I haven't seen anyone discuss this, maybe it was back when the TLT was initially spoiled, so if so I apologize.

Does anyone think the TLT will breath new life into Horton Salm? I was trying to work out a list with him since to this day I have never put him on the board, but I keep finding myself just wanting to make a stresshog if I play a rebel y-wing, and I keep feeling like the TLT turret is better on a cheaper platform like an HWK, on Miranda, or over on the scum side with Kavil. Any other thoughts?

I certainly hope it will! It should work really well with his pilot ability, giving him two modified attacks per round even if he doesn't have an action, or spends it doing something else. (Engine Upgrade? Focus for R5-P9?)

Kavil doesn't get as much from TLT, because he'd rather use something without a damage cap. I think Miranda is going to be good at the TLT, but not for the same reasons as Salm--she's going to use it to regenerate shields without entirely losing a chance to do damage, but Salm is going to be using it to do a very reliable 1-2 damage per round.

I don't know, Kavil with TLT is going to get damage through on guys like Soontir and IG-88 really well. I think it makes him too expensive for as easy as he gets blown up though so I don't really see it getting a lot of play.

Salm with TLT, the droid that gives you an EPT, Veteran Instincts, and Engine Upgrade should be really interesting as an attempt to counter arc-dodgers like Fel and Whisper.

Salm with TLT, the droid that gives you an EPT, Veteran Instincts, and Engine Upgrade should be really interesting as an attempt to counter arc-dodgers like Fel and Whisper.

This could be good, though it's 37 points for something that can't do more than two damage a turn. And even with the reroll on blanks, there will be times were you struggle to get through to Soontir. I don't know if you can keep him out of arcs as well without engine, but dropping VI and engine for R4-D6 (the cancel more than 3 hit dice for stress) frees up a few points. He'll be fun though.

Salm with TLT, the droid that gives you an EPT, Veteran Instincts, and Engine Upgrade should be really interesting as an attempt to counter arc-dodgers like Fel and Whisper.

This could be good, though it's 37 points for something that can't do more than two damage a turn. And even with the reroll on blanks, there will be times were you struggle to get through to Soontir. I don't know if you can keep him out of arcs as well without engine, but dropping VI and engine for R4-D6 (the cancel more than 3 hit dice for stress) frees up a few points. He'll be fun though.

Part of the point though is with 2 attacks you force Soontir to burn up his tokens so your other ships can get some damage through too and/or so he won't have a focus for offense

He's very good with TlT. You just have to find the right list for him.

It is a good combo.

Also, just grab Extra Munitions and a Proton Torpedo for use with Salm. That's good enough right there. He moves late with PS 8. He re-rolls blanks. One eyeball turns into a crit, so it's a mini-Focus right there. He's awesome with Torpedoes.

Or give him some cluster mines and extra munitions to keep the nasties off of his tail.

One issue i could see is that Horton's ability only works with [blank] results. Too many eyeball results could rain on his parade. Otherwise the ability works quite well with TLT.

I plan to try Horton out in a few different lists, as a strong Jouster with TLT-BTLA4 and an R2 astromech, and as a bomb-dropper, using his high PS to make good bomb drops. Giving him both TLT and bombs can get too expensive, especially if you are using proton bombs. TLT and a seismic or ion bomb could be a nice setup for him, but if he's carrying bombs it is probably best to leave off the BTL-A4 title, since you really want the enemies to be chasing you, while you shoot backwards at them with the TLT and periodically bomb them.

Just ran some numbers for Horton. I'll update them into the big MathWing post eventually.

He comes out to around 93% jousting efficient assuming he always has a TLT shot. Not bad for a turret, the obvious drawback is the R1 hole. I still think he should get an EPT though.

Yes, but since you can give him one with the EPT droid, what would you really give him?

Personally, I wouldn't give Horton the BTL title as it is too limiting. Just give him the regular turret and he'll almost always have a shot.

I think Horton would do more damage with the Proton Torpedoes and EM. The only down side is if you roll all eyeballs.

Yes, but since you can give him one with the EPT droid, what would you really give him?

The droid EPT costs a point and eats the droid slot. No thanks. It's both limiting and not cost effective. Horton should already have the EPT. I'm sure he can find a use for it, even if it's just PS10.

Just ran some numbers for Horton. I'll update them into the big MathWing post eventually.

He comes out to around 93% jousting efficient assuming he always has a TLT shot. Not bad for a turret, the obvious drawback is the R1 hole. I still think he should get an EPT though.

93% seems real nice, given that it is a turret. Any idea what his numbers look like for TLT with the BTL-A4 title? I imagine that's a trickier calculation, but I could see him doing some work as a jouster, using TLT, BTL-A4, and an R2 astro to give him good options coming out of a K-turn.

A rookiee pilot on Horton's tail will die to TLT before he can kill horton, on average. Wow.

I've tried Horton a few times with TLT and R5-P9 and that right there is one nasty Y-wing. Horton's special rule means he rarely needs a focus token for attacks. Instead that focus is mostly used to regenerate shields or gain extra evade results, especially when attacked at long range. I've been thinking of running a list using the above Horton, Miranda Doni and Corran Horn for THREE shield regenerating annoyances.

Just ran some numbers for Horton. I'll update them into the big MathWing post eventually.

He comes out to around 93% jousting efficient assuming he always has a TLT shot. Not bad for a turret, the obvious drawback is the R1 hole. I still think he should get an EPT though.

93% seems real nice, given that it is a turret. Any idea what his numbers look like for TLT with the BTL-A4 title? I imagine that's a trickier calculation, but I could see him doing some work as a jouster, using TLT, BTL-A4, and an R2 astro to give him good options coming out of a K-turn.

Yeah, that's a more complicated calculation. I might add it to my scripts - I'm in the middle adding functionality for a new multi-attack function that I wrote just to handle TLT. Eventually I'll pull normal BTL+Ion into it, and things like HLC gunner. Things get complicated because I keep track of whether focus is spent or not by both offense and defense, and I brute force all possible combinations to get the exact answer.

A rookiee pilot on Horton's tail will die to TLT before he can kill horton, on average. Wow.

That's not exactly what it says. Jousting efficiency is derated by the implied PS bid, so the absolute required efficiency numbers to "break even" are correspondingly higher for higher PS pilots. Also, the jousting numbers are meta-wide averages shooting against a variety of targets, and being shot at in return by a attackers. If you isolate it to just one singular matchup then the numbers will change.

That said, I would certainly take Horton + TLT before I take a Rookie Pilot.

R5-P9 is an interesting choice but it makes sense the same way it makes sense on Luke.

You could add the EPT-Droid and Marksmanship. If you use him with the title, than you look at three attacks with TL+Focus, although two of them are capped at one damage, and the crit from Marksmanship does not get through.

EDIT: Or an R7-Astromech, for a better devensive action than a single Focus.

Or R2-F2 for one more agility die.

R5-P9 is an interesting choice but it makes sense the same way it makes sense on Luke.

But Horton only re-rolls blanks. So if you get a bunch of eyeballs on your roll, or your re-roll, you're stuck with them unless you spend the focus. With two attacks from TLT, there's a pretty good chance he'll have a chance to spend the focus at some point. I don't recommend R5-P9 on TLT Horton. Those points would be better spent on another ship (TLT Horton is already 31 points, which is pricey for a Y-wing), or on a bomb for Horton, which works well with his PS8.

The main issue with TLT Horton is the main issue with Kavil. They are too dangerous to leave alive. Maybe if you pair him with opportunist engine wedge or something...