Thoughts on this?

As I agree with you (that IG-2000 takes the cake), it is also highly dependant on how many points you are playing with in the match. For instance I would argue that Boba with a gunner and predator with guri by his side might work better for me in a 100 point match. It also depends on who you are fighting.

As far as the Hounds Tooth goes, I am eager to see how well it will do in standard 100 point games, and have very high expectations for higher point games. The 180 arc and second ship are some of the coolest ideas to come out in a while!

Finally for the JumpMaster-5000 I am incredibly underwhelmed with what we have seen so far, and will likely only make the purchase to get the Boba crew card.

These are my opinions anyway!

I'm not sure I agree that the Aggressor is difficult to fly, but its also the scum ship I've played with the most, so thats probably coloring my perspective quite a bit. Its certainly the most slippery of the scum ships that are currently available, and not as fragile as the 4 hull/4 shields makes it appear thanks to the 3 agility and ability to take autothrusters. I think its biggest failing is that it was built to operate the best with another Aggressor, which really limits it when it comes to list building. The Bounty Bros list seems to be doing pretty well for people, but I don't hear much about anyone using an Aggressor out side of those two lists.

The YV-666 is too early to form a sweeping opinion over. It does have great stats, and its maneuver dial is not nearly as terrible as FFG made it out to be, but its also a big and fairly slow ship with only 1 agility. Its going to get hit. A lot. I would kind of love to see someone run 2 Trandoshan Slavers with Outlaw Techs and Xizor with Virago, Sensor Jammer, and Autothrusters. If you can manage to keep them close together, Xizor would be a real pain to kill.

I really want to love the Firespray, but I haven't gotten it to work well for me yet. I desperately wish its Hull and Shield values were switched.

I don't think any kind of judgement about the Jumpmaster 5000 can be made until we see the movement dial. Not to mention you didn't include that its the only one of the four that can take an astromech. Also, you didn't mention that it can barrel roll, which is a huuuuuuge advantage on large ships. With EU, unhinged astromech, and PTL, it's likely that it'll slip arcs even more effectively than Super Dash. Throw a K4 on there too for good measure, and you're also getting the same level of action economy as Super Dash. AND Dengar is the only Scum large ship with PS9. I wouldn't be surprised if we end up seeing a Fat Dengar build with the title, EU, unhinged astro, PTL, Cloaking Device or Glitterstim, and K4. Even works out to 58pts, same as Super Dash without the range 1 hole.

^ Good points on the Punishing One. I think that the maneuver dial isn't as important for that ship, as it has a turret (though I know maneuvering is still relevant for Dengar's ability and for Autothrusters on opposing ships).

First you have the stats wrong for the IG2000 it's 3/3/4/4. If it had 6 hull and shields it would be OP. The Jumpmaster is going to be an interesting ship because it will have a astromech and crew slot. which is going to be a lot of fun to play with. I think about the unhinged astromech and the K-4 security droid as a fun combo. The dial for that ship is going to be the weirdest because it's asymmetrical dial. I wonder if it has a 3 right S-loop, if it does then the unhinged would make that a green maneuver. Too much unknowns with that ship, but I'm looking forward to giving it a spin.

I think the IG2000 is going to take the top spot, but I like the firespray for the second spot, then the Hounds tooth. The jump master I will just have to wait and see. The hounds tooth is a close third.

We have to see the dial, but the jump master with the title (45 points) is closer to YT's. Same actions than Dash (45 points too with title and mangler) and most options to be modified. Han (46 points naked) wins in hull & shield (3+1) but agility 1.

I wouldn't be surprised if we end up seeing a Fat Dengar build with the title, EU, unhinged astro, PTL, Cloaking Device or Glitterstim, and K4. Even works out to 58pts, same as Super Dash without the range 1 hole.

[Needa] No ship that large has a cloaking device![/Needa]

(It's small ship only. Thank god)

Inertial Dampeners might help make for an unpredictable Super-Dengar, too.

That is an extremely difficult question, you can't just easily compare, especially not with the variables you set.

Assume the Agressor uses the title, so you are using at least two and are sharing abilities of the ship, but you're not specifying which abilities. B gives an inbuilt Gunner and C gives you extra maneuver options.

Assume the Punishing One is using the title, but why? Maybe the 12 points are better spent elsewhere making it a better ship (or get a whole new ship in the bargain).

Lats Razzi is in a vacuum a much less useful ship than when you build a list that makes full use of his abilities.

The Hound's Tooth needs to spend extra points to get a ship into play once it is destroyed, which is powerful sure, but it does make it more expensive, maybe those 6 points could also be spent to make a difference earlier in the game.

If you're spending at least 72 squad points on two Aggressors you'd need to spend about that much on each of the other large ships to be able to make it a fair comparison I think.

66 points of Boba Fett or Bossk would make life very difficult for even two IG's.

Thoughts on this?

YOU WROGN PUNISHING 1 3 PWT SO OP

Okay enough jokes. But yes I actually think the Firespray will be the big loser in this category.

Here is the reason Arc Dodgers, they kill anything without a turret don't matter what your stats are, if you can't shoot out of arc just fly off the table edge. So here is my ratings from lowest power to highest power.

1. Firespray-31. Every time I flew this or against it or saw someone else fly it it there is always one small ship that pulls up to the side and hammers it. The extra firing arc while nice it still doesn't provide all the protection. A PTL Soontir can easily get in on the sides and kill it.
2. YV-666 Okay so this is tricky because I haven't seen the 180 aux arc in action however I agree what Major juggler said is that 180 arc is better than rear firing arc because it is a wider unbroken area. If a ship is caught in front of a Friespray front or rear arc it has less of a distance to travel in position correction actions than a ship caught in front of a YV-666.
3. IG-2000 Agressor This only has one firing arc but it works so well as an arc dodger that it actually outperforms ships with multiple firing arcs. The s-loops and K-turns help it position into safe areas where it can boost out of trouble and the double cannon shots pack a serious punch.
4. Jumpmaster Sure the raw stats are not as good as the other ships but you will never see the Jumpmaster without the title. Sure 2 firepower is weak for a PWT but you don't see the 2 firepower dragging Dash down now do you? Since the Punishing One title comes with the Jumpmaster you can count on players using the Jumpmaster always throwing 12 point into it just for the firepower boost. Now there probably won't be 2 Jumpmasters as 2 firepower PWT really does suck. Also the dial is something to be in consideration of as well. Time to wait and see.

1. Jumpmaster Sure the raw stats are not as good as the other ships but you will never see the Jumpmaster without the title.

That's a rather bold (and limiting) statement for a ship where you don't know what the astromechs for instance will do. 12 points is a whole **** lot of points.

I can only really speak to the IG and YV, but they are very close. The IG is slick and squirrely, while the YV is slow(er) and punchy. The IG is meant to evade hits forever, while the YV is built to die after dishing out a pile of damage. I should fly these guys together, kitted out, so the IG can watch the YV's gigantic rear blind spot. When I lose the YV, it's because some small ship punk slipped in behind and I can't shake him- by that time, though, Bossk has usually shredded a wingman or three.

Dengar with Veteran Instincts, Punishing One, K-4, Unhinged and Engine Upgrade will be a monster. PS11 3-dice turret with boost, barrel roll, (likely) lots of green and free target locks? It'll lose against other fat turrets, but swarms and arc dodgers really have no chance. 54 points really isn't too bad, and for another fire or six you can add, say, a pair of Plasma or Proton Torpedos to deal with those other turret ships. I kind of want to try this list:

Dengar

- Veteran Instincts

- Punishing One

- K-4 Security Droid

- Engine Upgrade

Black Sun Soldier

Black Sun Soldier

Cartel Marauder

Arc-dodgy primary turret, slighly swarmy and pretty tough support, 22 hit points total.

Arc-dodging autothrusters have nothing to fear from the counterattack ability.

As long as you can manage to keep out of his arc his ability will be negated.

He will loathe ions.

You can't rank them this way. Even if you knew how efficient each ship was that wouldn't help, since (a) they all have different firing arcs, and (b) one of the dials is probably a long time from being public.

Okay enough jokes. But yes I actually think the Firespray will be the big loser in this category.

Here is the reason Arc Dodgers, they kill anything without a turret don't matter what your stats are, if you can't shoot out of arc just fly off the table edge. So here is my ratings from lowest power to highest power.

1. Jumpmaster Sure the raw stats are not as good as the other ships but you will never see the Jumpmaster without the title.

That's a rather bold (and limiting) statement for a ship where you don't know what the astromechs for instance will do. 12 points is a whole **** lot of points.

I think the only time someone's going to fly the Jumpmaster without the title is on the generic pilots (which might be close to the ORS or WSF in terms of costs). The problem is, almost no-one flies 2 red dice PWT in a competitive setting (Eaden Vrill with a cannon but without Outrider notwithstanding, he's not really a 2 red dice PWT).

The PTL + Agromech combo might be bonkers though, one of 58-point Dash's problems is it's easy to predict/block him.

Okay enough jokes. But yes I actually think the Firespray will be the big loser in this category.

Here is the reason Arc Dodgers, they kill anything without a turret don't matter what your stats are, if you can't shoot out of arc just fly off the table edge. So here is my ratings from lowest power to highest power.

VI Engine Upgrade Boba says hi.

thats no guarantee to succeed, Asteroids or otherships can stop that large base from Boosting.

Punishing One is not an auto-include on anyone (because we don't know **** about anyone else) except Dengar (ability)

the pogostick, however, is tailormade to fart out torpedoes and it seems they'll be cheap (dengar is cheaper than bossk, cheaper than a generic firespray!)

1. Deadeye (even the generic as an ept slot)

2. Torpedo of choice in one slot, munis in the other

3. Recon Specialist in crew slot, unless using proton torps

4. R4 in salvaged slot

So, let's say we take the cheap plasma torp. It + munis + deadeye come out to 6 points, with recon + r4 being useful long after the ordnance is spent.

Let's say the pogostick moves (such as after the spoiled white segnor's loop) and then focuses, then fires torps.

1. Spend 1 focus (Deadeye) to enable torps, gain target-lock

2. You can spend both the target-lock AND the remaining focus on the torpedo, for a fully modified 4-dice shot. Reacquire TL if focus is spent.

so true, it's ordnance but it's also a fully modified 4-dice attack coming out of a generic pilot.

you can use the same Recon + R4 combo with Punishing One (and I'd assume it'd be legit on Dengar) but the title is double the points of plasma + munis + deadeye

Good point! With the generic costing 27 points (possibly less), Deadeye, Plasma Torpedo, Extra Munitions (when you say 'munis', this is what you mean, right? Could be Munitions Failsafe), Recon Specialist and R4 Agromech the total comes out to 38, which is pretty decent.

munis is extra munitions yes

38 points strikes me as very competitive for a projected cost. That keeps it up there with the HLC + Int Agent Fringer, only less shenanigans but far more consistent in exchanges of dice

after the torps are spent, a 2-dice PWT is still 2-dice, but at full mods it is not so easily ignored (especially not at range one)

1. Jumpmaster Sure the raw stats are not as good as the other ships but you will never see the Jumpmaster without the title.

That's a rather bold (and limiting) statement for a ship where you don't know what the astromechs for instance will do. 12 points is a whole **** lot of points.

Okay how often do you see dash without the outrider title. Sure people try it but later they just go back to trusty mangler or donuts dash. Quite simple 2 PWT are mediocre in power (even more so with autothrusters out) and you spend way to many points into them. Now yeah we don't know what the pilots abilities will be (I don't thin the astromech are anything to worry about) there could be a pilot that works like Edrin Virl where it is better to leave off the title but for large ship PWTs it is a bargain to spend 12 point to go from powerless 2 to meta defining 3. Also bold statements can be made rather easily, especially when the meta is so limiting.

1. Jumpmaster Sure the raw stats are not as good as the other ships but you will never see the Jumpmaster without the title.

That's a rather bold (and limiting) statement for a ship where you don't know what the astromechs for instance will do. 12 points is a whole **** lot of points.

Okay how often do you see dash without the outrider title. Sure people try it but later they just go back to trusty mangler or donuts dash. Quite simple 2 PWT are mediocre in power (even more so with autothrusters out) and you spend way to many points into them. Now yeah we don't know what the pilots abilities will be (I don't thin the astromech are anything to worry about) there could be a pilot that works like Edrin Virl where it is better to leave off the title but for large ship PWTs it is a bargain to spend 12 point to go from powerless 2 to meta defining 3. Also bold statements can be made rather easily, especially when the meta is so limiting.

considering the incredible amount of differences between the YT-2400 and the pogostick, it is a bold statement. Sure, they seem very similar (2-die PWT, roll, similar statline) but we still don't have the diluge of upgrades coming in Wave 8 (there's something like 5-6 crew cards, a lot of which are probably scum only), nor the other named pilots, nor even the dial.

From what we do know, however:

The abilities of Outrider V Punishing one are completely different, at equal costs (HLC + Outrider = Punishing One) Outrider brings the PWT up to +2 dice (and range 3 negation) to the Punishing's +1 at the cost of doughnut hole, which Dash's ability is just set-up to mitigate (obstacles, *******!)

Dengar is at slightly similar (take ze title on him, it is made for his ability) but ridiculously different. He dares you to shoot at him (if he's got his arc on you) whereas Dash really doesn't like it. Problem there is, Dengar's getting shot while Dash is doing his darnedest not to (and with his ability, it's pretty easy to abuse the maneuverability of the YT-2400). With the current lack (and, for all we know, continuing lack) of guaranteed defense for scum, getting shot isn't exactly the pogostick's strongpoint and at 45 points Dengar's not the most cost efficient ship out there.

Plus, as said before, the Pogostick's upgrade bar is just silly unique. It'll be a boat torp easily with the options we already have available. Hell, with deadeye + recon + plasma + r4, the generic is trading equal damage with Super Dash (a bit more because of the Plasma Torp ability, if shields are up)

So true, 2-dice PWT are garbage. This fact is less important while the ship in question has the means to transcend 2-dice PWT status (cannon possibly with outrider for YT-2400, mines + advanced SLAM or TLT Miranda for Ks, and either title or torpedoes for the pogostick). The pogostick has its title and its upgrade bar to do so, it need not be limited to just one (except Dengar)

I've heard that IG-2000 is almost like its own faction. Having seen that few people, if anyone, use only one IG-2000, I'm inclined to agree.

I've heard that IG-2000 is almost like its own faction. Having seen that few people, if anyone, use only one IG-2000, I'm inclined to agree.

IG/Firespray is A Thing. Running something like VI Boba helps cover the Aggressor's Achilles heel - that it's a point-and-shoot ship that maxes out at PS 8.