over ruffled feathers here and there. Also, our first encounter wasn't a pretty one.

Being nice to people isn't about giving out medals for participating. It's about not being a jerk and robbing them of the social enjoyment that they came to play for. While the games we play model a zero-sum situation in which one person's gain is another person's loss - playing games is (supposed to be) a positive-sum situation, in which we both gain from the interaction. Even in winning and losing, games are supposed to bring us together by the loser being gracious and the winner being magnanimous. Both show that they value each other more than they value the particular outcome of the particular match.

Holy crap Mikael, you've just become my favorite person ever.

Bolly, I've found the same to be true. The gladiator is ferocious, but it's also only got one job so it telegraphs what it's going to do.

I haven't seen anything so far that I consider to be unbeatable.

A 2 x Vic, 3 Glad list is close, maybe, but the gladiators arent really designed to operate with anything else.. they're torpedo boats

I consider the GSD to be area denial. It's like an obstacle that can one-round kill your smaller ships if you get within close range.

The problem is avoiding a wall of GSDs closing on you or your objectives. It's not easy to keep your ships out of close range from multiple GSDs zipping around the board at speed 3 in a wide formation. Even if you are able to keep away, you're not scoring points through kills and (depending on objective) you may be getting denied access to objectives.

Yup, mad. A guy apologizes, tries and makes amends and is the bad guy. Thus is life.

I never said I could crush him

Rebels don't have the options to "crush". Now beat is a plausible option. Sure it may only occur one in three times but it is a possibility.

Look! You want to go there fine ..... Ok You are going on about **** that happened on Facebook....I blocked and deleted you on Facebook because frankly I'm getting real sick of your ****.

On Facebook you put yourself into a conversation between me and Darth Lupine , and then proceed to be a ******* ******* basically calling me an incompetent player. You did nothing but criticize everything about the conversation... And you have the audacity to blame your rudeness on Azburgers????

My stepson has Azburgers and has better manners than you!

So don't ******* come on here carrying a ******* pitty party like your the **** victim, you were out of line on Facebook you got called out on it I blocked you to keep from having to subject myself from your rude banter.

And now here you are still in my **** with the same thing. I figured blocking you and deleting you on Facebook would be a hint that I want nothing to do with you, to leave me the **** alone. But you want to keep pressing the issue.

Look! Stop talking to me. Don't ******* pm me on here. You are creeping into the world of harassment, I'd advise you to stop.

Yikes! 8)

Well, this is awkward.....

That escalated spectacularly.

Why not just ignore each other, it seems like you'll both be better off that way.

Fly casual.

Its just a freakin game. Jeez...

It is sad that these posts are current affairs... can't wait till wave two comes out or something.... like that awesome prerelease tournament! Huh guys!?

Being nice to people isn't about giving out medals for participating. It's about not being a jerk and robbing them of the social enjoyment that they came to play for. While the games we play model a zero-sum situation in which one person's gain is another person's loss - playing games is (supposed to be) a positive-sum situation, in which we both gain from the interaction. Even in winning and losing, games are supposed to bring us together by the loser being gracious and the winner being magnanimous. Both show that they value each other more than they value the particular outcome of the particular match.

Winner winner chicken dinner.

Yeah. Pretty much the quote above. This game is being taken far too seriously.

Armada is losing some traction in my area. The delays and all the recent x-wing hype has caused a few players to sell their armada stuff. A recent store tournament had TWO players show up, one of which was from out-of-town. I do feel the rebels need a small boost, but they are much more finesse based than playing imperials. Back in June, I won a store tournament using Rebels. How did I do it? well, as it happened I never had to face any Demolisher builds.

Armada will never be as popular as x-wing, I get that. But why is Armada floundering? well:

1. delays in new waves mean limited build options and predictable meta.

2. armada physically requires more space and more time than x-wing. about double on both counts.

3. tournament play isnt as exciting. 2 hour rounds (soon to be 2.5 hr) mean generally only 3 swiss rounds are played. players that are given a by have to sit around for 2 hours. (or leave and come back)

4. cost. Armada seems more expensive to new players. x-wing players often shy away from armada, citing cost and their current investment in x-wing. If I had a dollar for every time I heard an x-wing player say "looks really cool, but I only have time/money for x-wing"....i'd own another assault frigate.

I still love Armada, but I have more fun and meet more people playing x-wing.

You didn't mention the correspondence with ships from Armada

CR90 - Corvette

VSD - Cruiser

ISD - Heavy Cruiser

AF - Cruiser (?)

Neb-B - Frigate

Gladiator - Destroyer/Light Cruiser (?)

CR90/Raider - Corvette (small fast and a strikes swiftly)

Neb-B - Frigate (agile and decently hitting)

GSD/MC30c - Destroyer (hunter of ships)

VSD - Cruiser

AF - Heavy Cruiser knot as powerful as a full cruiser but meant to take a pounding)

MC80 - Battle cruiser (fast and heavy hitting but weaker in taking damage when compared to a battleship)

ISD - Battleship (can take one hell. Of a pounding and can dish it right back)

My friend and I have discussed this at some length. The "iconic" Star Destroyers, (ISD, VSD, SSD, GSD) cannot easily be slotted into these categories. Other SW ships might suffer the same way.

Consider the ISD.

• A massive, powerful vessel, with huge cannons, capable of either engaging enemy ships, or carrying out "shore bompardment." It is clearly a battleship.
• Six squadrons of TIEs, including Space Superiority, Interceptor, Bomber, Scout. I think it works out to 72 ships. It is clearly a Carrier-class ship.
• It has a complement of Stormtroopers numbering in the thousands. It carries multiple heavy landing craft, assult walkers, and three prefabricated garrisons. It is clearly a heavy assault transport.
• It is fast enough to capture and board blockade-runner type vessels, or even small smuggler freighters. It is clearly a destroyer or light cruiser.

In short, an ISD is a one-size-fits-all class. This has it's vantages, both ad- and dis-, but what is undeniable is that with a ship like the ISD, there is no need to carefuly tailor a task force for a given assignment. You just throw ISDs at the problem until it is resolved.

Armada is losing some traction in my area. The delays and all the recent x-wing hype has caused a few players to sell their armada stuff. A recent store tournament had TWO players show up, one of which was from out-of-town. I do feel the rebels need a small boost, but they are much more finesse based than playing imperials. Back in June, I won a store tournament using Rebels. How did I do it? well, as it happened I never had to face any Demolisher builds.

Armada will never be as popular as x-wing, I get that. But why is Armada floundering? well:

1. delays in new waves mean limited build options and predictable meta.

2. armada physically requires more space and more time than x-wing. about double on both counts.

3. tournament play isnt as exciting. 2 hour rounds (soon to be 2.5 hr) mean generally only 3 swiss rounds are played. players that are given a by have to sit around for 2 hours. (or leave and come back)

4. cost. Armada seems more expensive to new players. x-wing players often shy away from armada, citing cost and their current investment in x-wing. If I had a dollar for every time I heard an x-wing player say "looks really cool, but I only have time/money for x-wing"....i'd own another assault frigate.

I still love Armada, but I have more fun and meet more people playing x-wing.

these are all completely legitimate concerns (except for price; Armada is barely any more expensive than X-wing and the burden of supporting 2 miniature games is nothing unique to Armada)

in the article about the pre-release event, FFG has addressed the unavoidable port delays have backlogged their products and that Wave 2 is apparently scheduled for the last quarter of this year

hopefully that'll get people back into the fold (well, if anything can do that it'll be the ISD )

(well, if anything can do that it'll be the ISD )

so many truth. much wow.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

Armada is losing some traction in my area. The delays and all the recent x-wing hype has caused a few players to sell their armada stuff. A recent store tournament had TWO players show up, one of which was from out-of-town. I do feel the rebels need a small boost, but they are much more finesse based than playing imperials. Back in June, I won a store tournament using Rebels. How did I do it? well, as it happened I never had to face any Demolisher builds.

Armada will never be as popular as x-wing, I get that. But why is Armada floundering? well:

1. delays in new waves mean limited build options and predictable meta.

2. armada physically requires more space and more time than x-wing. about double on both counts.

3. tournament play isnt as exciting. 2 hour rounds (soon to be 2.5 hr) mean generally only 3 swiss rounds are played. players that are given a by have to sit around for 2 hours. (or leave and come back)

4. cost. Armada seems more expensive to new players. x-wing players often shy away from armada, citing cost and their current investment in x-wing. If I had a dollar for every time I heard an x-wing player say "looks really cool, but I only have time/money for x-wing"....i'd own another assault frigate.

I still love Armada, but I have more fun and meet more people playing x-wing.

I just attended a tournament that drew three people from out of town and one person from the (small) locality. Does that mean that Armada is losing steam, or does it mean that this locality simply doesn't have the player base (yet)? Also, what kind of losing-steam game gets three people to travel an hour each to go play in a tournament in an out-of-the-way locale?

Obviously, Winnipeg is not a small town like the one that hosted the tournament I mentioned, but there are a lot of factors that go into making a game thrive in a particular community as opposed to another. Having your community organized is one of those factors. Do you have an Armada-players Facebook Group? Are your FLGSs supportive of the game. Do the leaders of your FB group liaise with the FLGS owners/coordinators? Does your community evangelize the tournaments, and are those tournaments at convenient times and locations?

Like what ficklegreendice said about the price, the things you mention are not unique to Armada. Most miniature wargames take up more space, more time, and more money than X-Wing. Aside from your first point, your arguments are not about Armada, they're about X-Wing.

I been able to actually beat the local imp players with only one assault frig. Something like a 7 and 3 record.

Armada is losing some traction in my area. The delays and all the recent x-wing hype has caused a few players to sell their armada stuff. A recent store tournament had TWO players show up, one of which was from out-of-town. I do feel the rebels need a small boost, but they are much more finesse based than playing imperials. Back in June, I won a store tournament using Rebels. How did I do it? well, as it happened I never had to face any Demolisher builds.

Armada will never be as popular as x-wing, I get that. But why is Armada floundering? well:

1. delays in new waves mean limited build options and predictable meta.

2. armada physically requires more space and more time than x-wing. about double on both counts.

3. tournament play isnt as exciting. 2 hour rounds (soon to be 2.5 hr) mean generally only 3 swiss rounds are played. players that are given a by have to sit around for 2 hours. (or leave and come back)

4. cost. Armada seems more expensive to new players. x-wing players often shy away from armada, citing cost and their current investment in x-wing. If I had a dollar for every time I heard an x-wing player say "looks really cool, but I only have time/money for x-wing"....i'd own another assault frigate.

I still love Armada, but I have more fun and meet more people playing x-wing.

I just attended a tournament that drew three people from out of town and one person from the (small) locality. Does that mean that Armada is losing steam, or does it mean that this locality simply doesn't have the player base (yet)? Also, what kind of losing-steam game gets three people to travel an hour each to go play in a tournament in an out-of-the-way locale?

Obviously, Winnipeg is not a small town like the one that hosted the tournament I mentioned, but there are a lot of factors that go into making a game thrive in a particular community as opposed to another. Having your community organized is one of those factors. Do you have an Armada-players Facebook Group? Are your FLGSs supportive of the game. Do the leaders of your FB group liaise with the FLGS owners/coordinators? Does your community evangelize the tournaments, and are those tournaments at convenient times and locations?

Like what ficklegreendice said about the price, the things you mention are not unique to Armada. Most miniature wargames take up more space, more time, and more money than X-Wing. Aside from your first point, your arguments are not about Armada, they're about X-Wing.

To all your questions, emphatically yes. we have a great community that ensures that events are posted, advertised and scheduled well in advance. We also have had 'learn to play' demo nights at various FLGS. Its just been hard to grow the armada community. Which I should mention is made up entirely of people that also play x-wing.

Wave 2 is going to give Armada a needed kick in the pants, but before that happens the community has already seen or will see some pretty major x-wing releases such as the Raider, Wave 7, new X-wing core set and possibly even wave 8. I have a feeling i'll be hearing some players say "I've already spent too much on X-wing" when Armada wave 2 arrives. The reason I make so many points about x-wing in an armada argument is that in my area, and likely many others too....the two games essentially compete with each other for table space, events, time and money.

We have a great community that ensures that events are posted, advertised and scheduled well in advance. We also have had 'learn to play' demo nights at various FLGS. Its just been hard to grow the armada community. Which I should mention is made up entirely of people that also play x-wing.

Wave 2 is going to give Armada a needed kick in the pants, but before that happens the community has already seen or will see some pretty major x-wing releases such as the Raider, Wave 7, new X-wing core set and possibly even wave 8. I have a feeling i'll be hearing some players say "I've already spent too much on X-wing" when Armada wave 2 arrives. The reason I make so many points about x-wing in an armada argument is that in my area, and likely many others too....the two games essentially compete with each other for table space, events, time and money.

Okay, that's good. Maybe that one tournament was just a fluke. How many regular Armada players would you say are in your community?

Incidentally, in my community there's less overlap between X-Wing and Armada. I still enthusiastically play both. Of course, I also limit myself to Imperials from either game. That helps keep down costs. Somewhat. There are a couple of others, but I wouldn't say that the bulk of the Armada community plays X-Wing.

It might be that what you say comes true - that by the time Wave 2 hits, the players' wallets will have been depleted. But if it comes out in two months, with the latest wave of X-Wing hitting right about now, perhaps people's wallets will have some time to repair themselves.

Episode VII will be another injection of new people.

I'm more interested in this Hypothetical:


X-Wing and Armada are released, Wave 1, Wave 2, at exactly the same time, rather than years apart.

Which would be more popular then, in your opinion, not having Inertia behind one or the other?

I'm more interested in this Hypothetical:

X-Wing and Armada are released, Wave 1, Wave 2, at exactly the same time, rather than years apart.

Which would be more popular then, in your opinion, not having Inertia behind one or the other?

That is actually a pretty interesting hypothetical...I think it would largely come down to what someone would be more interested in. Controlling the capital ships or controlling fighters.