Oh, absolutely. And even that looked better than the Lancer.

And lets be honest, BOTH of them share a certain shape often found in...."marital aids".

It would not have done well for them.

The reason there was no need for it lore-wise is that they had ships to do this already...

But those ships didn't fit into X-Wing.

I suppose you could argue that the Raider fills a roll other ships fill. But considering how many different types of TIE's there are out there, having more then one type of anti-fighter ship seems to fit the Empire.

There was no existing ship that filled the needs FFG had for a Imperial Epic ship, so it was very much needed both Lore wise and mechanically. Even if you argue it wasn't needed, there's no good argument that says it couldn't exist.

Only the Tartan could keep up with the CR90. The others were bugger thus required more crew.

Hey, no need to convince me. I already said several times i agree with them making it.

Just pointing out it wasn't NEEDED lore-wise, just gameplay-wise. Though as you say, that absolutely doesn't mean it couldn't exist.

Hell, it's not like much smaller real-life Military forces don't have several things that cover the same task.

So two comments:

1. On the topic of the effectiveness of the swarm, I want to see exact points cost and if they can take ACM, as if they can, many raiders plus Screed could be a very entertaining list (even more than Tarkin). The ultimate blitzkrieg tactic, so to speak.
2. On the topic of "canon", keep in mind that many things that were in the EU are no longer necessarily canon. As someone who, honestly, never read any of the novels or came in with preconceived ideas other than having seen all of the movies and a handful of episodes of Rebels, the Raider looks very in-keeping with the Imperials and the star wars universe.
3. Given that, in the original trilogy, very few large-scale ships are ever actually on the screen, it would be insane to think we had seen the entire rebel or imperial Navies. As a result, "new" ships in the sense of "we have to actually make a functional game" does make total sense, and fits with a universe. It's not like if you drive from home to work and film it, the entire set of cars in the world are limited to what you happened to see on the way to work, after all.

The Raider is a friday afternow design. I mean realy? A shrinked star destroyer with TIE-Wings? Could it get any lower.

The Raider is cries milking. The Cr90 is in widly imperial use and has imperial variants. Beside that and the Tartan and the Lancer, there is just no need for it.

Hey, no need to convince me. I already said several times i agree with them making it.

Just pointing out it wasn't NEEDED lore-wise, just gameplay-wise. Though as you say, that absolutely doesn't mean it couldn't exist.

Hell, it's not like much smaller real-life Military forces don't have several things that cover the same task.

As a loremonger, I disagree that it wasn't needed lore wise.

The Lancer and the Raider do not fulfill the same role. While both are anti-starfighter platforms, the Lancer fails because it's 'only' an anti-starfighter platform, and because of its production cost, it comes in at the cost of a cruiser without the benefits. There's also the matter that it's slow.

The Raider, in addition to being an anti-starfighter platform, is also a good fast-attack corvette. Because it's smaller and (one presumes) cheaper to produce, it can see widespread service in the Outer Rim as a hyperdrive -capable patrol vessel in response to the Rebellion.

You might say that the Rendili Light Corvette could have served in that capacity, but that ship strikes me as too specialized for Imperial Customs, rather than the Imperial Navy's counter-insurgency needs. Also, Rendili was out of favor with the Navy and Imperial Center generally. Ergo, the contract for the design and building of a new fast-attack corvette with anti-starfighter capability goes to Sienar.

The Cr90 is in widly imperial use and has imperial variants.

Which was never seen on screen. The CR-90 is a pretty iconic Rebel ship, as such it wan't suitable for X-Wing as an Imperial epic.

Beside that and the Tartan and the Lancer, there is just no need for it.

Since when has that ever stopped the military from producing something? It would also be as Mikael Hasselstein points out, cheaper then either of those options, and that seems to fit quite nicely with Imperial Doctrine about ships...

So yes there was a need for it, the need may more mechanics then lore, but there's no lore reason to suggest such a ship couldn't or shouldn't exist.

You don't like the ship, but frankly I couldn't care less what your opinion on it is. I like it and I'm glad I'm getting it for both X-Wing and Armada. But your distaste for it is not a reasonable argument for why it should not exist.

The Raider is a friday afternow design. I mean realy? A shrinked star destroyer with TIE-Wings? Could it get any lower.

The Raider is cries milking. The Cr90 is in widly imperial use and has imperial variants. Beside that and the Tartan and the Lancer, there is just no need for it.

Plenty of posts have given solid answers to these complaints. Suggest looking back through the posts and checking them out.

The Raider is a friday afternow design. I mean realy? A shrinked star destroyer with TIE-Wings? Could it get any lower.

The Raider is cries milking. The Cr90 is in widly imperial use and has imperial variants. Beside that and the Tartan and the Lancer, there is just no need for it.

Plenty of posts have given solid answers to these complaints. Suggest looking back through the posts and checking them out.

I can see nothing of that.

The Raider is a friday afternow design. I mean realy? A shrinked star destroyer with TIE-Wings? Could it get any lower.

The Raider is cries milking. The Cr90 is in widly imperial use and has imperial variants. Beside that and the Tartan and the Lancer, there is just no need for it.

Plenty of posts have given solid answers to these complaints. Suggest looking back through the posts and checking them out.

I can see nothing of that.

The Raider is a friday afternow design. I mean realy? A shrinked star destroyer with TIE-Wings? Could it get any lower.

The Raider is cries milking. The Cr90 is in widly imperial use and has imperial variants. Beside that and the Tartan and the Lancer, there is just no need for it.

Plenty of posts have given solid answers to these complaints. Suggest looking back through the posts and checking them out.

I can see nothing of that.

Then you are being obtuse.

Sorry that I assumed you get the point. But of course I am obtuse.

I like how people state: Already answerd when its not, just because they have no arguments left.

To reply in kind: Its already stated why the raider contradicts the fluff because the Imperium have the Cr90 and withdraw them from front duty because so small ships dont fit their doctrine anymore.

Another favorite:

You don't like the ship, but frankly I couldn't care less what your opinion on it is. I like it and I'm glad I'm getting it for both X-Wing and Armada. But your distaste for it is not a reasonable argument for why it should not exist.

So you dont care about an oppionion in a discussion.....whats the point of posting that?

If somebody could cut back their insults (in lack of arguments/discussion culutre) and base their oppionion on some facts. Here is a quick comparison of the Antifighter gap the Raider was meant to fill:

Yup, a cheaper solution to the much slower Tartan and Lancer. Also consider that currently the only 3 ships that are canon on that list is the CR90 and the Raider. The others no longer exist from what I can see for the purposes of this game but they may appear someday. You also neglected to mentions the torpedoes and missiles they Raider brings to the table. The Raider covers the same role as the CR90 which is perfect in my mind.

Raider Wookieepedia article

As we see in the article, the Raider has a legitimate use, story, and concept. Though it says it uses turbo lasers so I am expecting a red and black dice version for the class 2 version.

Now the Raider also looks like an Imperial Corvette which is important because many younger (I say this as I am 26) people have not been introduced to the whole "EU" side of Star Wars. This makes the first 2 waves of Armada look appropriate for the Imperials and for those that have that dagger like shape in their heads as an iconic piece of Star Wars.

Wait, the Tartan is very fast. And the cheaper solution is clearly the Cr90 or Cr92, which are already in long use. Canon are all, but everyone except the Raider has a long set of references and tie ins.

The Raider seems to have ordonance, because he can take Ordonance upgrades, but its not stated anywhere. So if it cover the same role as the Cr90, why should the empire need it?

So where is the "legitimate use, story, and concept"?

And on top of the silly Mini Star Destroyer + TIE Wings (sense behind that?), what is in the front part of the ship. Clearly the crew cant enter it.

So where is the "legitimate use, story, and concept"?

All these, including the tie wings have been answered a number of times. If you continue to be intentionally obtuse about it, then why bother discussing it?

You've asked, and been answered. The fact that you won't accept the answer doesn't make it invalid.

Wait, the Tartan is very fast. And the cheaper solution is clearly the Cr90 or Cr92, which are already in long use. Canon are all, but everyone except the Raider has a long set of references and tie ins.

The Raider seems to have ordonance, because he can take Ordonance upgrades, but its not stated anywhere. So if it cover the same role as the Cr90, why should the empire need it?

So where is the "legitimate use, story, and concept"?

And on top of the silly Mini Star Destroyer + TIE Wings (sense behind that?), what is in the front part of the ship. Clearly the crew cant enter it.

Remember, official canon now is limited only to the movies themselves, according to Disney's whole EU destruction thing. And, in the movies, the CR90 was never used by the Imperial Navy. Thus, the Raider was created by LucasArts and FFG to fill the role of having an Imperial-styled corvette.

The TIE-Wings are, I would assume, atmospheric compensators, like the side panels on a Victory Star Destroyer. Or they might be the ship's shield generators. IDK, we haven't had any solid answer on that, but there are certainly ways to answer it. I think they look cool, and help break up what would otherwise be a very bland design.

Also: Consider that the Raider is 150 meters long. While the very front of its tip may be inaccessible, it wouldn't be that far behind the tip that you could have areas easily large enough for crewmen to walk around. The very front could be used to house navigation, sensor, or communications hardware.

I don't much care about the argument going on here, but as to the viability of raider swarm in the game, I pray it is ineffective. This game is better when there are different types of ships on the board, its jusy more immersive and more fun. Plus I don't want to buy like 8 raiders.

I don't much care about the argument going on here, but as to the viability of raider swarm in the game, I pray it is ineffective. This game is better when there are different types of ships on the board, its jusy more immersive and more fun. Plus I don't want to buy like 8 raiders.

See, I love the idea of a sort of "pack hunting" mentality you could bring with a bunch of raiders. I can imagine a rebel convoy being ambushed by a half dozen Raiders, hitting hard and destroying several ships before jumping to safety.

Maybe the solar panels are just that. The raider doesn't have that reactor bulge that other star destroyers have.

I'm looking forward to the Raider.

I plan to get one for X-wing to combat the CR90 and at least one maybe two for Armada. I'm not a huge fan of the Gladiator even though I know a lot of people love it (I've seen the finals lists and those guys sure do). I'm no pro at this game so perhaps I'm not flying it properly but the Raider will allow me to be a little more flexible in my list building and not force me to take two Victories or a Victory/Gladiator which I have had great success with but can become a little repetitive. That coupled with the ISD will provide more variety for the Empire if nothing as the Rebels are far more flexible in the ship-choice department.

Personally I think the Raider looks cool, better than a Tartan (which I love from years of Empire At War) or a Lancer but that's just my opinion.

I seriously doubt the raider will be the same price as the corvette... At speed 4 you needn't fear red dice before getting into black die range.

I suspect the minimum cost will come in around 47 points, give or take.

Let's pretend that you have a raider at 44 points. Slap on ACM and you are at 51 points. With Screed you are at 383 for 7 of the buggers. Side arcs are 4 damage minimum, which can be braced down to 3.

Given a 47 point cost stops you from rolling 7 of them, I suspect that is the lower limit. Another unlikely alternative is they do not have the missile upgrade slot.

If you are somehow able to get double arcs, or a number of ships focusing fire... Well... Like say two in the front and two on each side... 22 damage minimum, just from the side arcs!!! Or from three double arc shots...

Though on a serious note, I would be very surprised if Demolisher wasn't included in the above missle swarm.

I think you mean 2.2 damage. . . Cuz, 22 damage would be a bit ridiculous.

I can see the Raider 1 costing anywhere from 40 to 50 points, 50 points being the right zone due to the fact that it has a brace and 1 more die than a CR90 on the front arc, no to mention the fact that it has black dice.

But where can you see the stats of Imperial Raider?

Can you post a pic or something?

Interesting post, I have more hype now.

The only stays I am using is the Here they Come article. So far that gives us a 2 click speed 1, 2 evades, a brace, 1 command, 1 squadron, 2 engineering. 1 blue 1 black Anti-squadron (Raider 2 only)

The Raider 1 has 2 black dice for Anti-squadron, 2 blue 2 black front arc, 1 blue 1 black side arcs and a 1 blue rear arc so I thin 40ish points will be a thing. The Raider 2 will be near 50.