So a good discussion concerning the value of certain Elite Pilot Talents was started in a thread by Khyros (here's the link- https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/185678-epts-that-do-too-much/), and the question was asked- Do EPTs like Push the Limit, Predator, and Veteran Instincts perform TOO well? So much so that they are in fact turning the game away from list building diversity, an integral and fun part of the game?

The general census seems to be this- No, these EPTs are not "breaking" the game. They just outperform other EPTs.

But why is this?

This thread looks to analyze each Elite Pilot Talent and why its use is high or low, and what the cards cost should be pertaining to its actual value in a competitive X-wing environment. Today I'm going over 8 EPTs, starting with the two costing 4 points, and from there, rolling down to those costing 3 points. I should be able to finish up all 3 parts by the end of the week, so keep checking in for the update!

DISCLAIMER: I am NOT a math guy. This analysis is based on in game experience only. Feel free to point out where I may err, and if you have any math to throw into this to support (or not support) my analysis, your own, or that of anyone else, feel free to include.

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Part 1

4 points

Opportunist

Use level: Low

A good positive effect, but over costed due to the situational restraints and the drawbacks when activated. Things do not bode well for Opportunist considering it comes with a restriction, a drawback, AND a higher cost then Predator. It's nearly unusable outside of niche cases (Palob).

I could see this being a worthwhile option at 2 points, even possibly pulling away Carnor Jax from PTL.

Adjusted cost: 2 points

Expose

Use level: Low

From these first two EPTs, we know that FFG puts high value on gaining an extra attack die, that's for sure.

Immediately looking bad from the moment the text "Action:" is sighted. This automatically puts it towards the bottom of the EPT totem pole. Then there's the agility drop. You're likely not playing this thing. Ever. And if you want to sink 7 points into that Decimator for that combo with Experimental Interface (EI), be my guest. I'll take Predator/Gunner for just a point more, thank you.

Yet, This is a tough one to cost, because this is the type of upgrade that could be good on something in future releases, (Ghost, since apparently no EPT (?), may like the EI combo.). Either way, it has enough negative effects that even if that turned out to be the case, reducing its cost wouldn't have me worried.

Why didn't this card just say "You may choose to skip one of your actions during your perform action step. If you do, during your attack, you may increase your primary weapon <rest of text>...." then it would be sweet on lower PS skill ships with EPTs, AND not broken!

Adjusted cost: 3 points, 2 if FFG has no crazy combos in the future for it

Edit: Second Look. After some discussion in the thread, I'm going to make a big jump here and drop Expose to 1 point. Comments from users Jo Jo, Mace Windu, xXWarsmithXx, Ailowynn, Norsejedi, helped in the decision. The reason is this- you think of it's combo with EI, and you realize, even when used in that way, it still suffers a HEAVY penalty- The stress, as WELL as the reduced agility. Push the limit can give you an additional action with stress for 3 (4 w/ my adjusted cost) points, and it isn't restricted to a "must take" action, as a ship is with Expose+EI. Yes, it will work decent for Decimators, but a stressed Decimator is a very predictable ship, and there are still other really good options out there for Decimators. And I don't believe Expose+EI is any more effective then if you put PTL on a Decimator to TL focus every round, honestly. So a 3 point cost drop it is.

Adjust cost: 1 point

3 points

Push The Limit and Predator

Use level: High

Now the big boys.

Decided to lump these two together here since they are where this discussion really begins. Push the Limit, along with Predator, are the dominant EPTs of the current meta. Both provide excellent action economy (PTL through actions, Predator through the replacement of actions), and they combo naturally with a number of pilot abilities. Perhaps most notorious, is the Soontir+PTL combo, which allows him at PS 9 to boost and barrel roll out of arcs with ease while also gaining a focus for attack, and in the case he gets caught in an arc, good luck hitting him through his double focus + evade.

I believe Soontir would be willing to pay up to 6 points for PTL before he considered other options. But Soontir is the exception, not the rule. Every other pilot would likely be willing to pay 4 for it at most. Anything more than that, and we wouldn't see any interceptors other then Soonts even looked at twice. So, disagree as you may, but I'm gonna say PTL needs a bump up in cost. 1 point will help players look into other EPT options while not taking PTL out of the discussion.

I'm also going to bump Predator up a point. I almost think it should be bumped up 2. The main reason it needs to cost more is that Predator is effectively a free mini target lock you are guaranteed every turn. Doesn't sound too strong initially. But the issue is this- other EPTs with action like effects have either restrictions (single use, ship firing on must not have focus evade), or drawbacks (gain stress). Predator has none. In fact, it makes life even easier, because you basically never have to take a target lock and can focus or Boost every round as Predator acts as your TL. Unless the card is reworded to include a restriction or drawback (must be in arc, at rng 2-3, can only reroll blanks, etc.), The bump in cost has to be the drawback to taking it.

Adjusted costs: 4 points

Ruthlessness

Use level: Low

I have yet to see this card used competitively. This issue has more to do with the state of the meta than with the card itself, as I think it's a pretty sweet ability. There are far too many 2 ship builds running around to run this for 3 points, but I don't think that means this ones cost should drop. Dropping it to 2 may make sense currently, but if we ever find a world where swarms return, this could be a nice buy at 3.

cost maintained

Edit: Second Look. A very compelling argument was given by user Rojeck on reducing the value of Relentless- "X-Wing is not Magic the Gathering where you can change your list according to what your enemy is playing. Ruthlessness will literally never work in some matchups and whether it will or not is not up to you". Even if swarms DID make a big comeback, there would still be an inherent risk in taking Ruthlessness in catching a bad match up for the card, as well as the penalty of the possibility of harming your own ships. For this, I decided to reduce the cost to 2.

Adjusted cost: 2

Outmaneuver

Use level: Moderate

I think Outmaneuver is right where EPTs should be. Nice effect, fairly costed, slight restriction, and just niche enough that you're not going to throw it onto everything. With PTL and Predator at 4 points, Outmaneuver would be a much better looking option. It still suffers from what I'll call "the Decimator effect", as people shy away from the upgrade with the zero agility Decimators in just about every other list it seems.

cost maintained

Marksmanship

Use level: Low

Another EPT that suffers from the "ACTION:" header. Marksmanship has found niche spots every now and then. It's nice on double tap Corran, but VI or PTL do more for him. Boosk seems to like it, so maybe it has a spot there. I'm going to go ahead and say this could use a single drop in points. Much like Expose, you can pair it with Experimental interface, but at that point, your sinking so much into the ship you're probably better off going a different direction and saving the points. A drop down to 2 would at least offer it a look on some lists.

Adjusted cost: 2

Daredevil

Use level: Low

Daredevil has seen a little bump in popularity since its initial entry into the game. PTL+Daredevil Tycho can use it to great effect, and bumping Oicunn, while I'm not sure how competitive, can have fun with it. It's one of those "Action" EPTs I'm pretty low on, and like its brethren, I'm going to bump it down a point. When the actions on your action bar are already high value, it's tough to pay a price to put another situational action in the mix. This would be fun on non boosting ships, but that bottom text on the card might as well say "You can equip this card only if you have the (boost) action icon or Engine Upgrade equipped". Dropping it to 2 will give it more value on the niche builds it currently fits in, but I still have trouble seeing it finding spots elsewhere outside of that. This is a niche EPT, but a fun one where it works. And it works on Tycho.

Adjusted cost: 2

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Part 2

2 points

Wingman

Use level: Low

A good card with just too tight of a range restriction for the cost. If I was doing card erratas here, I would push it to rng 1-2 and keep the cost. It combos well in multiples, and cards like that I feel need to be as cheap as possible so they can be run in multiples at low cost. When a card with this good of an ability is rarely being used, it should probably be cheaper. Lets drop it to 1.

Adjusted cost: 1

Swarm Tactics

Use level: Moderate

Swarms tactics, fitting to its name, is at its best in swarm lists. Like Wingman, it has a tight range 1 restriction, but I like it much better here. It's rewarding players for flying the ship equipped with the upgrade correctly, more so then it is penalizing them for being outside of the range. I also like the effect more than Wingman, and the fact that it can stack if run in multiples is powerful. Price of 2 is fair and balanced.

cost maintained

Stay on Target

Use level: Low

Cards which allow you to change your maneuver after revealing it have not been too popular to date. Imperial Boba and Navigator, alongside Stay on Target, aren't seen too often at high level of play. I think the reasoning for this is such- If you're going to be good enough to place in a high level tournament, you're likely good enough to know what the optimal maneuver is 9 times out of 10, so paying for the ability to change your maneuver just isn't worth it.

I don't see that line of thinking changing, and because of that, I don't think there is any issue with the cost of cards like this. They just don't fit the mindset of what you are looking to do in competitive lists.

It will still have niches at the relatively low cost of 2 points. It works on Keyan with adv sensors (though it is worthless against most 2 ship builds, so it's not incredibly viable). There are Imp Boba and YV-666 w/ Maneuvering Fins shenanigans to be had. Also, scum ships with a crew slot for Outlaw Tech can change maneuvers and still get a focus. But if you're looking at tourney level play, this just isn't the droids card you're looking for.

cost maintained

Squad Leader

Use level: Low

So... you're giving up your action, to let a ship with a LOWER pilot skill perform a second action? And they have to be within a certain range? Ya... I understand this is a card specifically modeled to work with Vader's pilot ability. But even then, the scenarios where Vader will want to pass one of his two actions on to a lower PS ship instead of take the action himself are rarer than a sarlaac pit in Cloud City. It may have cool synergies with ordinance, allowing a ship a quick TL and focus, but I can't think of any combinations making this worth 2 points and a slot which could be better utilized.

Adjusted cost: 1 point

Lone Wolf

Use level: High

Good card. After the "big 3", this is easily number 4. But, unlike the others, it seems... Fair? I don't think that's the word I'm looking for, because the big 3 aren't unfair really. Maybe it's just more fair. It's similar to Predator, but you get re-rolls on defense as well. Ships like the YT-2400 and Tie Advanced want this over Predator in a lot of cases because of that. But unlike Predator, it has a restriction for its use, meaning it wont always trigger, and in certain lists it wont work at all. It also only re-rolls blanks, which puts a damper on things if you are boosting or barrel rolling. It's also unique, which means, even if it's powerful, it can't be abused as easily.

Going to keep this one at 2. If my changes were to actually take place, this could turn out to be the card of choice, but no way of really knowing that. Unless someone can convince me otherwise, it's going to stick where it's at.

cost maintained

Intimidation

Use level: Low

I really like this card. Who doesn't want to turn a negative into a positive? But 2 points is just too valuable to put into an upgrade that only comes into play in pocket cases. I like the idea of this in a black squadron swarm. Could be trouble for IGs. But, chances are you'll run it and then face Decimators all day, because that's how these type of things tend to go.

Following the same thinking I took with the cost change change (lol) I made to Ruthlessness after reading Rojeck's comment, I'm going to drop this down a point. If you're running it, you're praying you run into builds where the upgrade takes effect, and that makes it a gamble that should be rewarded with a lower cost.

Adjusted cost: 1 point

Expert Handling

Use level: Low

I spot an "ACTION:" header! You know what that means. Oddly enough, this older EPT may be just about to hit its stride, especially if the Tie Advanced performs well enough to find a spot in the meta. Rolling off target locks isn't a bad addition to your barrel roll, and gaining the barrel roll action even if it gives a stress isn't terrible. It just isn't making lists for 2 points. So 1 point it is.

Also, just wanted to note the irony that Keyan Farlander would like this card if he got the stress. "No, guys! You don't understand! I WANT the stress! Yes, I KNOW I can do a barrel roll, but..! ...ugh... fine..."

Adjusted cost: 1 point

Elusiveness

Use level: Low

Ew.... Not a fan. Why does this card need to give a stress? I guess to keep it from triggering multiple times? Then why not just say "once per round"? I mean, we are talking ONE die here. And you're not changing that to a blank or anything. That thing still has a 50/50 shot of rolling right back where it was. Ya, really, really, really don't like this card. I've seen it used twice in competitive play- once on a YT-1300 (Chewie I think) in combo with Kyle Katarn crew for the stress clearing focus, and another time with Ibtisam. So in both cases, they were playing it almost as much for the stress bonuses for their build or pilot as much as for the re-roll. So maybe that's why it gives that stress? Either way, 1 point is as low as we can go ladies and gentlemen, so 1 it is.

It is an earlier EPT, so FFG is easily forgiven for this one.

Adjusted cost: 1 point

Decoy

Use level: Low

Decoy.... Decoy, Decoy, Decoy... What to do with you? This card also seems to suffer from the 2 ship build meta. It's a similar ability to Swarm Tactics, except without the PS comboing when taken in multiples, and it has a bigger bubble for targets.

The fact seems to be that while it's not a bad card, it just doesn't fit in spots where it wants to be. PS 8 and 9 ships are looking at EPTs that maximize their output. They can't be bothered by EPTs that want to help out others. And Swarm Tactics outshines it in Swarm builds. So it really has no home. Maybe if it comes in at a point cheaper then Swarm Tactics, it can find a niche in those type of builds when Tactics just wont fit.

Adjusted cost: 1 point

Bodyguard

Use level: Low

I'll admit. Of all of FFGs released cards in wave 6, this one was by far the biggest head scratcher for me. Actually, scratch that. The IG-2000 title being free was. Anyways, Bodyguard is basically R2-F2 where you pass the agility instead of keep it. And we all know how good R2-F2 is, Right..? Ok, ok, it's not quite THAT bad, since you can get the extra focus with Guri's ability, or with Palob/Moldy crow HWKs and such. But still, this card sure isn't good. Think about this. You have to SPEND a focus. You MUST be at range 1 of the other ship. The ship MUST be a higher PS then you. Yikes, that's what? 1, 2, 3 restrictions or penalties to its use? And to make matters worse, it's only available for Scum. Now if it said "If you have a focus token, you may choose a friendly <rest of text>..." then it would be a sweet buy at 2. But as is, I don't care what combo with what pilot you are putting together. Good luck making this work.

Adjusted cost: 1 point

Oh, and I just noticed it's unique! Not that anyone would ever want to run multiples anyways.

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Well that's it for part 2! Part 3 will likely be short, as you can't really make an upgrade cost less then 1... I mean, you could (and FFG has), but those type of cards have ship restrictions, and if you had a 0 cost EPT, one could argue it would be "auto-include" for every ship not running an EPT otherwise, no matter how lame it was. Also, I wouldn't be able to fit all the images... Should have saved another spot!

Carnor and Opportunist look like they synergize, but they don't. If Carnor is facing lower PS pilots, they'll move, action. Then Carnor will move into range 1. Now they cannot spend their tokens and Opportunist will never trigger. I don't think its point value should be cut in half, but 3 points is about where I think it should be.

Even at 3 points, Expose doesn't work, maybe at 2 I could see it somewhere. Until the Decimator came I thought a good fix for it would be to have its effect last for the entire match. You give up agility for firepower. Now I think its best served in a bicycle wheel.

I think Pred and PTL are actually fairly priced. Predator is arguably the better EPT because any ship with an EPT can use it. PTL is awesome on some ships, but crap on others. I just think every other EPT isn't up to snuff.

I always forget Ruthlessness exists. I will try to find some use for it on the newly improved Advanced. Vader might like it. I don't like the fact that you have to pick another ship to damage. Potential for friendly fire there. I think 2 points would be a good spot for it.

I love Outmaneuver and try to fit it into lists, but man its hard over Pred & PTL. I'd actually go with low use. I've never faced someone running OM. If it was 2 points, I think it would see way more use.

Marksmanship stinks. Calculation has pretty much replaced it. I agree with it being 2 points, but I don't even know then if its worth it. Maybe on something with TLT.

Agree on Daredevil. I'd even go so far as to get rid of the boost requirement or damage part. I think taking an action and stressing you is enough of a penalty.

its a nice analysis, and while I don't agree with everything you said, most of it seems well theorized.

I do however think that there is a very large variable that you have not considered, relative cost to other upgrade types and indeed the possibility of additional ships over upgrades.

In a vacuum your point values seem solid however once added to the overall calculation of points they some of the readjustments still wont work.

Expose & Opportunist one action dependent and mathematically worse than just the focus action regardless of cost, and the other best suited to be fitted to a low PS ship, yet few low PS ships worth taking have an EPT slot. neither are particularly good outside of niche uses regardless of cost.

PTL & Predator, at 4 points would see less play, indeed I would go as far to say considerably less play, if only for the fact that the current crop of lists are built perfectly to 100 points such that a bump of a point throws a lot of synergies out the window when you have to look at dropping other upgrades to keep them.

Ruthlessness & Outmaneuver, both see virtually no play now. simply making predator & PTL cost more isn't going to make them see any more play as there are still far to many other more efficient options in other slots. with a 1 point reduction outmaneuver would see play, Ruthlessness even at 2 points that only triggers when damage gets through and has the distinct possibility of hitting your own ships wouldn't see play on top of the fact its restricted to imps as well. At 1 point it might be considered.

Marksmanship & Daredevil, both heavily reliant on other synergistic ability's to maximize value (Gunner or Han for Marksmanship) or negate the negative effects (Tycho or in corner cases Oicunn). I could see Marksmanship being played at 2 points as it was very good in HSF back in Wave 2-3 but Daredevil will only be playable on Tycho/Oicunn due to its sever drawbacks and restrictions.

I would have to say that overall there are 3 things that make good EPTs:

1) Cost 3 or less, 4 or more would have to be a wildly amazing ability, because lets face it your only 1 point behind gunner at that point in your squad.

2) not consume your action, because actions are king you cant afford to spend points in your list converting 1 action to another.

3) this is the most important, it has to work every turn, ideally even if your stressed (Predator) and be relevant. again if your comparing to other upgrade types, most if not all have permanent effects or consistently perform.

The most used EPTs all meet these rules:

PTL

Predator

VI

and to lesser extents:

Lone Wolf

Determination

Also consider the fact that there actually aren't that many EPTS out there (24 as of W6) with 2 being faction restricted, so really 1 out of 5 EPTs seeing regular play is not that bad.

It's not possible to assign a generalised rating for EPTs.

Why? Because their values increase and decrease depending upon their synergy with the ship and pilot to which they are assigned.

Consider PTL: Soontir Fel might as well have it stapled to his pilot card. It's an automatic include for him. However, PTL would not be anywhere near as viable if it was on Luke Skywalker or Darth Vader. Those two pilots don't have the synergy with PTL, like Soontir Fel does.

The competitive aspect of the game will evolve to where players take the EPTs that will best synergise with their best competitive squads.

I think the word "Moderate" would work better then "Medium". Jk

I definitely think making PTL 4 points will kill my favorite list - 4x RGP + PTL

Ruthlessness is amazing, and it is correctly costed. Seeing damage pinging to your opponents is most pleasing, the two ship meta is, as you noted, to blame for its absence.

Simply adjusting cost by 1 point would make many cards more playable, though in the case of expose probably down to 2 points since it is an action.

Interesting analysis, although I have a few niggles. First off, the fact that PtL and Predator are efficient doesn't mean that they're overpowered. It's more like the X-Wing/B-Wing issue: the B-Wing is more common because it's more efficient, but that doesn't make it overpowered. This is pretty clear when you look over the other EPTs you mentioned -- most of them are overcosted.

As far as point costs go . . . Expose should ought to be about 1 point. Taking a focus or TL is statistically better than gaining an attack die. For one point, it could be decent combined with Experimental Interface.

I would also lower Outmaneuver to two points. Again, according the MathWing, I believe that Predator is actually as good as Outmaneuver -- and that's assuming that Outmaneuver triggers.

its a nice analysis, and while I don't agree with everything you said, most of it seems well theorized.

I do however think that there is a very large variable that you have not considered, relative cost to other upgrade types and indeed the possibility of additional ships over upgrades.

In a vacuum your point values seem solid however once added to the overall calculation of points they some of the readjustments still wont work.

Expose & Opportunist one action dependent and mathematically worse than just the focus action regardless of cost, and the other best suited to be fitted to a low PS ship, yet few low PS ships worth taking have an EPT slot. neither are particularly good outside of niche uses regardless of cost.

PTL & Predator, at 4 points would see less play, indeed I would go as far to say considerably less play, if only for the fact that the current crop of lists are built perfectly to 100 points such that a bump of a point throws a lot of synergies out the window when you have to look at dropping other upgrades to keep them.

Ruthlessness & Outmaneuver, both see virtually no play now. simply making predator & PTL cost more isn't going to make them see any more play as there are still far to many other more efficient options in other slots. with a 1 point reduction outmaneuver would see play, Ruthlessness even at 2 points that only triggers when damage gets through and has the distinct possibility of hitting your own ships wouldn't see play on top of the fact its restricted to imps as well. At 1 point it might be considered.

Marksmanship & Daredevil, both heavily reliant on other synergistic ability's to maximize value (Gunner or Han for Marksmanship) or negate the negative effects (Tycho or in corner cases Oicunn). I could see Marksmanship being played at 2 points as it was very good in HSF back in Wave 2-3 but Daredevil will only be playable on Tycho/Oicunn due to its sever drawbacks and restrictions.

I would have to say that overall there are 3 things that make good EPTs:

1) Cost 3 or less, 4 or more would have to be a wildly amazing ability, because lets face it your only 1 point behind gunner at that point in your squad.

2) not consume your action, because actions are king you cant afford to spend points in your list converting 1 action to another.

3) this is the most important, it has to work every turn, ideally even if your stressed (Predator) and be relevant. again if your comparing to other upgrade types, most if not all have permanent effects or consistently perform.

The most used EPTs all meet these rules:

PTL

Predator

VI

and to lesser extents:

Lone Wolf

Determination

Also consider the fact that there actually aren't that many EPTS out there (24 as of W6) with 2 being faction restricted, so really 1 out of 5 EPTs seeing regular play is not that bad.

AWESOME points.

I don't by any stretch of the imagination claim to have the "right" formula here. In fact, I'm pretty sure if I was given a magic wand that allowed me to make the changes I see fit, the game would likely be worse off instead of better. But I needed an interesting way to get the discussion going.

And then there are great comments like this which make my terrible theorizing worth it. Everyone who comes into this thread and takes the time to read your post will gain a better grasp on the question I set out to answer- why EPTs are in the situation they are.

Keep the awesome comments coming!

I think the word "Moderate" would work better then "Medium". Jk

Updated

the fact that PtL and Predator are efficient doesn't mean that they're overpowered. It's more like the X-Wing/B-Wing issue: the B-Wing is more common because it's more efficient, but that doesn't make it overpowered. This is pretty clear when you look over the other EPTs you mentioned -- most of them are overcosted.

I definitely think making PTL 4 points will kill my favorite list - 4x RGP + PTL

I really weighed the costing of PTL and Predator heavily, especially PTL. I went back and forth a number of times on 3 or 4, finally settling for 4 due to its strength within the synergies it excels in. But this brought me to a tough thinking point- do you give them a cost based on their use on a ship with no synergy, on a ship with a great synergy, or somewhere in between? Because PTL really is CRAZY good on some ships, and just pretty good on others, it's tough to decide. It's play on Soontir really is what made me decide to bump it to 4, and maybe that's the wrong way to do things. It probably is. Espeially considering the unfortunate backlash it would have to other interceptors other then Fel you mentioned xXWarsmithXx. I didn't feel good about hurting things like the Royal Guard Pilot, but, alas, in the end I decided on 4. Of all the EPTs, Push has so far been the toughest to cost.

Predator I'm much more stuck on 4, largely because it quite literally has NO downsides. You're stressed? Still get Predator. Blocked? Still get Predator. Out of arc? Still get Predator. Ioned? ... You get the idea. Because it is one of the few (if not the only) EPTs with no negatives on the table, I feel it fair to place the negative for taking the card in its higher cost.

EPTs would certainly benefit from some 20/20 hindsight now, but I wouldn't lean toward making any of the EPTs more expensive. Instead, I think many of the present options aren't cheap enough to really make you struggle in the choice between them - which is why we see some reasonably priced favorites stand out (e.g. Predator, PTL, VI). Lower priced cards would also improve the diversity of the game as we'd see more cards in play, whereas raising point costs would eat into other ships in your squad. If I had it to do over again I'd change the following:

• Expose - 2 pts instead of 4. It's too situational in that it lowers your defense (plenty of turrets make that a big gamble) and it requires an action, so it should be less than the Predator benchmark of 3.
• Opportunist - 2 pts instead of 4. Also situational and it requires a stress, so it should be less than Predator.
• Outmaneuver - 2 pts instead of 3. A very good card that rewards great flying, but just a bit too expensive.
• Daredevil - 1 pt instead of 3. This can't compete with PTL and requires that a ship have the boost action. There needs to be significant incentive to give up the PTL options of focus/evade or boost/roll.
• Marksmanship - 2 pts instead of 3. A very good card, but it takes up an action so it can't compete at 3 points with Predator.
• Wingman - 1 pt instead of 2. The range 1 limitation is too steep to justify 2 points in my opinion.
• Intimidation - 1 pt instead of 2. This card really benefits lower PS blockers, and there aren't many pilot options that have a lower PS with an EPT slot.
• Elusiveness - 1 pt instead of 2. This is somewhat like a reverse Predator, but you have to stress yourself and can only use it once per round, so it has to be significantly cheaper.
• Expert Handling - 1 pt instead of 2. You don't always need to roll, and if you don't have the roll action then you are stressed.

Then there are a few EPTs in the 1 point category that would benefit from a token similar to Extra Munitions. In other words, if you chose those EPTs then you put one EPT token on top of each, and when you first use that ability you remove the token and then flip the card after the second use. This would make their point value much more reasonable. That category includes:

• Lightning Reflexes
• Crack Shot
• Adrenaline Rush

For the vast majority of ships with an EPT slot, I just can't see spending a point for a one time ability, all of which are quite situational. If I could use them twice though... well now I have some debate!

This is a good thread. Keep it up!

Just wanted to add my $.02 and say that the analysis is very good, a very welcome read, and keep up the good work. We could use something like this for EVERYTHING, not just EPTs.

So, is Predator better for its cost than Lone Wolf in the current meta? One only works on offensive dice, and since most people you face will have higher than PS2, the second reroll rarely comes into play. However, while Lone Wolf does work on the defensive as well, it requires that you be at range three or more for it to kick in, which could be a pain when it's say, a Darth Vader/Fel combo trying to focus down an enemy ace.

Lone Wolf also gives me an extra point towards the initiative bid, which can make the world of difference in a mirror match. My opponents Vader has Predator, mine has LW, which will work better?

Lone Wolf also gives me an extra point towards the initiative bid, which can make the world of difference in a mirror match. My opponents Vader has Predator, mine has LW, which will work better?

It depends entire on what else you and she/he brings and who has initiative, etc.

In a Vacuum, yours should do better.

EPTs would certainly benefit from some 20/20 hindsight now, but I wouldn't lean toward making any of the EPTs more expensive. Instead, I think many of the present options aren't cheap enough to really make you struggle in the choice between them - which is why we see some reasonably priced favorites stand out (e.g. Predator, PTL, VI). Lower priced cards would also improve the diversity of the game as we'd see more cards in play, whereas raising point costs would eat into other ships in your squad. If I had it to do over again I'd change the following:

• Expose - 2 pts instead of 4. It's too situational in that it lowers your defense (plenty of turrets make that a big gamble) and it requires an action, so it should be less than the Predator benchmark of 3.
• Opportunist - 2 pts instead of 4. Also situational and it requires a stress, so it should be less than Predator.
• Outmaneuver - 2 pts instead of 3. A very good card that rewards great flying, but just a bit too expensive.
• Daredevil - 1 pt instead of 3. This can't compete with PTL and requires that a ship have the boost action. There needs to be significant incentive to give up the PTL options of focus/evade or boost/roll.
• Marksmanship - 2 pts instead of 3. A very good card, but it takes up an action so it can't compete at 3 points with Predator.
• Wingman - 1 pt instead of 2. The range 1 limitation is too steep to justify 2 points in my opinion.
• Intimidation - 1 pt instead of 2. This card really benefits lower PS blockers, and there aren't many pilot options that have a lower PS with an EPT slot.
• Elusiveness - 1 pt instead of 2. This is somewhat like a reverse Predator, but you have to stress yourself and can only use it once per round, so it has to be significantly cheaper.
• Expert Handling - 1 pt instead of 2. You don't always need to roll, and if you don't have the roll action then you are stressed.

Then there are a few EPTs in the 1 point category that would benefit from a token similar to Extra Munitions. In other words, if you chose those EPTs then you put one EPT token on top of each, and when you first use that ability you remove the token and then flip the card after the second use. This would make their point value much more reasonable. That category includes:

• Lightning Reflexes
• Crack Shot
• Adrenaline Rush

For the vast majority of ships with an EPT slot, I just can't see spending a point for a one time ability, all of which are quite situational. If I could use them twice though... well now I have some debate!

Opportunist is worth 2 points, maybe even 3 points. I have played against a combo that included:

Keyan Farlander (42) B-Wing (29), Heavy Laser Cannon (7), Opportunist (4), Fire Control System (2)

Wes + Wedge

The opponent had Wes and Wedge strip tokens off first, followed by Keyan rolling 5 heavy laser dice with target lock reroll and focus.

I definitely agree that a lot of the discardable EPT should be usable twice, it would increase their relevancy.

Just a quick note in defence of Outmanouver, I see it used a fair amount, but almost always as the second EPT on an A-Wing with the title. Nippy ships with low ATT can get a lot of value out of it. But it could definitely do with being a point cheaper, the only reason it's usually only on double EPT A-Wings is it'll VERY rarely be the first one you reach for.

As for Predator and PTL, I agree Predator could do with a 1 point bump. It's ubiquitous, and works on almost any ship you name apart from the more support type ships (even then...). It's always useful, always gets used, and whenever I'm choosing an EPT, I'll always consider whether it's more useful than Predator. There should be no auto-includes apart from specific combos, and Predator, at the moment, is pretty much that.

PTL, on the other hand, is fantastic on some ships (probably the first EPT for those A-Wing test pilots, and Interceptors, obviously) but isn't going to get put on Jan Ors! It's a solid pick, but not auto-include apart from certain ships and I think that's fine.

Ruthlessness: As said above suffers heavily from the 2-ships meta.

But could be quite useful against Z95-swarms (both rebels and e.g. Scum bugzappers). It would be useful against Scyks swarms as well, but these are almost never fielded due to the problems associated with Scyk point costs for its low-health/equipment-options/dial.

Swarms just suffer from tournament point counting mechanism.

Swarms just suffer from tournament point counting mechanism.

The biggest things Swarms suffer from is just people not playing them/not wanting to play them. They are harder to fly than a 2 ship build and it also requires a bit more put into buying all the ships needed but a TIE swarm is still probably one of the most effective lists in the game. They EAT turreted ships alive.

Ruthlesness shouldn't cost 3. I would say it could cost 1 point and still be fair.

Why? It's a very niche card, and X-Wing is not Magic the Gathering where you can change your list according to what your enemy is playing. Ruthlesness will literally never work in some matchups and whether it will or not is not up to you as is the case with Lone Wolf. Furthermore, you have to avoid it acutally hurting you (with your ship being the only thing at range 1 of the target).

That's why I would cost it at 1 point and I still think it would not see tons of play (as it is exceptional only vs synergy builds like Biggs or full on swarms like a 7-8 ship Tie).You almost always want your EPT to be universal, like with Predator.

Most of your analysis is spot-on though, and I appreciate the work

Then there are a few EPTs in the 1 point category that would benefit from a token similar to Extra Munitions. In other words, if you chose those EPTs then you put one EPT token on top of each, and when you first use that ability you remove the token and then flip the card after the second use. This would make their point value much more reasonable.

This is also a very nice idea and could really make those talents (especially the new ones) usable.

Then there are a few EPTs in the 1 point category that would benefit from a token similar to Extra Munitions. In other words, if you chose those EPTs then you put one EPT token on top of each, and when you first use that ability you remove the token and then flip the card after the second use. This would make their point value much more reasonable. That category includes:

• Crack Shot

I don't think people have grasped the power of this card yet. It's a FREE HIT OR CRIT. It's an anti-Hull or anti-Shield FOR ONE POINT. And you want it to be used TWICE for 1/3 or 1/4 of the cost of those cards? HELL NO.

Opportunist works well on Keyan Farlander. He can use the stress as a focus, and start the next round unstressed. Pair him with Wes Janson, so that it triggers.

At least in a fun casual game, you should try it.

That's the problem with the majority of EPTs. They are viable on like 2 or 3 pilots.

Then there are a few EPTs in the 1 point category that would benefit from a token similar to Extra Munitions. In other words, if you chose those EPTs then you put one EPT token on top of each, and when you first use that ability you remove the token and then flip the card after the second use. This would make their point value much more reasonable. That category includes:

• Crack Shot

I don't think people have grasped the power of this card yet. It's a FREE HIT OR CRIT. It's an anti-Hull or anti-Shield FOR ONE POINT. And you want it to be used TWICE for 1/3 or 1/4 of the cost of those cards? HELL NO.

It's also really good for landing things like Assault Missiles. When you have the perfect shot lined up, it's great to have an almost guarantee that it will land.