The squadrons may be able to ping off a shield or two, but the Demolisher will almost certainly activate first next turn and put 4 more dice into the side of the Yavaris, with the option to do more after it finishes moving.

woah there, partner.

If you're running into B-wings and letting them overlap such that Yavaris activates, you're looking at an expected 2 damage per attack with 4 attacks (not counting the players that bank the squadron token first turn against GSDs). Against the fun "one of" distribution of the GSD's defense tokens, you're looking at an initial volley of 1 damage apiece (bye brace; bye side shields) and a 2nd volley of 4 damage to the tune of "where did my shields go?" [3 to the front, 1 to the back; bye redirect]

after yavaris (the ship) kicks in, the GSD is going to be in the same sorry state (eating into the hull)

what would happen then is a Demolisher just one-ship activation away from being blown to kingdom come..

now granted, in the above example there's a random X-wing in there where the second B should be, though I can't fathom why

Yavaris loves B-wings for anti-ship because they scale hilariously (2 Yavarised Ys = 4 black dice, 2 Yavaris Bs = 4 black dice 4 blue dice)

Anyway, the major takeaway from this is that the interplay between multiple ships means demolisher is not a simple ship. Tossing it into the fray willy-nilly against squadrons (especially yavaris) is going to get it murdered. Setting up a proper approach or simultaneous strike with the rest of the fleet (Especially imperial squadrons such as interceptors) is paramount to having Demolisher dive in and out like a sneaky thief, rather than having him end up as a gray stain in space.

I'd say thanks to Mattshadowlord for a useful and intelligent post and obviously a lot of work in producing it. Its a great contribution to the forum.

The following discussion is also useful and adds a lot of value. (well, mostly)

I agree, definitely this isn't the entire story, there is a whole wider game context to factor in. But as a logical analysis of what can happen in a particular scenario its great.

The squadrons may be able to ping off a shield or two, but the Demolisher will almost certainly activate first next turn and put 4 more dice into the side of the Yavaris, with the option to do more after it finishes moving.

woah there, partner.

If you're running into B-wings and letting them overlap such that Yavaris activates, you're looking at an expected 2 damage per attack with 4 attacks (not counting the players that bank the squadron token first turn against GSDs). Against the fun "one of" distribution of the GSD's defense tokens, you're looking at an initial volley of 1 damage apiece (bye brace; bye side shields) and a 2nd volley of 4 damage to the tune of "where did my shields go?" [3 to the front, 1 to the back; bye redirect]

after yavaris (the ship) kicks in, the GSD is going to be in the same sorry state (eating into the hull)

what would happen then is a Demolisher just one-ship activation away from being blown to kingdom come..

now granted, in the above example there's a random X-wing in there where the second B should be, though I can't fathom why

Yavaris loves B-wings for anti-ship because they scale hilariously (2 Yavarised Ys = 4 black dice, 2 Yavaris Bs = 4 black dice 4 blue dice)

Anyway, the major takeaway from this is that the interplay between multiple ships means demolisher is not a simple ship. Tossing it into the fray willy-nilly against squadrons (especially yavaris) is going to get it murdered. Setting up a proper approach or simultaneous strike with the rest of the fleet (Especially imperial squadrons such as interceptors) is paramount to having Demolisher dive in and out like a sneaky thief, rather than having him end up as a gray stain in space.

well the point is that since all ship list s with 3+ ships can pick activation order over squad fleets (2 maybe3 ships) meaning demolisher will be able to activate AFTER yavaris and avoid any damage from it it and then move in unload and move out BEFORE yavaris could respond (and after it is probably dead). So there would never be an opportunity for the yavaris double taps, and that's kinda the point of the scenarios, to demonstrate the disparity between a common ship tactic and a common fighter tactic in order to understand why ship heavy lists did so well in the gen con tournament.

Bingo.

In addition, when running this scenario on vassal, it was a genuine surprise to me how far apart the ships could be at the start of a turn and the Yavaris (or any Neb) still be in mortal danger of destruction.

I think the images also illustrate how although Squadrons are often, and correctly, referred to as the longest range form of attack in the game, launching those attacks can leave them stranded far outside order range for the following turn. A Yavaris build would be unlikely to do the alpha strike against a distant target because it so clearly wants to double tap next turn, but then if the incoming target is a Gladiator Demolisher, it's taking a gamble on even being alive to perform that double tap.

The next part of this problem is even if you have a say a corvette blocking for you, you STILL have another Gladiator or two bearing down on you. The list that took nationals won by having aggressive pieces that can basically punch above their point cost. By that i mean you need more points in assets to deal with any single one of his ships safely, and being that you're tied in points you quickly run out of assets.

Honestly with acm glads don't need to shoot the side arc of the neb because they will kill it just as fast hitting the front arc since a screed glad will do ~5 damage a shot which after brace will bring down shields and then acms knock out the side arc shields. Then the second attack will do about 3 damage after brace and then acm will add 2 for the kill

Good point by Clontroper5.

I've combined the additional range that not being required to get a side arc gives with the idea Ficklegreendice was mentioning about using more Bwings to counter things like Gladiators, and generated some more images showing how the ranges interact with one another.

Example 3 - New set up:

The Demolisher and Yavaris are now starting their turns even further apart; about one and a half full range rulers, or range 7.5 apart.

Two Bwings have been placed as far forward as possible at the very edge of the Yavaris' command range, while also being as close to the incoming ship as possible.

However, measuring for range shows that if they were ordered from their position at the most extreme range from the Yavaris directly towards the enemy ship, they still won't be able to reach it.

No huge surprises so far, Bwings are slow and squadron commands are short, but the important thing is to note that the Yavaris and Bwing combination are not able to lauch an attack at this range.

Therefor we will assume the Bwings are not activated, and instead remain in their intial position.

The Yavaris' guns are far out of range so it simply moves forward, at a slow speed 1, keeping its front to the enemy.

The Demolisher uses the luxury of a ship-heavy fleet playing a squadron-heavy opponent to activate last, and moves forward at speed 3.

It then does an additional movement 1 using Engine Techs, in a straight line, adding two ticks of yaw at the end.

The Demolisher has now leapt into close range of the Yavaris, with quite a bit to spare, and has a side arc shot at the enemy. Bwings get pushed along, and will be able to fire (the first double hit would probably be braced and at least 1 damage redirected).

With Assault Concussion Missiles the Demolisher can strip the side shields while inflicting damage on the front, and due to reasons of initiative-bid discussed earlier in this thread the Demolisher should be the first activation of the next turn, easily killing the yavaris.

With its job done, it leaves the scene of the crime and heads towards the next Rebel ship. The Bwings should have managed a decent shot against it at the end of the previous turn, but unfortunately it's possible this was their only shot of the game.

Conclusions:

It isn't a given, but it is definitely possible for a Demolisher to start a turn at an extreme distance and get into short range of a Nebulon without being attacked by the nebulon's guns.

It is possible for a Demolisher to get to short range of the carrier ship before ever being in range of activated BWings.

It's not at all unrealistic to expect a Demolisher to kill the Yavaris before the Yavaris gets to do it's double tap activation.

But you are still assuming you get to go last, which you don't always. Here's one of my lists:

CR-90a 44

Dodonna 20

Total 64

Neb-b Escort. 57

Yavaris 5

Total 62

Neb-b support 51

Neb-b support 51

B-wing x3 42

Luke 19

Total points 289

Room to add or modify the list a little.

4 ships including Yavaris.

FOUR ships. Yelling because you seem to be ignoring me.

If you wish to pretend people will continue to play in a way that ignores a changing meta, you're not playing against good players. 4 ship Yavaris is pretty much the only way she should be played right now.

So the actual conclusion is = Demolisher is overpowered?

So the actual conclusion is = Demolisher is overpowered?

If you want to take out the demolisher you have to interrupt it. It is the perfect first player ship. Since it is so, you need to be the one going first.

Try the same scenario from the perspective of the Yavaris being first player. Things change.

Only in an 1v1 scenario that occurs only when you outplay yout opponent; against the worst combat ship in the game

Let's be quite clear: demolisher is fantastically powerful, but it is heavily limited to the point where it can't be op

It's still a gsd (title boosts n stats; gives move then shoot option)

It only gets one post move attack

Said attack must be close range to be effective

In gsd spam (going by top nationals list, 298 points total for 1 vsd +3 gsd) demolisher is the ONLY thing capable of move, then shoot. If it dives in as such, it's going so alone. In order to make the most of it, it must be coordinated with the rest of the fleet.

There is only one other thing in the game capable of move, then shoot. Said thing is commanded squadrons.

So you have a choice to make:

a) activation control with ship spam; no blitzing with demo (and apparently no bid). He is more like the hammer to the list's anvil.

b) blitzing with demo + squadrons; no activation control (spent points on squadrons instead of another gsd)

He is a surprisingly nuanced lil cheese wedge (so basically no, he's neither op nor Armada's fat han)

Put another way, the original poster is doing a form of goldfishing. A term from MtG where you play your deck out without opposition to see what it's capable of. It's not a bad tool so long as you don't misuse the tool.

He's putting the Demolisher in its ideal state. It's a good ship so it will look overpowered in this context. Once you start putting a real person on the other end who's allowed to change strategies and game plan for the Demolisher (something people should do) then it's power level starts to come down.

I've already shown a Yavaris list that can handle it. Now try a Neb-b spam:

Neb-b support + Mon Motha

Neb-b support + Redemption

3x Neb-b support

Go ahead, overextend your 80 pt ship to try and destroy my outermost 51 pt ship that has a great defensive buff (re rolling their only crit makes them sad) and can repair quickly (first turn repair token). This list throws out up to 20 red dice on the first approach. (Granted, getting all in arc may be challenging ). I can probably ignore your Demolisher run and put the smack down on the rest of your fleet while Demolisher takes a few turns to get turned around.

Why was Yarvis by itself without ship support? covering it's flanks?

One problem I have with Neb-Bs is they are not very good at defense, with no defensive upgrades, and weak side shields, if they are not going after something directly head to head it is going to lose

Put another way, the original poster is doing a form of goldfishing. A term from MtG where you play your deck out without opposition to see what it's capable of. It's not a bad tool so long as you don't misuse the tool.

He's putting the Demolisher in its ideal state. It's a good ship so it will look overpowered in this context. Once you start putting a real person on the other end who's allowed to change strategies and game plan for the Demolisher (something people should do) then it's power level starts to come down.

I've already shown one Yavaris list that can handle it. Now try this one:

Neb-b support + Mon Motha

Neb-b support + Redemption

3x Neb-b support

Go ahead, overextend your 80 pt ship to try and destroy my outermost 51 pt ship that has a great defensive buff (re rolling their only crit makes them sad) and can repair quickly (first turn repair token). This list throws out up to 20 red dice on the first approach. (Granted, getting all in arc may be challenging ). I can probably ignore your Demolisher run and put the smack down on the rest of your fleet while Demolisher takes a few turns to get turned around.

And aging because of the activation order it wouldn't matter if there was supporting ships nearby to the yavaris it would still die. At best if they were lucky rebel players could bring enough firepower to bear next turn to bring down demolisher forcing a trade but there is almost no scenario where yavaris survives an encounter with demolisher.

You're completely ignoring my 4 ship list which can survive (and has in practice) a Demolisher run. So there are scenarios where a "carrier" survives. Ships on the side arcs take up space and obstruct shots, so support ships do affect the scenario. If I'm trading ships, I'd rather loose my support ships. Furthermore because I'm running 4 ships, Yavaris is further back because it goes last. This plus my flank ship starts to limit your position options if you insist on going for Yavaris.

We haven't even to cover that Yavaris could easily have a squadron token to add yet another shot in.

It's not about ignoring your list. He is using this scenario to show everyone how effective this can be. A single demolisher able to combat what, 20+ points. More than itself and survive with a kill is pretty big.

Yes it dies since it's alone, is this a likely scenario, yes. I have seem it happen, I have caused it to happen, there are any number of reasons why this could, would, and has occur.

Hi Everyone, new poster but have been playing the game since week one and went to gencon and played in the tourney.

I think the OP did a fantastic job laying out the problem with squadrons. He isn't arguing that the Gladiator is over powered or Imperials are better. He simply showing that squadrons start with a dis-advantage and this is why the top 2 players had no squadrons.

I played at Gencon, finishing at 16th place. In the top 8 was a Rymer ball Imperial list that did very well (a good player I had the pleasure of playing to a 5-5 loss in round 2). I only flew 4 interceptors. That being said, those interceptors did contribute to killing a Space Whale that was un-defended in a different round.

Squadrons have a place, you just have to have a specific role for them, and know how to get your points back from them. We are all still new to this game and were in wave I, don't form any finalized opinions. If you think a list is better without squadrons, play it without squadrons until proven otherwise. Personally I found my list, a VVG did very well using the 4 interceptors to protect from squadrons or occassionaly doing a couple extra hits on ships.

Also if you think about it 4 squadrons in 300 points is like 48 Tie Interceptors if each squadron is 12 fighters. Perfectly keeping in the theme with the smaller scale battles we are currently playing. My prediction is that in wave 2 with 400 points you will see 3-6 fighter squadrons in a list and those lists do well.

On a final side note, in any wave I launch of a game spam tends to be the stronger lists due to a lack of options and counters. If you recall x wing, Tie swarm was king for awhile. I'm sure Gladiator swarm will be less of a thing, especially with bigger ships that have more shields and firepower.

It's not a matter of ignoring your post Tranenturm, because the point of this thread isn't that Yavaris is terrible or that squadrons should never be taken.

What I am attempting to do in this thread is firstly show the interaction of range and geometry that makes taking a low-ship list against a higher ship opponent with Demolisher so extremely dangerous, and secondly show why relying on double-activated Bwings to save the day for that low-ship list is not a foolproof plan due to the short range of squadron commands, the slow speed of the fighters and vulnerabiity of the Nebulon carrier.

I expect some people reading this will be surprised to see a Demolisher can leap-frog a Bwing screen and hit their carrier at range 1 before ever being in range of the carrier's guns OR of the Bwings themselves. I know I was. In fact even Ywings or Xwings would have been pushing the limit to make the distance in the second set of images:

That actually makes a case for considering your type of 4 ship build over the currently more popular AF+Yavaris+Squadrons approach. But it also makes a case for a Ship-heavy list with minimal interceptors.

Hi Everyone, new poster but have been playing the game since week one and went to gencon and played in the tourney.

I think the OP did a fantastic job laying out the problem with squadrons. He isn't arguing that the Gladiator is over powered or Imperials are better. He simply showing that squadrons start with a dis-advantage and this is why the top 2 players had no squadrons.

I played at Gencon, finishing at 16th place. In the top 8 was a Rymer ball Imperial list that did very well (a good player I had the pleasure of playing to a 5-5 loss in round 2). I only flew 4 interceptors. That being said, those interceptors did contribute to killing a Space Whale that was un-defended in a different round.

Squadrons have a place, you just have to have a specific role for them, and know how to get your points back from them. We are all still new to this game and were in wave I, don't form any finalized opinions. If you think a list is better without squadrons, play it without squadrons until proven otherwise. Personally I found my list, a VVG did very well using the 4 interceptors to protect from squadrons or occassionaly doing a couple extra hits on ships.

Also if you think about it 4 squadrons in 300 points is like 48 Tie Interceptors if each squadron is 12 fighters. Perfectly keeping in the theme with the smaller scale battles we are currently playing. My prediction is that in wave 2 with 400 points you will see 3-6 fighter squadrons in a list and those lists do well.

On a final side note, in any wave I launch of a game spam tends to be the stronger lists due to a lack of options and counters. If you recall x wing, Tie swarm was king for awhile. I'm sure Gladiator swarm will be less of a thing, especially with bigger ships that have more shields and firepower.

This is well said, Thanks for posting:)

your example lists miss the point again, the point of the pictures is to show heavy ships vs heavy squadron, yes this won't fair as well against 5 nebulons but he never said they would. Again the point is to show why ship heavy beats squad heavy.

Well, no.

The point of the thread is to illustrate how dangerous the Demolisher can be under the right circumstances.

People seem to be getting defensive about the 'artificiality' of the scenario since it assumes that the Imperial player has both more activations, and the first turn, and has cunningly placed the Demolisher in the precise range-band where it is out of range from the Yavaris, yet within it's own Engine Techs range. It also makes some assumptions about orders being taken or banked. Yes, it's a very artificial situation that you probably won't encounter in the wild. But it serves to illustrate just how dangerous the Demolisher can be, and how wary people need to be of it. How important it can be to try and get either more activations, or the first turn, or both where possible.

The ability to move then fire is dangerous. When it's coupled with the ability to move first, it's very dangerous. When that is combined with the ability to go last, as well as first, then it is outright lethal.

But that has more to do with the activation control. Run the same scenario (but lets be generous and put the B Wings in range of the Demolisher) with the Yavaris activating last, and being the first player and the result will be a dead Demolisher. Even just changing the scenario so that the Yavaris is the first player gives a very different result.

EDIT: you don't even need to be generous with the placement of the B Wings. Making the Demolisher activate before the Yavaris leaves it landing on the B Wings and outside of close range to the Yavaris. A 'mothma-ed' Yavaris at medium range is not scared of the Demolisher (provided the activations are in her favour).

I'm sticking my muzzle where it usually doesn't belong, but I'll bite. Keep in mind that I think Matt's done a great job laying out a fairly common scenario, and the reasons for it, as well as having presented it in a comprehensive and effective fashion. This is not meant as a personal attack or questioning the abilities of the Shadowlord. With that in mind:

Chuckle, don't we already know that Demolisher is dangerous to just about everything out there? Since Wave I was a thing, hasn't "don't let Screed Demolisher 1's with ACM's and Engine Techs run wild" been the Imperial 'thing' as much as "don't engage Gallant's fighter escorts with TIE Interceptors" been the Rebel 'thing'? I'm not sure we need more supporting evidence for that, Nationals and other spokesmen have already done as much to impress upon the public that Gladiator spam is currently effective. The question is, what do we do about it?

What if there were more Bwings, Keyan, placed better, a bigger gap between the Ships, better angles for the Yavaris, and Paul Heaver, Sir Francis Drake or a better player piloting them?

Things might have worked out differently. Really though, with equal player skill on both sides I think the advantage lies with the Imperial, and the gap between the two fleet builds is huge.

I'll admit it, this bit might be the only thing in the entire opening topic that I really don't like: it effectively hand-waves the conversation and is one of the contributing killers of any counterpoint. It also sets up who the 'protagonist' and 'antagonist' is, as all the constructive assumptions favour the Demolisher while the rest is shunted aside as being 'most likely'. Isn't the whole purpose of this to erase the 'most likely' scenario, and inform others what the most reasonable choice of alternatives would be when confronted by the Demolisher? Otherwise, the whole issue comes to a screeching halt with something that sounds like: 'naw dogg, don't try it, 'cause you gonna' daaah. Embrace da' dark side, yo', be a winna'.' The 'buy a Gladiator, Lol, jk' comment might have been put there as a joke, but (Anecdotal evidence time!) that's what the local scene has done. Gladiators have sold out, Nebulon Bs were hung up, squadrons are nowhere in sight. Not only that, as comic as it was meant to be, it's how this topic feels in its context.

This is going to be a discombobulated mess, and I don't expect an answer for all of them, but neither does proving one prove the rest of the list wrong or irrelevant.

• What orders should be given to the Yavaris (or any escort), when Demolisher is on its attack course?
• What angle should be taken to minimize damage?
• What supporting upgrades can be used to greatest effect?
• Should something like a CR90 be used as a screen to obscure the more tantalizing Yavaris?
• What should be our squadron deployment and support strategy? What should the Yavaris's speed and the distance be in order to ensure that it can get at least one ideal shot against the Demolisher?
• Should the Yavaris be using a post-Squadron command advance back into command range of its fighters if it survives the presumed last-first activation, and what happens when you take 4 ships by letting go of the RAF tether? in doing so, what will the presumed outcome be of the Demolisher not getting last activation? or even going first?
• Should we be banking a navigate token and Engine techs/Antilles to break away and bring the Yavaris right up to the 'stranded' squadrons for a round 2 assault? Will that reliable get you away from the Demolisher's first attack, thus putting it back in range of a second fighter run?
• What objectives are we likely facing, and what should we take if we suppose that the Demolisher or even championship net-list is going to be present?

Then we have the Squadron side of things rather than a ship-dominated discussion.

• Why is an A-wing, B-wing, and X-wing chosen for squadrons?
• What should be the best deployment strategy? We covered why the 'alpha strike' won't necessarily work (it was actually my favourite aspect of the whole topic), but what about a net?
• Given that we can forgo deployments of ships for a pair of fighter squadrons, wouldn't a pair of Y-wings act as a rather convincing deployment drop to see where the Demolisher is going to be? It's a sacrifice of 20 awkwardly placed points, but it might put the Yavaris back in control of its relative placement compared to the Demolisher. So where would it best be, and on what angle?
• If we have approximately 40 points to work with, would 3 Y-wings and an A-wing be more effective against the Demon Demolisher and ships in general, than 2 B's and 1 A? (I get the limit of 2 command value, I'm just postulating if it's better to have choices or pull a trick to get 3 bomber activation with the option to engage enemy fighters with the A-wing, or to not bother with it). What about Luke and 2 A-wings?

A lot of questions disappear with that earlier handwaving.

In response to the multiple posts saying I don't get the point of the list, I've stated in several statements that I understand it's about showing the danger of the Demolisher and praised the OP for doing so in a nice fashion. And then I caveat that while useful it's not the the whole story. Then a poster comes in and asks if the consensus is that Demolisher is overpowered. To which I said no, merely the best ship and then gave another list to counter it (albeit without squadrons). Oddly I don't think we're that far apart.

I'm merely insistent on adding the rest of the context, cause while the op is correct that Demolisher wins in a vacuum, that doesn't prove that squadrons are inherently worse. It shows one unique ship with the best solo alpha strike in the game can destroy a "carrier" stripped of the context by which carriers work. Squadrons don't live and die with the carrier. The carrier can act as a force multiplier or enabler, but any ship can use a squadron token to get the basic move and shoot.

So by ignoring my list (which contradicts at least one of the op main assumptions) we don't move the conversation forward. I love the post above with all those questions. We're in agreement that Demolisher is good, so let's work together to flesh out the counters. I brought my list not to say the op was wrong on everything, but to show a possible way forward (I didn't review my earlier words before writing this so that may not be how it came across).

I've been waiting for someone to respond with what the rest of the Demolisher fleet can do to counter the crazy B-wing counter attack. I think L mentioned hammer and anvil, but that's as far as we got.

I also think we need to address objectives. If we're giving first player to Demolisher, something the game recognizes as an advantage and try's to balance it with how objectives are made, then it's worth pursuing how the different objectives interact with the scenario.

Of the three I mentioned, most wanted gives extra dice for the counter attack on Demolisher (or perhaps the Victory flagship making trading Yavaris for their flagship a great deal).

Hyperspace Assault puts Yavaris into space as an untouchable asset until I maneuver the tokens in behind the imperial ships.

Minefields makes the approach and flight trickier. I've used in practice to good effect, but nowhere near enough times to know all the inns and outs and whether there are some patterns that emerge that either player can take advantage of.

All I'm really saying is that stopping with "D vs Y in this limited scenario makes D amazing" whether true or not has limited usefulness without the follow up.

Remember that a carrier is only as good as the squadrons it has to support. You're effectively tying a few dozen points to its base cost by needing to activate those squadrons. So a squadron command can be very costly compared to something that does not worry about squadrons.

IMO squadrons are something of a disappointment.

The big problem is that they require commands to be fully effective.

That's it really - every other problem associated with squadrons derive from this.

- every squ command is a command that could be used for something else, like repair, maneuvers, or gunnery

- squ commands are very time critical; they must be timed correctly or they are pretty much wasted

- it's so easy to put your squadrons out of command range

- especially since squadrons get engaged so easily

I prefer to play Rebels. A small detachment of A-wings are what works for me. They can delay any squadron-heavy enemy list + are semi-useful vs capitals, even if flown in the squadron phase.

For 42 points you can buy 3 B-wings.

Three Bs can be activated by a single AF2 squadron command, a Neb-b escort command plus token, or 3 squad tokens from anything.

That gives you 3 black dice and 3 blue dice divided between 3 attacks. That's better than a VSD-II.

This can be launched from medium range of the ship, moving distance 2, and striking at distance 1. Farther than anything else capable of throwing those dice.

No carrier upgrades needed.

What other command enables that sort of damage at that range?

They also DONT need those squadron commands.

They can fly alongside a ship escorting it and fire in the squadron phase to add dice on critical turns.

Plus, in a meta with no fighter squadrons they have very little downside. Even in a meta with fighters, B-wings have enough game to take care of themselves. Their biggest drawback would be the ability to be pinned by 3 TIE fighters (costing 24 points) for a couple of turns. But no one seems to be bringing lots of TIE fighters.

And they can be stopped by a single tie fighter long enough for the ship in question to move away.

For 2 points more I get a CR90 that comes with red and blue dice, has shields, redirects, commands, and is speed 4.

For 3 points less I get a CR90 that is speed 4 has commands, redirects, can't be tied up by a single squadron, gets 2 attacks and can shoot up to 6 dice a turn with a reroll somewhere in there.

B-Wings are great but (and remember now that my first 2 videos were on the B-Wing) they can only keep up with a VSD, every other ship in the game moves past them fast, Interceptors lock them down as well as tie fighters, and for all their firepower they are limited on targets because while they can move and shoot a bit past medium range, the next turn they will be lucky to b4ing that power to bear.

Inconsistent firepower is weaker everytime to consistent firepower. Even if it is just a comparison of the CR90 to 3 B-Wings, if I can shoot the cr90 every turn and only shoot the B-Wings every other turn, which pumps out more damage?