Okay, I'll admit, I'm leaning toward X-WIng. I love the look, feel, and style of both Armada and X-Wing, I love the scale of Armada but it seems more expensive, I love the detail or X-Wing and the price seems more reasonable, and I'm only going to sink my money into one of them (at least at this point in time). I would like some Armada peeps to give me some more compelling arguments in behalf of Armada over X-Wing. Ready, go!

Honestly, if you favor xwing, go for it!

Both are great games and fun. If the price of xwing seems more reasonable for you, then by all means, get xwing. At the end of the day, your dollar and your gaming fun are all that matters!

But Armada looks awesome too!!! My soul is torn!

Armada is more refined, being the younger of the two games Ffg was able to use whtat they learned from x-wing to make a more polished product in armada.

Armada isn't actually more expensive then x-wing at the moment since x-wing has nearly 30 expansions so you will be playing catch up for awhile in less you make a investment of 200+ dollars right away

Budding community: since armada is a new game campared to x-wing it's community is still growing very rapidly and if you join now you can easily become a "veteran" player heck it wouldn't take much to become competitive at the world's level. Vs x-wing wear you will likely always be an underdog since there are players that have been playing for YEARS

STAR DESTROYER (enough said)

Armada is more of a thinking man's game compared to x-wing, requiring a lot more planning and strategizing for several turns ahead and relying less on luck.

It's kinda like Chess(armada) vs checkers(x-wing)

Armada is more strategic and x-wing is more "exciting"

So keep that in mind when making your desicion

I'm going to try to be impartial, since I love both (I have a lot of playtime with X-wing, 30 games of Armada)

Things you should consider:

1) Player pool: How many people play each game around you? Can you reasonably expect to get a game in when you go to your FLGS? Or at home, with friends?

2) Timer per game. Armada is a higher investment in time spent. Leaving setup time aside, you can count on spending twice as much time playing an Armada game as an X-wing game. If you want to be competitive with Armada, you will have time to try out fewer fleets in the same amount of time.

3) New game vs. old game. In X-wing, there are players that have been playing since wave1. Those players accumulated a lot of experience, and will table a newer opponent quite easily (unless they limit their play), while in Armada people haven't figured out yet what works and what not (just look at all the QQing about squadrons)

4) Investment. I honestly think it amounts to about the same, since waves for Armada will be far between compared to X-wing, and I honestly don't get a lot of multiples for Armada. X-wing comes with a "baggage" of 6 waves. With Armada I feel you can start with just the Core and 3-4 expansions to get a good fleet for a single faction, while in X-wing some lists require you to mix and match cards from a lot of expansions that you don't own yet. If you have a playing group that's willing to lend you some cards to play, then that's not a problem

5) Painting: Armada's squadrons aren't prepainted. While they work the way they are, they look far prettier when they're painted. Considering you might get two packs of squadrons, and each squadron has 3 little ships, that's a lot of painting!

Armada is more of a thinking man's game compared to x-wing, requiring a lot more planning and strategizing for several turns ahead and relying less on luck.

It's kinda like Chess(armada) vs checkers(x-wing)

Armada is more strategic and x-wing is more "exciting"

So keep that in mind when making your desicion

I would like to disagree with your statements but I don't want to get into a polemic in this thread. I will just state my arguments and let OP decide for himself, I'm assuming he knows a bit about both game systems.

Armada offers a lot more choices on a turn-by-turn basis (just imagine all the tick combinations you have on a 4-speed CR90), but I don't think that makes it more strategic/hard/thought provoking. If anything, I would say X-wing has "coarse-grained" decisions, fewer but with a larger impact on the game, vs. Armada where you have a lot of small decisions, but each with a smaller individual impact (just think about moving squadrons 5mm to the left or right)

I also don't think X-wing relies on luck more than Armada. In X-wing you have dice rolls for attack and defense, sure, but those are modified in a million different ways. In Armada, you shoot your 6 dice, and you could very well come out with all blanks, and there might be nothing you can do about it. Armada seems to have high variance on dice rolls, where you can go from 0 to 6 damage or more on 6 dice. In X-wing, you skew the dice roll towards maximum damage with dice modifications, but there's also green dice, which form a "barrier of entry" for hits. I can't compare them hit for hit, since it's apples and oranges, but I feel like variance in dice throws are quite large in Armada.

I play both. And since picking up Armada, Xwing has sat untouched on the shelf. Because Armada IS that much more fun and enjoyable to play. Do with that what you will.

X-wing Pros:

-Faster Paced- A casual X-wing game typically takes about an hour, although there's some variance (Tournament rounds are 75 minutes. Some games finish significantly early, while a minority go to time)

-Cheaper Entry- Starter set is only $40. A number of tournament worthy builds will only cost you about $100 on top of that at MSRP.

-Larger Player-base: Both because of both of the above, as well as it being older

-Simpler rules: The basic X-wing rules are more streamlined. That's less prominent at the tournament level due to interactions between upgrades and the increased demands of high level play, but for a learner, there's a lot less to think about than Armada.

-No Painting Required: I mean, you can totally paint things if you want. You just don't have to. And on the plus side, you never have to see an unpainted army (Unless somebody abandoned their project midway, and I've yet to see that).

X-wing Cons

-Less balanced: X-wing has a number of ships that have issues competing (X-wings, Rebel HWKs, a number of generic fighters), as well as a few mechanics that are problematic (Ordnance is still waiting on its most recent fix after a wave dedicated to bombers, Turrets are over-represented in the tournament metagame, although what on earth needs to be done is perhaps the most divisive topic in the X-wing forums)

-More randomness: Defense dice are legendarily Fickle, and even attack dice are more unpredictable than armada's. Also, individual rolls often have fewer dice, which increases variation. That being said, X-wing does have more dice modifiers at the moment, although access to those is not entirely equal.

Armada Pros:

-More strategic: Armada is more planning based, and the hard turn limit also encourages certain lines of thinking.

-More Balanced: FFG learned a lot from X-wing, so Wave I doesn't have any huge issues the way early x-wing waves have developed (To give you an idea, all but one of the ships in the first X-wing wave had significant design issues)

-More depth: Armada's wider array of mechanics gives the game a lot more intricacy even at the novice level.

Armada Cons

-Slower: 2 Hours is a lot more playing time

-Smaller Playerbase: Newer and less approachable than X-wing

-More expensive entry: Armada's core set is $100, and you're going to need 2-3 expansions to reach 400 points. Owning the full Armada line is cheaper than the full X-wing line, but X-wing is a lot older

-Squadrons are unpainted. I mean, you can run unpainted squadrons, and it's not as bad as unpainted models in a lot of other wargames, but still, some painting required.

Neutral: X-wing has starfighters as the centerpieces. Armada has capital ships. Which appeals more aesthetically to you?

Puck up the one that feels right to you. When I am asked why Armada over X-Wing I say it is because I love the colors cent of being in command of large ships. I see myself as an Admiral not a f9ghter pilot.

Armada is more expensive per unit then X-Wing is, but it's about the same per wave.

Wave 2 of Armada for example, will cost me $150. A typical wave of X-Wing cost about the same. With X-Wing you get more ships, but you also typically need more ships.

So yes, a ISD costs a lot more then a typical X-Wing ship, even more then the large ones. But you will most likely never really need more then 1 in the first place.

I would tell you to pick up Armada as a person that played X-wing from wave 3 forward.

Very simple reason you will get to play and experience all of the ships and waves as they come out. X-wing at this point is really about running the newest items and buying a lot of sets to get upgrade cards and to be competitive in a tournament setting, most older ships just collect dust and don't get used. (Also it's sad you never see x-wings and ties in a fight anymore which is really sad if you love the feel of the movies)

Also I find with Armada not having def dice the game is much more enjoyable and you have better control, that and the taking turns moving ships vs doing on side then the other, there is not a chance to lose everything before you get to go.

In my house we are simplifying our lives and when faced with keeping 1 mins game I picked Armada after just 1 game played it is just that good.

most older ships just collect dust and don't get used.

That is simply untrue.

In the Regionals I used Y-Wings and B-Wings. A lot of people use YT-1300's which came out in wave 2. The Tie Advanced is about to make a big splash on the meta as well, and that's another wave 1 ship.

Tie Fighters and Interceptors are still quite poplar and those are wave 1 and 2.

So no, older ships do not simply collect dust.

I play both X-Wing and Armada, and got into both at the same time (launch of Armada wave 1), which was also when I got into tabletop gaming, period. They're both excellent systems, and either is a worthy choice.

I think the cost differential is minor*, provided you're looking to run lists that are reasonably competitive in environments that are reasonably competitive. If you want to play in X-Wing tournaments (and you should, it's a great experience), you (probably) can't proxy. So if you wanted to run three A-Wings, well, that's just the starter (40) plus three blisters (45), so 85. Oh, but you really, really want autothrusters, so that's two Starvipers (40, up to 125). Also, you probably want Daredevil, so that's a TIE Interceptor (15, up to 140). Also, you really want some of the A-Wing upgrades that came with the Rebel Aces box, so actually scratch two blisters and add two copies of Aces (30 each. Down 30 for the blisters, up 60, so we're at 170).

And now you can run your reasonably competitive list of three A-Wings. For $170? Yeah, you can make a reasonably strong Armada list.

But maybe you want a cheaper competitive X-Wing list. How about a starter, four B-Wings, and a Z? Okay, now you're at $105. Or how about a starter, Falcon, and three Zs (or As)? Okay, now you're at $115.

And so on.

*your disposable income may vary.

I've played X-Wing since buying it at GenCon 3 years ago, and play with an extended group of about 30 players. X-Wing is in its prime right now, and is showing no signs of slowing down.

I love Armada. We have an extended group of 10 players or so. IMO - Armada will be made or broken after Wave 2. If the 400pt game stays as interesting, after a stable metagame for a few months, the game will thrive and continue to draw players from X-Wing.

The realistic investment difference between the two is negligible. You can buy one of everything for Armada at MSRP for ~$250. One of everything for X-Wing will cost over $500 (not counting epic). Don't let the price of the starter set goad you into thinking X-Wing is any cheaper overall.

I've played X-Wing since buying it at GenCon 3 years ago, and play with an extended group of about 30 players. X-Wing is in its prime right now, and is showing no signs of slowing down.

I love Armada. We have an extended group of 10 players or so. IMO - Armada will be made or broken after Wave 2. If the 400pt game stays as interesting, after a stable metagame for a few months, the game will thrive and continue to draw players from X-Wing.

The realistic investment difference between the two is negligible. You can buy one of everything for Armada at MSRP for ~$250. One of everything for X-Wing will cost over $500 (not counting epic). Don't let the price of the starter set goad you into thinking X-Wing is any cheaper overall.

One of everything is not a mandatory purchase by a long shot unless you really enjoy running a significantly different list every few weeks.

A lot of the people above have already made some great points that should help you be able to decide.

I also play both, and have no inclination to stop playing either.

My advice would be to get in touch with your local communities and ask them if they can do demo-games for you to help you decide. The one that embraces you the most will be the one you will want to embrace in return. In my opinion, the fun of the game comes from the people you play with. Of course, individuals will come and go, so don't base it off of just one (new) acquaintance, but get a feel for the vibe of the group.

Just to chime in on the dice issue, I'm with chilligan. It's counterintuitive, I know, but the more dice you roll, the less dice matter. Of course, if you're one of these people who feels that dice structurally hate you, then you'll want to go with the game that rolls fewer dice. However, if you don't want the game to regularly hinge on just one dice roll, then go with the game in which you roll the most dice.

I disagree that one of the games is more/less strategic than the other. Strategy is about guessing what your opponent is going to do and your opponent guessing the same about you. Both have that element to pretty much equal degree.

I would say that it feels like Armada is more tactical in that matching up strengths and weaknesses of particular units and unit types is more subtle. However, that may be because I have more than a year of X-Wing under my belt, and Armada is still pretty new, as it is to everyone.

most older ships just collect dust and don't get used.

That is simply untrue.In the Regionals I used Y-Wings and B-Wings. A lot of people use YT-1300's which came out in wave 2. The Tie Advanced is about to make a big splash on the meta as well, and that's another wave 1 ship.Tie Fighters and Interceptors are still quite poplar and those are wave 1 and 2.So no, older ships do not simply collect dust.

One other point to price for x-wing it's kind of all over the place based on your favor of play personally I settled with 3 small ships of each type and 2 larges, if your looking to play epic you can run up to 12 of smalls and 6 of larges, x-wing can be as expensive, more or less based on your favor of style. For Armada the formula I use is 3 if the ships retail under 20. 2 if they retail 20.00-40.00 and 1 if more. X-wing right now would cost a lot more to keep up with seeing there is a lot of buy if you want to try everything, armada less so. (Wave 2 for me is about 230)

Oh and whatever you play buy extra dice. The core set drive me nuts.

Not to get in a fight but that's my experience from my group. I am glad it's different for you. Tournys here most lists look the same ether bbbbz or Ig88, I would tell you to scope out the local groups and see if people are playing the meta (I hate that word) or what going on, that sometimes can make or break your enjoyment.

While I agree that the narrowing down of the types of ships being played because some options are better than others is a bit disheartening, especially when that narrowing is pretty severe.

However, I think we're going to be seeing that happen in Armada too.

That said, I do find the process of meta evolving or revolutionizing to be one that is interesting. It's a complex adaptive system, which those of us who like that sort of thing, ... well, ... like.

And, there's always the question: are you going to be the person who finds the 'answer' to the meta (local or global) that exploits the meta's Achilles heel?

Armada is more of a thinking man's game compared to x-wing, requiring a lot more planning and strategizing for several turns ahead and relying less on luck.

It's kinda like Chess(armada) vs checkers(x-wing)

Armada is more strategic and x-wing is more "exciting"

So keep that in mind when making your desicion

I think you get the idea.

Which is more expensive? Depends on your collection plan. If you say plan to collect 2 of each ship or 1 of each ship than X-wing is in Wave 7 and has many special expansions so trying to go for a full X-wing collection is more expensive than Armada as Armada doesn't have wave 2 yet.

However since you say money is a thing I am assuming you just want to get started and have enough for a standard list in a couple of factions. In that matter X-wing beats Armada by a while mile as far as price for the bar of entry into standard. For ~$100 you could easily get 2 100 point squadrons 1 Imperial and 1 Rebel. In Armada $100 gets you only the core set which is not enough for a standard Armada game. No to be fair to Armada there are many places to get the core set for only $80 (and you should) but still the extra $20 on expansions would not be enough to fill a standard list in only 1 faction. The minimum for 1 faction is at least ~$120 for a reduced priced core and a medium ship expansion.

Now for gameplay the designers for Armada has had some advantages in taking a look at X-wing and seeing how the gameplay works in that game. Shield dials and the maneuver tool was a nice touch but I don't think that it has been more refined. While the turn counter is does keep most game from taking too long and objective break the monotonous destroy all opposing forces I do think it takes away from the game play and was a bandaid fix for these large 300-400 point ships being able to recover and delay the game indefinitely. Instead of playing for time you might find players playing to turn 6 and nothing else.

As for the competitive scene since Armadas attack dice and defense tokens are more abstract than X-wing it does make it harder to figure out what the probability of a successful attack would be. However I think this detracts from the competitive scene as probability statistics can't be as easily refined in the meta game. Thus I think X-wing would be the more competitive game while Armada remains the more casual game. If you prefer a more casual game where a new ship's strength in the meta isn't determined a day after it is spoiled with jousting values and such maybe Armada is more for you.

So there it is in a nut shell

X-wing

• More Waves so more divers of a selection
• More of a competitive scene in the community
• Lower bar of entry in terms of price

Armada

• More diverse gameplay
• Easier to catch up with the product collection
• More of a casual scene in the community

Okay, I'll admit, I'm leaning toward X-WIng. I love the look, feel, and style of both Armada and X-Wing, I love the scale of Armada but it seems more expensive, I love the detail or X-Wing and the price seems more reasonable, and I'm only going to sink my money into one of them (at least at this point in time). I would like some Armada peeps to give me some more compelling arguments in behalf of Armada over X-Wing. Ready, go!

I say why limit yourself, do them both... Haha

Armada is more of a thinking man's game compared to x-wing, requiring a lot more planning and strategizing for several turns ahead and relying less on luck.

It's kinda like Chess(armada) vs checkers(x-wing)

Armada is more strategic and x-wing is more "exciting"

So keep that in mind when making your desicion

A more apt analogy would be Armada is like Chess and X-Wing is more like Poker. Armada takes a lot of calculated thought while X-Wing is a good mix of luck and bluffing. Can you read what your opponent is about to do? How hot will those Green dice be?

Don't trust Beatty. He's rebel scum.

I think the analogy holds in the sense that Armada has a sequentialism that X-Wing doesn't have to the same degree (choosing which ship to activate when, rather than this question being determined by pilot skill). Also, I'd say that bluffing holding hidden cards (movement dials vs. command dials) is more important in X-Wing than in Armada.

But as I wrote above, I don't think that X-Wing relies on luck any more than Armada does. I would say that you probably need to calculate a further time horizon in Armada than you have to do in X-Wing - as in: planning more moves ahead - which is also a feature of chess. However, I would say that one of the reasons I'm not as good at X-Wing as I wish I were is because I'm not as good at that with X-Wing as I am with Armada or Chess, so that may be the missing piece for me.

Mikael makes a great point; got to your FLGS and demo both games. They feel very different and offer different strategic opportunities.

After playing both, I have to say that I prefer Armada. The scope is huge, I like the objectives each match has, and I prefer the defense tokens to defense dice.

Try out both in person. X Wing is a lot of fun too.