Latest round of questions from our play group!

1. Are you allowed to play a card and target a standing character if it says to stand a character?

2. Similar to the above, can you kneel an already kneeling character?

3. What happens when two Valar plots are revealed? Would that require two saves for a character to survive?

4. Finally, locations you can attach to your house card as an attachment - I assume you can not attach these if played during setup?

Thanks in advance!

Madduxx said:

Yes, but in both cases, the effect is considered unsuccessful. So if the card says "choose and stand a character, THEN do (something else)," you don't get to do the something else because you didn't stand anything. Similarly, you can't Respond to standing the character because you didn't actually stand anything.

Comes down to this: if the targeting requirement doesn't say "choose a kneeling character and stand it," you can choose a character that is already standing for the effect. But since nothing actually stood, you cannot do anything that depends on standing the character.

Madduxx said:

As with anything, if the effects are on two different cards, you have to resolve them individually and separately. So yes, if you want your character to survive two Valars, you need two saves - even if they are revealed at the same time.

Madduxx said:

Correct. As always, no card text works at all during setup, so the card text allowing you to play the location as an attachment doesn't work. Anyway, you aren't "playing" cards during setup, so the text doesn't apply anyway.

Hi! Hope Maddux doesn't mind me hijacking his thread or a bit, but I got some newbie Core Set questions too! If any wise sould could answer them for me, I'd appreciate it!

1. This game doesn't have a max hand size right?

2. Why is there a distinction between "discard from play" and "killed?" What's the difference between the two?

3. Deadly works even if you lose the challenge?

Thanks!!!

I think I've answered my last 2 questions, please tell me if my understanding is correct:

2. "discard" and "killed" mainly serves to distinguish where the card will go after the effect resolves. Discarded cards go to the discard pile, and killed cards go to the dead pile.

3. Yes, Deadly works even if you lose the challenge.

butch said:

1. No, there is no maximum hand size - unless there is a card in play that creates a limit.

2. Primarily, that is true. The game maintains separate "discard" and "dead" piles because there are rules that interact with each of the piles differently (look at the rules for unique cards, for example).

3. Yes, if you lose as an attacker, Deadly still works.

Thanks again Ktom!

After our second night of playing this game, one card is confusing my playgroup: Lords of the Narrow Sea. My questions are:

1. What happens to the "old" plot? Is it cancelled? (i.e. can this card be used to cancel a plot during the plot phase?)

2. What happens to the newly revealed plot after the Event? Is it put into the Used Plots pile? Or returned to the unused plots?

3. If the plot has any "when revealed" text, will it trigger?

4. If the plot has any other effects, will they apply? (e.g. if Planning Ahead is revealed by Lords of the Narrow Sea, will we skip the taxation phase that turn?)

I think that the answers are:

1. Not cancelled (i.e. this card can't be used to cancel a plot)

2. put into Used Plots pile and

3. Yes.

4. Yes.

Please correct me if my understanding of the card is wrong! Thanks so much!

Let's put it this way: revealing a plot with Lords of the Narrow Sea is no different than revealing a plot at the normal time during the plot phase.

So the "old" plot goes to the used pile, the "new" plot becomes your active, revealed plot - which acts just like any other plot.

As for "canceling" the old plot, you need to be careful with that terminology. In this game, canceling something means that you stop it between when it is initiated and when it is resolved. Revealing a new plot does not "cancel" the old one - but the old one is not active anymore. So if it had an effect like "your characters get +1 STR," that is gone. It wasn't canceled, but the effect is no longer in play. On the other hand, it doesn't undo anything that plot did while it was active. If the plot said "when revealed, choose and kneel a character," you don't get to stand that character when the plot is replaced.

Perfectly explained, you make it seem so simple Ktom. Thanks!

Hi again!

Varys - Quick question, just trying to figure out the best way to use this guy... one of the ways to use Varys would be to pick a "When Revealed" plot, and then switch plots with someone who has revealed a "Continuing Effect" type card right? That way, I get a Revealed Effect and a Continuing Effect, and my opponent basically gets nothing?

Bran Stark - what happens to the old plot? I reckon its similar to Lords of the Narrow Sea, the "old" plot goes to the Used pile.

Maddux had a question upthread about Motley interacting with continuous effects. Just to make sure when a new Direwolf comes into play, Kennel Master's pump ability doesn't trigger the Motley tax right?

Thanks and happy holidays!

Varys There are a couple ways to use Varys. I would add to your suggestion that there are more than just plots with continuous effects that you might want to trade for. For example, you might want a plot that has passive trigger like "Let My Porridge Fly!" or "Snowed Under." You could also switch not for any plot effect but for higher gold or claim. For example, if you had a Bodyguard on Varys to save him, you might reveal Valar Morghulis and then switch with someone else and stick them with 0 claim for the turn.

I think from your post though that you're missing one big thing with Varys. Have you looked at the LCG FAQ on the "Support" section of the AGoT minisite ( www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/agotlcg/support/agot-lcg-faq-1-3-1.pdf )? There is a window to take player actions during the plot phase before plots are revealed. So if you're willing to let an opponent use one of your plots, you don't have to wait to see what your opponents reveal to use their plots. You can swap with an opponent and reveal a new plot card from their plot deck yourself (triggering whatever "when revealed" effects it has).

Bran "reveal" has a couple meanings within the context of the rules. With regard to plots, "reveal a plot" is shorthand for "take a plot card from your plot deck, make it your active plot, and put the previous active plot (if any) in the used plot pile. If you have exhausted your plot deck, move all plots in your used plot pile to your plot deck." (Note I'm not sure how that move back to the plot deck interacts with things like the plots from King's Landing Edition which interact with the used plot pile).

Motley One thing that is confusing to me sometimes is that the rules use the word "trigger" both for triggered abilities that you choose to trigger (things with a bold timing word and a colon like "Plot:" or "Response:") and also for passive abilities which trigger automatically (usually introduced with words like "when" or "at"). The Kennel Master's pump ability, however, is neither of these it's a constant ability which is always on so Motley does not require you to pay anything for it. Note that Motley says if the controller wishes to trigger the ability. The only abilities that you choose/wish to trigger are triggered abilities, so Motley only requires payment for abilities which begin with a bold faced word plus colon as above (and not for the passive abilities I contrasted them with above).

Thanks Schrecklich! Oh right, I remember there's a window that not too many people use before Plots are chosen. Very interesting trick with claim/gold denying as well! I've never really tried playing with Varys, but after reading some of Clash of Kings, now I'm intrigued by the character's card. Now that I think about it, plot-swapping for gold can be very useful!

Thanks for the clarification involving Bran and Kennel Master!

I have another quick question/clarification: characters can participate in any challenge as long as they are standing, right? Meaning, can I have Jaime Lannister (who doesn't kneel in military challenges) participate in a military challenge, and then Kneel him to participate in in intrigue challenge on the same turn? Also, does this mean I can have Renly Baratheon (kneel 1 influence to stand Renly) participate in all 3 types of attacks as long as I have the influence to keep standing him?

Thanks again! My playgroiup is meeting tomorrow for our 3rd session with the game, we're looking forward to it!

No problem they're good questions.

You are correct that a character can participate in a challenge as long as he is standing and eligible (eg has the appropriate icon for the challenge type). So not only can Renly (or Fiery Followers if you can win each time to stand with Vigilant) participate in all three challenge types in one turn, but someone like Jaime could participate in two consecutive military challenges if you had the After the Mummer's Ford plot which allows for an extra military challenge.

Once again, thanks Schreck! That's great to hear, and makes Jaime and Renly much more awesome.

schrecklich said:

You guys need to read Varys again. When you use his ability, you swap plot decks and used piles. You do NOT swap the plot that is currently revealed. So all of these "take his plot after he reveals it so you get the benefit instead of him" ideas don't work.

The real value of Varys is as schrecklich described: swap plot decks/used piles before plots are revealed, then reveal one of your opponent's plots (while they reveal one of yours) for the round.

Oh, that's right! I guess I was confused because for convenience's sake, I always just put my Used plots under my Unused plotsm and my Active Plot face up on top of my Plot deck (which is wrong.) Thanks for clearing this up! Still pretty cool though, at least Varys lets you play something like Valar Morghulis(sp?) or some other useful Plot if they still haven't been used.

Can I look at my opponent's Plot deck at any time?

No, you can never look at your opponent's plot deck (other than with some effect like Varys). Sorry, about getting Varys wrong above, I also think of the active plot as the top of the used plot pile.

Thanks for clearing that up. =D