@InterceptorMad: I read what you wrote about how the CR-90 used it's crippled rear to block shots, but was then firing back. You know you can't fire the main gun through it's rear section, right? So, you can't use the rear to block shots and then fire through it. I'm not sure if that's what you were doing, but just wanted to throw that out there.

No no, you misunderstand. He was using his movement options, initiative and wrecked aft section to literally block my Raider's MOVEMENT. And so I kept colliding with him no matter how I tried to turn, and so I kept gaining crits for colliding with him, but as his rear was wrecked already, he wasn't getting any penalties. We were sure that it must be wrong in some way, but we were sure we were playing the rules correctly.

Wow this sounds so cool, I really can't wait to get my hands on a Raider, not that I will have the time for an epic game but **** that sounds fun.

I would have thought the Raider would be better at killing fighters and leave the CR-90 for the TIE bombers rather than having both epic ships having a slugging match.

I thought the Raider was ment to be be an anti-fighter escort ship like the Lancer class frigate

Did you use Roark? Shooting the CR-90 at PS 12 is ridiculous.

Wow,

Think this is the first Epic Ship Fight Thread.

EVER!

cool.

There is another suggestion that I have for epic play. When you select your fighters, try to make little squads of different ships. Have something like 3 ordnance carriers. Have 4 Interceptors (to attack their ordnance ships). Take 3 attack ships. Fly them all together and fly them strategically. Have the ordnance ships go wide and try to sneak around the furball. Have the Interceptors (and I mean things like A-wings, Tie Interceptors, or even just standard Tie Fighters) go after their ordnance to create a bit furball. Send your attack ships to either attack the furball or go for their main ship. If you have a small squad of torpedo carriers make it through and do a run on an epic ship, it can really wreck them. Also....to me at least, it's really more fun when you run things like that. This can work on both sides. If you are Imperials, you can send a few Bombers wide on the side that you think the CR-90 is going to go. Or....as Rebels, send your Y-wings on the side you aren't going to go. That way you ensure their side is going to be open.

Would you share any of your Epic squad/fleet builds?

I'm also glad to see that X-Wings are great!!!

Well...I was hoping to get more games in before my surgery. My wife has gotten on my case more for no driving while on pain meds, too. So, I haven't had a game in a while, but I've done a couple of games with my rules for a space station that I made up before the Raider came out. I made the space station out of Big Gulp cup, 2 plastic plates, yogurt cantainer, and other bits.

Story is the Rebels have been watching a space station to see if it's weak enough to attack when local Moff comes to inspect the station. It's too tempting a target to kill station and local Moff, so they attack, even if it's a tough fight. For the story, the station gets Moff Jerjerrod. Also, his ship is the Lambda. I picked Kagi with Sensor Jammers as Kagi starts to act like the Moff is onboard his ship, so the Rebels get confused and start to TL the shuttle as opposed to the station.

I picked only a few named characters and tried to use ones that aren't used that often. Kir Kanos is someone that could do really well in a mission like this. He could sit back and fire at the CR-90 or whomever when your table is 6"x4". Horton can just be deadly if he gets in range.

Oh, it's important for speed of play to have different PS pilots. Get multiple players and different PS so you don't bog the game down with one guy running 12 Academy Pilots.

Rebel Forces

CR-90 - Tantive IV title

• Fore Section = Single Turbolaser, Quad Laser Turret, Engineering Team, Gunnery Team, Sensor Team, Backup Shield Generator, Chewbacca
• AFt Section = Single Turbolaser, Gunnery Team, Ionization Reactor, Mercenary Copilot

Attack Wing

• Horton Salm = 2 x Proton Torpedo, Ion Turret
• Grey Squadron Pilot = 2 x Proton Torpedo, Ion Turret
• Gold Squadron Pilot = 2 x Proton Torpedo, Blaster Turret

Interceptor Wing

• Green Squadron Pilot = Cluster Missiles, Veteran Instinct
• Green Squadron Pilot = Cluster Missiles
• Prototype Pilot = Cluster Missiles

X-wings

• Garven Dreis = Proton Toredo
• Red Squadron Pilot = Proton Toredo
• Rookie Pilot = Proton Toredo

Imperial Forces

Space Station

• Command Tower = Moff Jerjerrod, Sensor Team
• Section 1 = Quad Laser Turret, Proton Torpedo
• Section 2 = Single Turbolaser, Proton Torpedo
• Section 3 = Quad Laser Turret, Proton Torpedo
• Section 4 = Single Turbolaser, Proton Torpedo

Defense Squadron

• Black Squadron Pilot
• Obsidian Squadron Pilot
• Academy Pilot
• Academy Pilot

Interceptor Squadron

• Sabre Squadron Pilot = Autothrusters
• Avenger Squadron Pilot = Autothrusters
• Kir Kanos = Autothrusters

Bomber Squadron

• Gamma Squadron Pilot = Proton Toredo
• Scimitar Squadron Pilott = Proton Toredo, Proximity Mine
• Scimitar Squadron Pilot = Proton Toredo, Proximity Mine

Nearby Ships

• Patrol Leader (VT-49) = Gunner
• Captain Kagi (Lambda) = Sensor Jammers

The first time we played, the Rebels kept the Tantive too far back and tried to push all their ships through the middle. The giant furball seemed to go against the Imperials at first, but the Y-wings ended up going slow through the furball. The Imperials were able to swarm them and eventually get most of them. The Tantive came in way too late and was able to get swarmed.

The next time we played, I had to leave early due to family stuff. The Rebels pushed the CR-90 forward. It was bloody. The CR-90 was destroyed, but took a lot of enemy with it. At this point, the others didn't have much experience with Epic and energy. They didn't fully realize all the upgrades on the Space Station, either. So, it was just the snub nosed fighters that blasted it to pieces. I think the Station could've put up more of a spirited defense.

So, I've been wanting to run it again, but haven't had the chance. Might try to use the station for a 3 way Epic where 3 factions all have different missions....none of which are trying to destroy the various Epics. Kind of makes it interesting.

Overall, though, it's been fun to plan which squads will try to do what roles. I think it's best to have the Interceptors go for the Y-wings as the regular Ties just couldn't do enough damage. Also, the Tie Bombers go forward and drop bombs, but should then fire at whatever target they have. They won't last long as X-wings tend to hunt them. VT-49 should avoid A-wings. X-wings destroy whatever they go after. Single Turbo Lasers can do damage to X-wings.

The angle of approach between the raider and the blockade runner are critical to how they battle eachother ... Speed and engine booster can be awesome for the cr-90 - if you can get through and past the raider's front arcs quickly and start to turn in - you can double broadside, and hit with the primary turret of the cr-90 while the raider is trying to catch you.

But if the raider can keep the cr-90 in the front in a slow approach, or chase the raider from behind - it can bring a whole lot of power to bear while the cr-90 can't do much. For maximum exchange between the two, they need to cross like a T - and that position can be held for awhile, depending on how they turn - It's really neat how important the relative positions between the two are for their power - they can be balanced with eachother or outclass eachother entirely, and that's before you go into full loadouts!

I think it might take some experience to fly the CR-90 as it does want to get the broadside, like everyone states. I think that is what can make the game interesting, as the two ships fly very differently. One wants to fly directly at and the other wants to outflank.

@InterceptorMad: I read what you wrote about how the CR-90 used it's crippled rear to block shots, but was then firing back. You know you can't fire the main gun through it's rear section, right? So, you can't use the rear to block shots and then fire through it. I'm not sure if that's what you were doing, but just wanted to throw that out there.

Another thing that I think is different about the CR-90 is the snub nosed fighters you can bring with it. Most Rebel ships have good firepower while Tie Fighters just don't have the strength to do much to Epic ships. As previosuly stated, X-wings are fantastic in Epic. They are fast, have good enough agility to evade some damage (especially single turbo lasers) and have good damage output. B-wings are slow, but they can take a lot of punishment. The Imperial ships are more agile, but a lucky hit will take them out. The Rebel ships can take more of a beating. The regular fighters can support the CR-90 better than the Imperials.

I also want to suggest Proton Torpedoes. Yes, I know people don't like to take them and believe Ordnance sucks. You don't get action economy. Proton Torps turn one eyeball into a critical. Have you seen the critical effects on epic ships? One of them can lose you the game at the right time. Even if you have no way to effect the dice, you are probably going to roll 2 hits and an eyeball with 4 unmodified dice. That's 2 hits and 1 crit to get through! Those critical hits on epic ships are utterly nasty. If you have 3 generic X-wings with Proton Torpedoes, that's a nasty thing to have coming at you. Use one round to knock out the shields, then fire away with torpedoes. Can you imagine 3 Y-wings getting in range and dropping two rounds of Proton Torpedoes on the Raider? Some might roll bad, but I bet you roll well enough.

There is another suggestion that I have for epic play. When you select your fighters, try to make little squads of different ships. Have something like 3 ordnance carriers. Have 4 Interceptors (to attack their ordnance ships). Take 3 attack ships. Fly them all together and fly them strategically. Have the ordnance ships go wide and try to sneak around the furball. Have the Interceptors (and I mean things like A-wings, Tie Interceptors, or even just standard Tie Fighters) go after their ordnance to create a bit furball. Send your attack ships to either attack the furball or go for their main ship. If you have a small squad of torpedo carriers make it through and do a run on an epic ship, it can really wreck them. Also....to me at least, it's really more fun when you run things like that. This can work on both sides. If you are Imperials, you can send a few Bombers wide on the side that you think the CR-90 is going to go. Or....as Rebels, send your Y-wings on the side you aren't going to go. That way you ensure their side is going to be open.

I love this every time it gets mentioned. Groups of 3-4 fighters are incredibly thematic and gameplay-wise effective. As an Imperial I bring a 3-Defender squad with Manglers against Epic ships. If you think one crit is bad, let's see what happens when an Epic ship takes 3! They're also the more durable fighters the Empire can field, won't die to being one-shotted too often!

My brother and I played Huge v Huge last night. He took the CR90 and I took the Raider; it was his first time using a Huge ship so I didn't 'pimp' it out. I took Engineering Team, a Single Turbolaser in the front, and Quad Laser/Ion Battery in the back.

I also had:

Alpha Squint

Scimitar Tie B w/ Flechette Torps, Ion torps, Ion Pulse Missiles, Prockets

Cmdr. Alozen Tie Adv with X1, AdvTarComp and Ruthlessness

He had the CR90 with 2 quad laser cannons and 1 Ion Battery, Torryn Farr, Gunnery Team and Slicer Tools

B Wing Dagger with Accuracy Corrector and Proton Torps

Dutch with Proton Torps R5K6

Tala Squadron Z95

I thought the CR90 did very well. We ended the game after about 10 turns (he had to go home), with B Wing destroyed, Tie-Int destroyed and Fore Section of Raider crippled. That being said, I did not play a very good game.

I think it's also worth noting that, despite playing on a 5' x 4' space, the play area felt very cramped with 2 huge ships on it. Nor was it as dynamic as I expected from having 2 huges.

I can amend my previous statement to say the Raider is definitely the more user friendly ship and is effective with a smaller point investment. I should have tossed some turbo lasers on CR-90 but was scared off by the cost. I made two squads and let the opponent choose a side. Was not trying to min/max but create some fun/fluffy squads that were fairly evenly matched without too many abilities to keep track of.

Rebels had initiative but simultaneous fire rule mitigated somewhat. Ties and Advanced tussled with the entire rebel fighter screen while interceptors flanked. Green dice were kind to the Ties. By focusing on the B-wings first, I was able to burn them down while I lost all four Ties and both Tempests. Interceptors took too long to get in but arriving fresh helped to remove Luke. Miranda was caught without shields which my opponent had burnt away to kill off my Tempests (hot green dice would not let him regenerate shields) Vader rolled into tickling distance and rolled blank,hit,crit. ATC and emperor made that hit,crit,crit,crit and bye-bye Miranda. CR-90 blasted Vader but next turn, I pulled a 4 straight with Raider to give up positioning but steam-rolled two full health A-wings.

Game ended with a full health A-wing and Royal Guard Interceptor and two corvettes. Aft section of CR-90 was nearly crippled and Raider was in nearly full health but with zero energy. Might have been somewhat close at the finish but game was called on account of children.

Plusses:

1. Felt like a real fleet action! I absolutely adored the furball that occurred in the middle of the table as flankers flanked and huge ships lumbered into range. Will definitely attempt more epic games.

2. Game time was only 2 hours. Maybe another 20-30 minutes if we played to the bloody end.

Minuses:

1. Set-up and clean-up is time consuming. But really, it's playing with little plastic spaceships so...

2. CR-90 requires so many points to be truly effective and some very careful piloting.

I know this is the rare thought but apparently I'm not alone

I would love it if we'd limit squads to 4 ships of a giving type with a couple exceptions. TIE L/n up to 8 (they are the true spam list); Large ships one each type;

That would be awesome.

I know this is the rare thought but apparently I'm not alone

I would love it if we'd limit squads to 4 ships of a giving type with a couple exceptions. TIE L/n up to 8 (they are the true spam list); Large ships one each type;

That would be awesome.

I agree for rebels and imperials. Four IG-2000 has to be a thing. Actually, next epic game we fly might be with 6 ship scum list. Boba, Bossk, and 4 IG's.

I know this is the rare thought but apparently I'm not alone

I would love it if we'd limit squads to 4 ships of a giving type with a couple exceptions. TIE L/n up to 8 (they are the true spam list); Large ships one each type;

That would be awesome.

I agree for rebels and imperials. Four IG-2000 has to be a thing. Actually, next epic game we fly might be with 6 ship scum list. Boba, Bossk, and 4 IG's.

Yeah, 4 x IG-2000 would most likely be an exception also. The Title cards makes this seem a very logical choice.

I feel like it is almost required to bring at least 4 X-wings (TarnR7, and 3 Rook's/Reds) before adding in special/unique pilots, like Etahn, to your list in epic.

B-wings are alright, but that one agility dice is painful, especially because they are big, flashy, and tend to be picked out in a furball. For some reason, it is not the same for Y-wings.

Having a group of generic X-wings (and Tarn cause he is amazing with R7) is the way to go, plenty of health and firepower, and no real special rules to remember, and they are basically 20 points a pop. 1-2 point differences don't matter to much in Epic, unlike 100 point games. It's all about what your buyin', and buyin' 5 health on 2 agility with a decent dial and 3 attack is alright, and you have enough ships with firing arcs that not being able to barrel roll is fine.

I tend to like flying mostly with generics. It adds to the flavor. It speeds up gameplay. You don't have to look out for all the special rules. I think 1-2 specials per side is nice, but otherwise fly generic.

Yeah the list I've made now for 300 points is A slightly less kitted out Raider (with things that actually work on it), Admr. Chirenau, kitted-out Juno and 5 Academy Ties.

Next time I won't get stuck slamming into a wrecked Tantive butt for 4+ turns with the Raider

Yeah the list I've made now for 300 points is A slightly less kitted out Raider (with things that actually work on it), Admr. Chirenau, kitted-out Juno and 5 Academy Ties.

Next time I won't get stuck slamming into a wrecked Tantive butt for 4+ turns with the Raider

Try a bomber with Assault Missiles and Ion Torps in your list too. Also, MOAR TIES xD

Maybe that bomber could be Captain Jonus staying at range one of the Raider, providing sudo-target locks to all of its secondary guns? Hell, howelrunner would work too if you plan on firing off your main gun twice each turn! The reroll generator ships, while adding 40 points to the table, also free up upgrade slots on the raider, as your weapons are more likely to hit without as much assistance anymore. Hmm... those Single Turbo Lasers are looking great now with their innate ability to have a focus be a hit!

Its kinda like the way rebels always want Horton DUTCH with R5K6 and Ion cannon hanging out by the CR90. Or now, Esege Tuketu with Recon Spec, because I am pretty sure that she enables the corvette to use focuses. Its like she is transmitting targeting coord's to them or something using the bombers advanced sights.

Wow... I need a K-wing now if she does indeed enable Huge ships to use her focuses... Can someone confirm that?

Its kinda like the way rebels always want Horton with R5K6 and Ion cannon hanging out by the CR90.

Horton with R5-K6??

Don't you mean Dutch?

Its kinda like the way rebels always want Horton with R5K6 and Ion cannon hanging out by the CR90.

Horton with R5-K6??

Don't you mean Dutch?

This is what I get for not having my cards in-front of me and going off the top of my head...

That is why you need X-wing Companion!

That is why you need X-wing Companion!

Hmmm what is this companion you speak of? Some sort of app??

I hope it's not apple only...

That is why you need X-wing Companion!

Hmmm what is this companion you speak of? Some sort of app??

I hope it's not apple only...

Droid only, in fact.

Yep, X-wing Companion is refreshingly Android only. It's...amazing. It's got all the info you need for every card, kit, and upgrade. You can view it all by faction, type of card, or what blister it comes in. When viewing a card, you get to see dial and all other options. While in that screen, just click on upgrade type to go to the list of all upgrades available. It's just utterly amazing to play around with and figure out upgrade types.

As for various upgrades for the big ships, what do you guys think to use? Before, I would go with Quad Laser on the front of the CR-90 and a Quad plus Single Laser in the back. I felt the back needed the Quad to protect it's flanks when the fighters swarmed. The Quad in front was for the same. Things are different now. We will actually face the Raider and there is the Ion Cannon Battery...which is just viscious. It also has a decent range. So.....?

CR-90

FORE: Ion Cannon Battery

AFT: Single Turbo Laser and Quad Turbo Laser

CREW: I think Sensor Team is fantastic with this ship to get those TL's when in firing range. I'm torn on the other two teams. Will the Raider go straight often enough for the Eng. team? It does have the secondary weapons, but should it get the Gunnery team?

When I look at the Raider, I am not sure if it needs anything in the fore section. The 2 energy for the main cannon will eat up a lot of energy and the R2-4 is pretty good. Still, I can see maybe putting on a Single Turbo Laser on the front to shoot at even range with the CR-90. Just not sure if it's worth the points. (See aft on thoughts of firing arcs as this could change my mind)

When I look at the aft, I'm not really sure on what it can see. How much of it is blocked by the fore? I have no experience with it. With that in mind, I don't know what hardpoints to put on here. If it blocks shots, than maybe an Ion Cannon Battery on the fore? Well, I am thinking a Quad Laser Cannon is probably good as it will be able to target anything getting in close and trying to flank it. These are good taking out small ships. The Ion Cannon Battery should either go in the fore or aft, but not sure which has the better shot.

When it comes to crew, I do know that the Engineering crew will be great. The Raider wants to move forward and it wants energy. I'm not sure on Gunnery team as it will probably use it's energy on the main guns more often.

Thoughts?

Yep, X-wing Companion is refreshingly Android only. It's...amazing. It's got all the info you need for every card, kit, and upgrade. You can view it all by faction, type of card, or what blister it comes in. When viewing a card, you get to see dial and all other options. While in that screen, just click on upgrade type to go to the list of all upgrades available. It's just utterly amazing to play around with and figure out upgrade types.

As for various upgrades for the big ships, what do you guys think to use? Before, I would go with Quad Laser on the front of the CR-90 and a Quad plus Single Laser in the back. I felt the back needed the Quad to protect it's flanks when the fighters swarmed. The Quad in front was for the same. Things are different now. We will actually face the Raider and there is the Ion Cannon Battery...which is just viscious. It also has a decent range. So.....?

CR-90

FORE: Ion Cannon Battery

AFT: Single Turbo Laser and Quad Turbo Laser

CREW: I think Sensor Team is fantastic with this ship to get those TL's when in firing range. I'm torn on the other two teams. Will the Raider go straight often enough for the Eng. team? It does have the secondary weapons, but should it get the Gunnery team?

When I look at the Raider, I am not sure if it needs anything in the fore section. The 2 energy for the main cannon will eat up a lot of energy and the R2-4 is pretty good. Still, I can see maybe putting on a Single Turbo Laser on the front to shoot at even range with the CR-90. Just not sure if it's worth the points. (See aft on thoughts of firing arcs as this could change my mind)

When I look at the aft, I'm not really sure on what it can see. How much of it is blocked by the fore? I have no experience with it. With that in mind, I don't know what hardpoints to put on here. If it blocks shots, than maybe an Ion Cannon Battery on the fore? Well, I am thinking a Quad Laser Cannon is probably good as it will be able to target anything getting in close and trying to flank it. These are good taking out small ships. The Ion Cannon Battery should either go in the fore or aft, but not sure which has the better shot.

When it comes to crew, I do know that the Engineering crew will be great. The Raider wants to move forward and it wants energy. I'm not sure on Gunnery team as it will probably use it's energy on the main guns more often.

Thoughts?

I am a bit disappointed that they haven't added a new team type. Maybe in order not to force CR90 owners to get a Raider just for the cards? Although they added Ion batteries...

Engineering team and sensor team are most times an auto-include for me, gunnery not so much.