Hey there i just went through the epic rules as i ordered my first epic ship yesterday and the following question occured:

If i have the Raider equipped with a ion cannon battery, does the whole energylimit for this ship go up to a total of 8?

This is an extraction of the rules:

Energy

Huge ships can gain energy, which they can spend to perform
special actions and trigger effects. For each point of energy that
a huge ship gains, place one energy token on the Ship card. For
each point of energy a huge ship spends, remove one energy
token from the Ship card and return it to the token supply.

The maximum number of energy tokens that a card can
have at any time is its energy limit. A ship’s energy limit
can be increased with certain upgrade cards. If at any time
a card has a number of energy tokens that exceeds its
energy limit, immediately return the excess energy tokens
to the token supply.

Energy tokens remain on cards until removed by an effect.

Energy Steps in the Activation Phase

To gain and spend energy, huge ships resolves two additional steps during the
Activation phase. These steps occur between the “Clean Up” and “Perform
Action” steps, and they occur in the following order:

1. Gain Energy: The huge ship gains a number of energy
tokens equal to the number of energy icons shown on
the chosen maneuver on the maneuver dial (below the
speed number).

2. Allocate Energy: The huge ship’s controlling player may remove
energy tokens from his Ship card and place them on any cards with
an energy limit that are equipped to this ship. He cannot place energy
tokens on a card in excess of its energy limit.

3. Use Energy: The huge ship may use one or more of its Upgrade
cards or Damage cards with the “Energy:” header. Each card with this
header can be used only once per round.

The red parts made me think whether the ships total limit remains 6 or the "Aft"-card´s limit is 6 plus 2 on the cannon.

i understand this like follows:

1. if my aft card has 4 energy at the beginning of the activation phase and i do a manouver that gives me 3, then i would only get 2 up to the total of 6.

this 6 can then be allocated on hardpoints or other upgrades.

2. but if i chose to put 2 of the 4 energy onto the ion cannon battery last round, i´d have 2 on the cannon and 2 on the aft section. now recieving 3 i will be at 5 on the aft.

ist that right? or will i only get 1 energy in the second scenario?

I believe so yes. The limit is on the card(s) itself.

You have it correct: The ship gets energy (no more than its maximum)

THEN you get to move it.

I swear ion betteries dealt 2 tokens when first teased.

Nah, but you can equip 3 of them, so you can still stick it to your pancake of choice by focusing fire.

Energy is confusing at first but it is easily explainable.

So just to let you know for those that got the rebel packs in competitive and standard epic you start with the energy limit on your ship card.

1. So first step is to gain the amount energy shown on the selected maneuver on the maneuver dial. Discard 1 energy token for any ion token you have place on your ship card and if you have more than your allotted energy limit discard tokens till you reach the limit.
2. Next is to assign energy thus move energy tokens from your ship card to your equipped upgrade cards that have an energy capacity i'm charging mah turbolazor (note that these card never start with any energy tokens)
3. When you spend energy using an upgrade with an energy capacity spend energy from that upgrade card only. You cannot spend energy from your ship card to use an upgrade that has an energy capacity. Upgrades without an energy capacity and ship card abilities may spend energy from the ship card.

So with upgrades that have energy capacity such as ion cannon battery it is possible to have more than 4 energy tokens ready. (4 tokens on the ship card and 2 on the ion cannon battery). Using your ability to make 2 attacks with your primary weapon would spend energy from your ship card while making an attack with the ion cannon battery will spend energy tokens from the ion battery upgrade card. Also note that upgrade cards don't increase the energy capacity on the ship card with the exception of the GR-75 titles, that also have a +sign next to the purple number that denotes energy.

Just to check: Ion tokens degrade your ability to earn energy, or do they steal energy out of your reserves as well? If out of the reserves, does that include your gun reserves, etc?

I've had a fair understanding of the general idea, but the ion bit has never actually come up and I just realised I should double-check...

Just to check: Ion tokens degrade your ability to earn energy, or do they steal energy out of your reserves as well? If out of the reserves, does that include your gun reserves, etc?

I've had a fair understanding of the general idea, but the ion bit has never actually come up and I just realised I should double-check...

That is true, though I find the mechanic sort of awkward that if you end up with 3 or more Ion tokens you can pretty much go speed 4 straight without penalty as you discard all ion tokens after the gain energy step.

IMHO i think it would have been more thematic if you had more ion tokens than energy shown on the dial you perform a 1 straight maneuver then discard all ion tokens after the gain energy step. Might be a good house rule.

so you start with full energy on the shipcard... and wont get any energy in the first round due to the fact that allocating energy step is after gaining energy?

so you start with full energy on the shipcard... and wont get any energy in the first round due to the fact that allocating energy step is after gaining energy?

Actually no. Well sort of...

Q: Do huge ships begin missions with energy?

A: Unless specified by a specific mission, huge ships begin each mission with no energy. In the Epic Dogfight and Team Epic tournament formats, each huge ship begins the match with energy on its ship card up to its energy limit.

A lot of people play only by the tournament rules though.

Energy is confusing at first but it is easily explainable.

So just to let you know for those that got the rebel packs in competitive and standard epic you start with the energy limit on your ship card.

Q: Do huge ships begin missions with energy?

A: Unless specified by a specific mission, huge ships begin each mission with no energy. In the Epic Dogfight and Team Epic tournament formats, each huge ship begins the match with energy on its ship card up to its energy limit.

A lot of people play only by the tournament rules though.

well you forgot that this is under the header MISSIONS

so if you play a mission -->0 Energy at the beginning

playing epic dogfight or team epic ---> full energy at the beginning (which seems wasted in the first turn)

so you start with full energy on the shipcard... and wont get any energy in the first round due to the fact that allocating energy step is after gaining energy?

Correct ...... sort of ......the latest FAQ says that it's only the competitive (i.e epic tournament) rules that specify your ships start with full energy - standard rules still say you start with zero (FAQ page 16).

However as it's a whole bunch more fun to start with something in the tank, and because a lot of people play with tournament rules as a matter of course, I expect most people are going to adopt this as standard.

Edit - Ninjaed by Ken, corrected by Taiowaa - before I'd even hit the Post button

However there is something I just noticed in the Tournament rules that I didn't realise:

Players assign Energy tokens to each of their Huge ships and their equipped secondary weapons up to their respective energy limits.

Epic Tournament Rules page 3.

Is the bit that I've bolded new ?

Well in the tournament rules from:

it only sais:

edit::

the epic rules in the latest FAQ news still has the old version of it so your right but only for EPIC DOGFIGHT:

Team epic is still energy on ship only!

However FFG only seems to differentiate between tournament and mission play. there actually no tules for casual epic play!

Well in the tournament rules from:

it only sais:

Where are you getting that version from?

I'm going to the Tournament resources section of the X-Wing products page and still getting V 3.1

Tried clearing browser cache but still getting the same thing

Well in the tournament rules from:

it only sais:

Where are you getting that version from?

I'm going to the Tournament resources section of the X-Wing products page and still getting V 3.1

Tried clearing browser cache but still getting the same thing

Hang on - mine is the more recent version - Derp! (@myself)

so you start with full energy on the shipcard... and wont get any energy in the first round due to the fact that allocating energy step is after gaining energy?

If you are not playing the mission scenarios in the booklet aka epic standard and epic competitive format then yes. But as for the missions found in the rule booklet you start out with 0.

True that the first turn energy gain doesn't give you any energy which is not that bad of a thing as it allows for the first turn to do a 4 straight without worrying about being behind in the energy gain. The second turn you will see the 1 and 2 to regain energy that was used to charge upgrade cards. It gives the huge ships a boost so they can get to the game faster. In standard play often combat happens the second round although if both sides race at 5 it could begin in the first round or it could even be later as players look for positions. In epic format 3 rounds will easily pass and still no combat.

So our consensus is that we have some but not quite all?

Tournaments: Everyone agrees that Huge ships start with full energy on the ship; one has a FAQ that says full energy on all cards.

Missions: Everyone agrees if it doesn't state otherwise you begin with zero.

Casual Epic: Some say start with full energy others say not.

Hmm... something to ponder I suppose.

Full energy including the gun batteries is an interesting thing. You get to go in guns blazing; I can't say this is a bad thing!

Makes those Tantive titles that grant you bonus energy actually an intruging proposition even if only for the extra power banks - it's a wonder the Raider has no bonuses either. I guess it's being factory standard?

That ion only affects recharge, and only for one turn, is an interesting quirk. I guess it's to stop someone slamming your Corvette with four Ion Pulse Missiles and you never seeing energy again...

Does seem a little odd that you can't drain their batteries, though. Didn't ion cannons knock out an SD for a while? Isn't that kind of the point? Hm.

So our consensus is that we have some but not quite all?

Tournaments: Everyone agrees that Huge ships start with full energy on the ship; one has a FAQ that says full energy on all cards.

Missions: Everyone agrees if it doesn't state otherwise you begin with zero.

Casual Epic: Some say start with full energy others say not.

Hmm... something to ponder I suppose.

Casual epic also known as Epic Standard has huge ships start with the energy printed on the ship card.

In the past huge ships all started with 0 energy (along with range 4 giving out 2 green dice and range 5 giving out 3 green dice). FFG changed this because it really hurt huge ships and was forcing them to start the first 3 turns slow rolling to charge up on energy making it take longer for the first round of actual combat.

The gun batteries is the one thing that isn't charged. You should have no problem filling them out in the first turn then the second turn will replenish the energy you allocated.

As for energy bonuses only the GR-75 have titles that give an energy bonus which makes sense. Hardpoints having their own energy capacity allows them to store energy tokens.

I actually find it even more odd that Ion tokens don't make you go 1 straight. Take the CR-90 dial for example. 1 ion token means you will likely chose the 3 straight so you still get an energy token. 2 Ion tokens will make you chose the 2 straight and 3 or more Ion tokens will make you chose 4 as it doesn't matter anymore. As for Ion cannons well the critical effects on the huge ship cards can disable hardpoints and discard energy so that provides the Ion disabling effect you want to see.

Casual epic also known as Epic Standard has huge ships start with the energy printed on the ship card.

I've been looking for where it says that in the FAQs and Huge Ship Rules - doesn't seem to be there - in fact as far as I can tell, the only place where starting energy limits (and squad building) are mentioned at all is the Epic Tournament Rules.

However unlike the standard tournament rules, the Epic Tournaments are described exclusively as casual events - so it seems to be implied that casual rules and tournament rules are synonymous - which would mean that the starting energy allocation for casual play would include both the ship and the secondary weapons at full energy

Casual epic also known as Epic Standard has huge ships start with the energy printed on the ship card.

I've been looking for where it says that in the FAQs and Huge Ship Rules - doesn't seem to be there - in fact as far as I can tell, the only place where starting energy limits (and squad building) are mentioned at all is the Epic Tournament Rules.

However unlike the standard tournament rules, the Epic Tournaments are described exclusively as casual events - so it seems to be implied that casual rules and tournament rules are synonymous - which would mean that the starting energy allocation for casual play would include both the ship and the secondary weapons at full energy

It is actually in the main FAQ on pg 16 under missions. Now it mentions that in Epic Tournament and Epic Dogfight (which I had been calling it Epic Standard incorrectly) each huge ships begins with the energy tokens printed on the energy limits. However for missions unless it states otherwise huge ships start with 0 energy.

Now why this isn't added to say the Huge Ship rules or Epic tournament rules that is a good question. But it is there.

To get everything clear now:

X-Wing FAQ VERSION 3.02/ UPDATED 3.27.2015 Page 16

Missions

Q: Do huge ships begin missions with energy?
A: Unless specified by a specific mission, huge ships begin each mission with no
energy. In the Epic Dogfight and Team Epic tournament formats, each huge
ship begins the match with energy on its ship card up to its energy limit.

X-Wing Epic Play Tournament Rules VERSION 3.1/ UPDATED 7.21.2015 Page 1

All tournaments supported by the Organized Play program for the Star
Wars: X-Wing™ Miniatures Game, sponsored by Fantasy Flight
Games (“FFG”) and its international partners, follow rules provided herein.
The beginning of this document provides an overview of player conduct and
general rules that apply to all events. Following are the official Epic Dogfight
and Team Epic tournament rules.
All X-Wing Epic tournaments are casual-level tournaments. All competitive
and premier X-Wing tournaments must be run as Dogfight tournaments.

Epic Dogfight Squad Deployment Procedure Page 2-3

...

8. Players assign Energy tokens to each of their Huge ships and their
equipped secondary weapons up to their respective energy limits.

Team Epic Squad Deployment Procedure Page 4

...

7. Players assign Energy tokens to each of their Huge ships up to its
energy limit.

So due to stating that tournaments are casual level i see it as follows:

Missions: unless otherwise stated ---> 0 Energy

Epic dogfight: independend of playing casual with friends or in a tournament ---> max energy on shipcard and hardpoints

Team epic: as long as playing as a team independend of playing casual with friends or in a tournament ---> max energy only on shipcard

and now the next question is coming up

The raider as well as the tantive has 2 shipcards. For the sake of energy do they count as 1 or do i need to allocate energy tokens to the fore section in order to perform for example a recover action to the fore action?

edit:

found it in the huge ship rules

Recover
Ships with the action icon in their action bar may perform the recover
action. To do so, remove all energy tokens from the corresponding Ship card.
For each energy token removed, that ship recovers one shield. For ships with
multiple Ship cards, for each energy token removed, the ship recovers one
shield on either of its section. A huge ship cannot exceed a ship card’s shield
value with a recover action.

It is actually in the main FAQ on pg 16 under missions. Now it mentions that in Epic Tournament and Epic Dogfight (which I had been calling it Epic Standard incorrectly) each huge ships begins with the energy tokens printed on the energy limits. However for missions unless it states otherwise huge ships start with 0 energy.

Now why this isn't added to say the Huge Ship rules or Epic tournament rules that is a good question. But it is there.

it's a little contradictory isn't it

FAQ says:

Q: Do huge ships begin missions with energy?

A: Unless specified by a specific mission, huge ships begin each mission with no energy. In the Epic Dogfight and Team Epic tournament formats, each huge ship begins the match with energy on its ship card up to its energy limit.

Epic Tournament rules say:

(Epic dogfight rules)

Players assign Energy tokens to each of their Huge ships and their equipped secondary weapons up to their respective energy limits.

(Epic Team rules)

Players assign Energy tokens to each of their Huge ships up to its energy limit

Although the current FAQ was updated slightly more recently than the Epic Tournament Rules, we're only talking a space of 3 days, so I'd be inclined to consider the Tourney rules as definitive on this matter - not the FAQ.

Probably time for a dedicated FAQ just for Epic and a slightly more coordinated approach to updates across the formats.

This is most confusing. What do I do when I'm playing a one-off epic game with a couple of friends on each side then? Does it matter if one person is controlling all 300 points or if more than one are?

I've only played one game with my blockade runner and it was casual like this and I started it with no energy.

This is most confusing. What do I do when I'm playing a one-off epic game with a couple of friends on each side then? Does it matter if one person is controlling all 300 points or if more than one are?

I've only played one game with my blockade runner and it was casual like this and I started it with no energy.

Squad building rules for Team are slightly different to Dogfight - less squad points per player but greater squad points overall per team - less Epic points per player but more overall per team - different caps on ship numbers, less per player, more per team.

I guess they feel that different energy rules keep things balanced