Paraphrasing the rules for detonating mines "the ship that the mine detonates on rolls X red dice".

And based on paraphrase of Emperor Palpatine's card: "Change a Friendly ship's die result"

Obviously, this means I cannot use Palpatine to turn a Prox Mine blank into a crit when an opponent's ship detonates the mine, since it is not a friendly ship's dice result.

But I wish it were the other way around.

My request to FFG:

PLEASE let the mine's owner roll dice for Prox/Cluster mine, and please consider it a friendly ship's dice result so Palpatine can modify it offensively. As of right now, the defending player can modify hits to blanks, which makes mines slightly less effective, and I don't like it!

I just want mines to be a major part of the game, and letting the mine's owner use Palpatine will give players a chance to modify the dice with an 8 pt double crew investment.

EVEN though the ruling is completely left field of current detonation rulings and what not. I would request that a major rule change be put in place.

Maybe "the ship that places the Proximity Mine rolls 3 red dice, dealing hits and crits to ship the mine detonated on".

This way, Palpatine can act on them in an offensive way, rather than defensive.

The ONLY problem I can think of is when multiple ship's and players are using mines, the un-detonated tokens will have to be kept track of. Not a HUGE deal, biut one

As of right now, the defending player can modify hits to blanks

Through what means???

As of right now, the defending player can modify hits to blanks

Through what means???

Palpatine lets you change any die roll of a friendly ship once per round, no matter what it's for. Attack, defence, asteroids, damage cards, and proxy mines would all be quite legal targets.

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

You really think that for 8pts and 2 crew slots that changing a single die once per turn is OP?

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

You really think that for 8pts and 2 crew slots that changing a single die once per turn is OP?

I mean, come on... It's not like it's granting a guaranteed evade every round for 3 points and one crew slot... That would be OP...

I think he's in the right place right now, but letting that ability effect enemy rolls would be too much

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

You really think that for 8pts and 2 crew slots that changing a single die once per turn is OP?

I mean, come on... It's not like it's granting a guaranteed evade every round for 3 points and one crew slot... That would be OP...

To be fair, 3P0 doesn't grant an evade each round. He grants 5/8ths of an evade each round for 3 points and a crew slot. He's really really good, but people forget that almost half the time, the dice will roll an evade anyway.

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

You really think that for 8pts and 2 crew slots that changing a single die once per turn is OP?

I mean, come on... It's not like it's granting a guaranteed evade every round for 3 points and one crew slot... That would be OP...

To be fair, 3P0 doesn't grant an evade each round. He grants 5/8ths of an evade each round for 3 points and a crew slot. He's really really good, but people forget that almost half the time, the dice will roll an evade anyway.

To be fair, I said it grants a "guaranteed evade", not that it just granted an evade... My real point was I've seen a few mathwing lists that show 3P0 is undercosted by several points... By comparison, Palpatine is very fairly costed, imo...

Fairly costed as is, not allowing him to mod defenders rolls too.

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

You really think that for 8pts and 2 crew slots that changing a single die once per turn is OP?

I mean, come on... It's not like it's granting a guaranteed evade every round for 3 points and one crew slot... That would be OP...

To be fair, 3P0 doesn't grant an evade each round. He grants 5/8ths of an evade each round for 3 points and a crew slot. He's really really good, but people forget that almost half the time, the dice will roll an evade anyway.

To be fair, I said it grants a "guaranteed evade", not that it just granted an evade... My real point was I've seen a few mathwing lists that show 3P0 is undercosted by several points... By comparison, Palpatine is very fairly costed, imo...

3P0 costs $80, so id say its fair.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean DR4CO, Proxy mines aren't legal targets for Palp, if they are your proxy mines. That's what OP is asking. I will echo Howie's question again, HOW can the defending player modify the proxy mine dice again?

I would plead with FFG to the contrary however. PLEASE DO NOT change the die roll to the owner of the mine. Palpatine has a ton of great offensive and defensive capabilities as is. He, in no way, needs to be pumped up.

So, his ability isnt op enough we need it for mine attacks now?

You really think that for 8pts and 2 crew slots that changing a single die once per turn is OP?

I mean, come on... It's not like it's granting a guaranteed evade every round for 3 points and one crew slot... That would be OP...

To be fair, 3P0 doesn't grant an evade each round. He grants 5/8ths of an evade each round for 3 points and a crew slot. He's really really good, but people forget that almost half the time, the dice will roll an evade anyway.

To be fair, I said it grants a "guaranteed evade", not that it just granted an evade... My real point was I've seen a few mathwing lists that show 3P0 is undercosted by several points... By comparison, Palpatine is very fairly costed, imo...

3P0 costs $80

My real point was I've seen a few mathwing lists that show 3P0 is undercosted by several points.

Remember that every mathematical model has limitations and imbedded assumptions. When those limits are pushed, garbage in equals garbage out.

My real point was I've seen a few mathwing lists that show 3P0 is undercosted by several points.

If C-3PO is under-costed, like you claim that a few "Mathwing" lists show, then why do I rarely ever see him as a crew member on a Blue Squadron B-Wing?

Remember that every mathematical model has limitations and imbedded assumptions. When those limits are pushed, garbage in equals garbage out.

Probably because you can't get the same mileage out of him on a ship with a bad dial, 8 health, and a 90° firing arc that you can on a ship with a better dial, 13 health, a 2nd crew slot for R2-D2, and a 360° PWT... Also, you don't have as much motivation to protect a 22 point base Blue Squadron as you do a 46 point base Han Falcon...

Breaking down cards into derivatives and applying a linear regression is a pretty safe way of evaluation that doesn't really have the limitations or imbedded assumptions you're suggesting...

So clearly, C-3PO is not worth three points on some ships. Context is everything.

It remains to be seen how useful Palpatine will be at eight points. I don't rate him in a 100 point game. Epic, however...

So clearly, C-3PO is not worth three points on some ships. Context is everything.

It remains to be seen how useful Palpatine will be at eight points. I don't rate him in a 100 point game. Epic, however...

That doesn't change the absolute value of 3P0... To equip him on a Blue Squadron, you have to equip a B-Wing/E2 Mod for a total of 4 points...In reality, it is a Blue Squadron that isn't worth the additional 4 points... Not vice versa... You're basically just telling me over and over "I don't get it..." That's fine, I've accepted that...

It remains to be seen how useful Palpatine will be at eight points. I don't rate him in a 100 point game. Epic, however...

Since mathwinging was mentioned...

Palp can change the result of exacly one dice each turn. The more dice you roll each turn, the less of your your results he is changeing... procetualy speaking.

The more points you have to spend, the more likely it is that you will end up rolling more dice each turn.

Now given touse facts, is it not the case that Palpatine will do less for you in epic play then in regular 100p matches?

This was writen in jest.

Awesome analysis, Smuggler!

I'm not suggesting we modify opponent's dice rolls, I'm suggesting that the red dice for mines be rolled by the ship that places the mine. Pretty much solely so a player can run Palpatine and turn blanks to crits.

I want Prox and Cluster mines to be very competitive. But with absolutely no way to modify the dice, they will feel very unreliable.

Well if you do a K-turn and fly back over the mine, your wish will be granted.

I think the way they are handled at the moment is the fairest way to do it, and the rolls shouldn't be able to be modified.

I'm not suggesting we modify opponent's dice rolls, I'm suggesting that the red dice for mines be rolled by the ship that places the mine. Pretty much solely so a player can run Palpatine and turn blanks to crits.

I want Prox and Cluster mines to be very competitive. But with absolutely no way to modify the dice, they will feel very unreliable.

So, let me get this straight: you want FFG to change the way two perfectly playable cards work, so that they can interact with exactly one other card, which would allow you to spend 8 additional points to guarantee 1 damage?

To say that is not worth the effort is an understatement.

Not to mention, Cluster Mines at 4 points seems pretty worth it for the area denial effect you're creating. It's even more cost effective if you add Extra Munitions.

I'm not suggesting we modify opponent's dice rolls, I'm suggesting that the red dice for mines be rolled by the ship that places the mine. Pretty much solely so a player can run Palpatine and turn blanks to crits.

I want Prox and Cluster mines to be very competitive. But with absolutely no way to modify the dice, they will feel very unreliable.

So, let me get this straight: you want FFG to change the way two perfectly playable cards work, so that they can interact with exactly one other card, which would allow you to spend 8 additional points to guarantee 1 damage?

To say that is not worth the effort is an understatement.

Actually, just the ruling for the "how to use each mine" card, proximity/cluster mine. Change it to say:

"When a proximity/cluster mine token detonates on a ship, the ship that placed the proximity/cluster mine rolls X red dice. Tokens cannot be spent on this attack." Etc etc.

And yes, I do only want this for Palpatine! Just think of the fun!!!!!