More goodness for the card players of Wings of War WWI.

This time a Bristol Fighter F.2B, Phonix C.1, SAML S.2 and a Rumpler C.IV (You will find this one as a miniature in Series 4 as well )

Salm S.2??? You mean Salmson S2A, right? There wasn't any plane called Salm in the whole war (prove me wrong).

Nice bunch though, Bristol fighter was one of the best 2 seaters of the war. The Salmson had a few planes with twin observer Lewis, a dangerous plane to attack from behind.One of the better french planes even if the recognesance verion of the Breuget was better.

As for the rumpler it was a rather average plane, I prefer the Hannover CLIII or one of the Albatross 2 seaters myself but it was a common plane and we should have the cards for it.

As for the Phonix I only know of their scouts (Phonix DI), I just heard the 2 seater mentioned once or twice but Im sure it fits well too.

Pour Le Merite said:

SAML S.1, and S.2: Societa Aeronautica Meccanica Lombarda (Lombardy region of Italy) developed an acft. based on a license-built Aviatik B.1 frame, powered by a Fiat A.12 inline engine, for recon work (the S.2 had shorter wings, a different rudder, and an A.12bis engine). 660 built by SAML and various subcontractors. Served with Italian air forces in Italy, Albania, and Macedonia during the war, starting in '16; postwar service in East Africa. [_The Complete Encyclopedia of World Aircraft_, p. 795]

Pics: http://www.baha.be/Webpages/Navigator/Photos/MilltaryPics/interbellum/saml_s1_aviatic.htm

Truly a rara avis....

csadn said:

Wow, I never even heard of that plane and all my Aviation books (and wikipedia, google and all my search engines) never even metions it.

It is really an odd choice then. Of course is the game popular in Italy and this must be the only Italian 2 seater but Im rather see a Caparoni bomber instead.

But I stand corrected, Csadn. You know how many of the plane that was made?

Pour Le Merite said:

I had to look it up -- I wasn't too sure about it myself. It doesn't even rate a photo or spec sheet in the source I cited. As to online pics, the link was the only one I could find which didn't set off my anti-malware systems.

Pour Le Merite said:

I think there were other Italian 2-seaters, but I can't think of any at the moment. But then, that's why I have books.... >

Pour Le Merite said:

csadn said:

660 built by SAML and various subcontractors.

Oh, and a good rule of thumb: *NEVER* use phrases like "prove me wrong" when I'm around -- I will take it as a Personal Challenge. :) :)

"SOMEONE IS WRONG ON THE INTERNET!"

csadn said:

Just makes things more interesting. Besides, I want to know.

Really odd that a plane that was produced in such numbers don't appear in any of my (rather large) book collections or even on Wikipedia. Heck, even planes like the Pfalz triplane is there and it was only made a handful of it. Maybe it was really bad or maybe just ugly??? I mean we all heard of the Caparonis and Ansaldos, so it is not because it was italian.

The only thing I could find about SAML whatsoever was that they made cars a long time ago. Not even which cars they made.

But either have Andrea better books than us or they have one saml at some museum. It will be interesting to see it's card.

Thanks for the information anyways.

I wish there was an official webbsite with real info (and game info) about all the planes that they made cards for. Pictures, stats, a little text about which models, who flew them and how they flew. Maybe some extra paint templates for us that likes repainting, and a scenario for each plane. It would be very interesting reading and add some more fun to the game.

Pour Le Merite said:

With respect to them, I think one part of the problem is the Italians didn't keep their records all that well; never mind the ones they had likely were damaged or destroyed in the Second Unpleasantness, which would explain why pics are so hard to come by.

Another part is the manner in which WW1 is taught with the possible one-sentence-reference to Gallipoli, the entire war takes place on The Western Front. Nothing about the Italy-AH frontier (where Rommel made his early rep); nothing about the Transjordan/Palestine front; nothing about East Africa (and how might history have played out if that Zeppelin had made it to von Lettow-Vorbeck?), nothing about Japan (and people wonder *why* they were so hacked off after the War "5/5/3", My Aching A**) heck, *THE ENTIRE EASTERN FRONT* is ignored by most textbooks. So it's no wonder acft. like the SAMLs are reduced to a paragraph in a 1,000-plus-page book.

That said: There *are* Those Of Us [ahem ] who are trying to rectify this....

csadn said:

That might be the answer of course. There is also not much movies or series in WW1 that are not in the western front. The only movie in the middle east about that period I seen is Lawrence of Arabia and the only one about Italy is the animated japanese movie "Porco rosso" that have some part of it in the war but the rest after.

No movies and books means that people wont see them and get interested about it.

But my largest book about WW1 have actually a lot about the eastern front. Russia, italy, austria and even Serbia have a lot about it. Unfortunatly is it rather thin on aviation. And, yes, it doesn't mention anything about japan whatsoever. It have a rather large chapter of east africa however.

Still, I have a lot of information about some italian planes, like the Ansaldo AI and SV5A. So I still think it is a little strange that I have nothing whatsoever of the SALM. Of course are scouts a lot more popular than fighters so maybe it is that fact together with the total domination of material and popularity of the western front.

Maybe I should let our next campaign be on the eastern front instead of the western. It is unfortunatly not that many models out there.

Skytrex have Ansaldo AI and Aviatik/Berg DI. Reviresco have the Hansa-Brandenburgh W29. Together with the german and french planes they used it is enough for a campaign (together with the Hansa Brandenburgh CI (UFAG) that Wow already made).

I wish we were using 1/72 instead, there are so many planes for that scale ( Here is a few ) but I just don't have the room to store all the planes.

And don't get me wrong here, I think it is wonderful that Wow adds planes from all the fronts, I am just surprise tht they add a plane I never even heard of instead quite a few common planes that are known as great planes from those fronts. So far have they just made a Austrian 2 seater even if the Aviatik/Berg DI is on the way as a model. But the Ansaldo AI should really be there too, it was a great plane. And the not-so-great Hansa Brandenburgh DI (but the Aviatik should be made before that, I agree with Andrea there).

Pour Le Merite said:

*I* don't. Space is limited around here; the bigger the mini, the less playing space available a SPAD would be essentially useless.

csadn said:

I actually said I didn't have the room either.. unfortunatly for me did I check out 1/72 a bit too much and have to solve it some way now. With a new bookshelf and possibly a new table I should be able to work it out... But lets discuss that in another thread.