Man RodianClone, way to start up the fanboy nerdrage here...

I am only going to say this one more time everybody! Ewoks, regardless if they runined the ROTJ or you love them, either way, they are not CANNIBALS!!!!! NERDRAGE POWER UP!!!!

Anything that eats humans (other than humans) are not cannibals. Eating your own species is cannibalization. If an alligator or shark, or lion, or whatever eats a human, we don't classify them to be cannibals. Some sharks are know to eat other sharks, but typically only when food is super scarce, kind of like humans... Anyway, I have never seen anywhere where Ewoks eat each other. Was it in the Ewoks cartoon?

bloopbloopbloop, back to normal size now...nerdrage power up time limit is over.

Oh, and get your own dang avatar instead of stealing mine!

The point is not whether it's 'realistic', but that it's specifically the story George wanted to tell. He wanted to tell a story of a primitive culture helping to defeat a more powerful but overconfident Empire.

I'm not discussing "realistic" here... this is, after all, a space opera where people fly ships faster than light, use the force to move objects and fight using lightsabers.

But I am discussing "believable".

And the Ewoks beating stormtroopers with sticks and stones is not only not very believable, but it also diminishes the efforts of the Rebels up until that point. Because if it was THAT easy to beat stormtroopers, then the Rebels must have been completely incompetent.

I guess we should be glad that the stone age Ewoks didn't find long-abandoned VTOL aircraft and somehow have them repaired and flying into battle like the humans in Battlefield Earth.

Hehehe

I'm not sure why the Empire didn't clear-cut the forest (via turbolasers) away from the shield generator for a few km in every direction before construction. It's not like the Empire could really hide the generator, and its not like there weren't going to be other defenses in system to deal with curious eyes.

Well, they probably did... from the shield generator.

The bunker that the rebels went into was a back door that wasn't near the generator (apparantly).

But yeah, I would have cleared out the area around the back door as well.

People who think technology wins wars haven't learned much from History.

In World War II Germany had vastly superior technology to the Allies in several areas.

We won via production not via having superior technology.

The Imperial Troops on Endor were at a disadvantage against the Native Ewoks.

Just like the Americans were at a disadvantage against the Vietcong

Just like the Russians were at a disadvantage against the Mujhideen

Just like the Americans were at a disadvantage against the Taliban

The Imperials have to bring in supplies and equipment from off planet.

The Imperials only control the area where the base is and are at a huge disadvantage the moment they go into the forest.

This does not in anyway shape or form lessen the Rebel Alliance.

I'm fairly certain if an inferior number of Ewoks attacked an Imperial Base on another planet they would get slaughtered to the teddy bear.

History is way more filled with examples of technologically advanced nations decimating primitive cultures.

The American Indians come to mind.

Or the Brittish colonialism in general.

It's interesting that every single example people have brought up (with, maby the exception of the Zulu nations one victory) has been of outnumbered rebel forces armed with largely the same level of technology, only on a much smaller scale.

You're basically describing the rebellion.

I've yet to see any examples where a culture armed with stone-age spears, axes and shortbows have bested a modern military force.

The closest would be the the battle of Isandlwana, where 20.000 zulu warriors armed largely with spears (but also muskets and rifles) attacked and overran a force of ca 1800 brittish soldiers armed with repeater rifles. However, the Zulu largely won because the brittish forces couldn't open their ammunition boxes fast enough to supply their firing lines. It's not even close to the situation we have in RotJ.

Umm the Native Americans were decimated by superior numbers, disease, the near eradication of the food they relied on and a few other things. Its a long held historical theory that if the Native Americans had not almost been killed by disease before the colonists arrived they would have massacred them like they did the Vikings hundreds of years earlier.

http://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php/2014/03/native-americans-didnt-wipe-europeans-diseases/

http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2012/05/20/american-history-myths-debunked-indians-werent-defeated-white-settlers-113869

So no it was not technology that let America win its the fact that most of thier population was already dead from disease.

Sure, but I wasn't talking about the near-eradication of the Indians here. I was talking about the battles fought between indians and the US military. (and no, Little Bighorn doesn't count because by then most of the indians fighting the US military had rifles, not bows and arrows)

I don't have a problem with the ewoks, but some people do, and I sympathize. I don't think it has anything to do with realism though, and everything to do with a bizarre tonal shift. This is supposed to be the culmination of these characters' adventures, and it devolves into pratfall-based comedy. This is a series that got really dark, and while there's a place for levity in any story, the mounting climax isn't really the place for it (especially when the comedy seems so out of step with the comedy in the rest of the series). Further, he entire trilogy has been about a group of upstarts facing down a nigh insurmountable Empire, and it kind of deflates that conflict to have them turn into the Keystone Kops. It doesn't help that the first half of the movie and Empire were so **** good. The sequences at Jabba's palace really captured the serial space adventure feel better than anything else in the trilogy, giving all the characters opportunities to shine and essentially wrapping up all the story arcs except for Luke's final showdown. I think the last half of Jedi would be at risk of treading water with or without teddy bears, but their presence just gives haters an easy target.

A very apt observation of the subject.

The fact that the Ewoks beat the empire with sticks and stones turns the Rebel movement into complete nincompoops.

Historical context is extremely important.

The Indians were essentially all dead by the time the US Military came to be.

When 90% of your population is in the grave from disease technology no longer matters.

The reason the US military lost at Little Big Horn was because it was numerically out numbered in bad terrain fighting a force with absolutely nothing to lose.

Its kinda like how Russian fought in Afghanistan from 1979-1989. The Russians began starting thier exit strategy in 1985 and Stingers weren't introduced until 1986. So honestly they weren't even really a factor in the war its a great story, but the war was winding down and almost over at that point.

Germany in World War II had

1. Better tanks by a mile even the worst tank they had was vastly superior to the Sherman in almost every category.

2. Better communication

3. Better Aircraft just no Heavy Bomber (We could have been fighting Mass produced ME 262s in 1943 or earlier)

4. Better Submarines

5. v-1 and V-2 Rockets

6. Better Ships

7. Better Firearms

The Sherman tank had 3 big advantages over German Tigers.

1. Speed

2. The ability to maneuver in European Cities

3. So easy to repair a farm boy could do it.

American Aircraft at the start of world war II was a joke. Germany's leadership issues actually were a huge advantage as the head of the Luftwaffe cut funding on the ME-262 in 1940. So it wasn't finished until 1943 when Hitler promptly wanted it turned into a bomber.

The P-51 Mustang was actually designed in 120 days and was immediately deemed junk due to its under performing engine which was eventually fixed by licensing a British Engine. Its real advantage came with drop tanks allowing it to fully escort our bombers to Germany and back again.

I just read a thread in which the Allies in WWII have been compared to Ewoks. My life is now complete.

Historical context is extremely important.

The Indians were essentially all dead by the time the US Military came to be.

When 90% of your population is in the grave from disease technology no longer matters.

The reason the US military lost at Little Big Horn was because it was numerically out numbered in bad terrain fighting a force with absolutely nothing to lose.

Its kinda like how Russian fought in Afghanistan from 1979-1989. The Russians began starting thier exit strategy in 1985 and Stingers weren't introduced until 1986. So honestly they weren't even really a factor in the war its a great story, but the war was winding down and almost over at that point.

Germany in World War II had

1. Better tanks by a mile even the worst tank they had was vastly superior to the Sherman in almost every category.

2. Better communication

3. Better Aircraft just no Heavy Bomber (We could have been fighting Mass produced ME 262s in 1943 or earlier)

4. Better Submarines

5. v-1 and V-2 Rockets

6. Better Ships

7. Better Firearms

The Sherman tank had 3 big advantages over German Tigers.

1. Speed

2. The ability to maneuver in European Cities

3. So easy to repair a farm boy could do it.

American Aircraft at the start of world war II was a joke. Germany's leadership issues actually were a huge advantage as the head of the Luftwaffe cut funding on the ME-262 in 1940. So it wasn't finished until 1943 when Hitler promptly wanted it turned into a bomber.

The P-51 Mustang was actually designed in 120 days and was immediately deemed junk due to its under performing engine which was eventually fixed by licensing a British Engine. Its real advantage came with drop tanks allowing it to fully escort our bombers to Germany and back again.

Again, no relevance at all to a discussion about a group of primitive stone-age people beating a futuristic sci-fi army using nothing but sticks and stones.

In all the examples you made, the "inferior" force had equipment that might have been a bit less advanced than the enemies, but it was still the same stuff.

The Afghans didn't beat the russians using slingshots and swords. They had machineguns and rocketlaunchers.

The Allies in WWII didn't beat the germans with longbows and spears (although there is at least one example of a longbow used in battle during WWII). They used pretty much the same equipment the germans did (firearms, tanks, aircraft and battleships)

They had roughly the same equipment.

And if the Ewoks had attacked the stormtroopers using blasters and grenades, then sure.

But they didn't.

They used flint-tipped spears and arrows.

The comparison is completely wrong.

Hell, if you want a slightly better comparison, look at the second italian-ethiopian war.

The ethiopan army was severely underequipped with almost half their force using spears and shields instead of rifles.

The italians, largely considered a woefully poor fighting force, still beat them completely.

Why?

Because they were a "modern" nation fighting against "primitives" that were armed with spears and shields.

Sticks and stones are still deadly. An arrow has more penetration than a bullet in many cases. I've seen examples of an arrow penetrating a bucket of sand while a bullet is stopped. Armor isn't 100% coverage either. There is a lot of black fabric showing on those storm troopers which, logically to me, is designed to be more energy resistant than physically resistant due to blasters being the most common weapon of the era.

People often over estimate the ability of body armor. It's designed to lessen the damage enough to be survivable, not to be an unstoppable juggernaut. Stormtroopers aren't a bunch of iron men running around, they're a bunch of guys in plastic armor that is designed for intimidation, protection from blasters and some minor physical protection.

I've also read reports of mode soldiers getting seriously injured by rocks thrown from overpasses and their armor is designed solely for physical protection.

So the highlight reel that we see of the battle at endorsement is very believable to me. What we don't see is the hundreds of ewoks getting killed because a few is tear jerking but a slaughter is horriying.

I just read a thread in which the Allies in WWII have been compared to Ewoks. My life is now complete.

You and me both.

So what if the equipment were made out of wood and rocks, what does that matter? Those Endor rocks and wood appearantly kick ass!...

But dude, these guys have advanced trap technology, even if the traps are made out of wood and rocks, and I think that is so awesome! Didn`t the ancient chinese have something like that?

Those traps are clearly not "stone age"!

And it feels a bit silly to have to come up with historical back-up(I know, I did that too..) to explain something that is based om myths, themes, symbolism and faerytales.

Star Wars copies all kinds of old stories, sci-fi comics and movies that Lucas loved and are built around that, not realism. I mean, everything seems to be taken from something else, be it classic space age stories, fantasy, samurai movies, westerns or even the bible. Noone thought David could ever beat Goliath, but there you go.

If the Ewoks had won through numbers, I would understand. But the fact is, the fuzzy idiots were about to get their heads handed to them.

When suddenly, Chewbacca! Who hijacks a scout walker and uses it to blow up another one. So now we know that a scout walker is vulnerable to attack from another scout walker. Which makes sense but we've seen little armored vehicles in action except Hoth. So now it's a thing.

But wait! There are several more scout walkers out there, and Chewbacca could find himself outnumbered and very dead, which would mean an Imperial victory.

So how do we fix this? Ewok booby traps! Which means the Imperials never patrolled the area (which we know they did), are so entirely to stupid to recognize the traps for what they are, or the Ewoks managed to lug multi-ton logs into position at the drop of a hat to ensure their attack without the Imperials noticing.

Which flavor of incompetence would you prefer?

Sticks and stones are still deadly. An arrow has more penetration than a bullet in many cases. I've seen examples of an arrow penetrating a bucket of sand while a bullet is stopped. Armor isn't 100% coverage either. There is a lot of black fabric showing on those storm troopers which, logically to me, is designed to be more energy resistant than physically resistant due to blasters being the most common weapon of the era.

People often over estimate the ability of body armor. It's designed to lessen the damage enough to be survivable, not to be an unstoppable juggernaut. Stormtroopers aren't a bunch of iron men running around, they're a bunch of guys in plastic armor that is designed for intimidation, protection from blasters and some minor physical protection.

I've also read reports of mode soldiers getting seriously injured by rocks thrown from overpasses and their armor is designed solely for physical protection.

So the highlight reel that we see of the battle at endorsement is very believable to me. What we don't see is the hundreds of ewoks getting killed because a few is tear jerking but a slaughter is horriying.

I highly doubt you've seen flint-tipped arrows fired from home-made shortbows penetrating better than a bullet.

Again, people here are comparing the Ewoks weapons to modern versions of those weapons.

We're not talking about compound bows with metal arrowheads. We're talking flint-tipped arrows fired from very small bows.

And as for the comments on armour, sure they're not meant to make them impervious to damage, but even a modern-day helmet would provide protection from a club. At least enough to make it so the soldier is not easily knocked out by hitting him on the head.

And the comment about rocks being thrown from overpasses is irrelevant since modern soldiers have chest protection (sometimes) and head protection, the rest is pretty much exposed.

Stormtroopers have a full body armour, more akin to that of a medieval knight than that of a modern soldier.

So what if the equipment were made out of wood and rocks, what does that matter? Those Endor rocks and wood appearantly kick ass!...

But dude, these guys have advanced trap technology, even if the traps are made out of wood and rocks, and I think that is so awesome! Didn`t the ancient chinese have something like that?

Those traps are clearly not "stone age"!

And it feels a bit silly to have to come up with historical back-up(I know, I did that too..) to explain something that is based om myths, themes, symbolism and faerytales.

Star Wars copies all kinds of old stories, sci-fi comics and movies that Lucas loved and are built around that, not realism. I mean, everything seems to be taken from something else, be it classic space age stories, fantasy, samurai movies, westerns or even the bible. Noone thought David could ever beat Goliath, but there you go.

It seems pointless trying to have a serious discussion with you since your explanation for anything involving the Ewoks is more or less "but it's fantasy".

And as long as you have that view, you'll never understand why people have a problem with the Ewoks.

But I'll try to explain it to you in a way that maby even you can understand.

A: The fact that the Ewoks beat the Imperial forces with such primitive weapons and tactics (no matter how "force amplified" they were in your mind) severely diminishes the efforts of the Rebels throughout these years. The Rebels have been fighting the Empire for years and constantly been the underdog, despite modern equipment and tactics. So that makes the Rebels completely incompetent if a race of primitive, small, teddybears armed with flint-tipped spears and bows could take the Empires best legions out.

B: The fact that the Ewoks look exactly like fluffy and cute teddybears is such an obvious attempt at marketing toys that it really irks some of the fans. He could just as easily have made them bigger or different, but he didn't. He made them cute little teddybears.

C: There's suspension of disbelief, and then there's Ed Wood levels of suspension of disbelief. The Ewoks beating the Imperials is on the Ed Woods level of suspension of disbelief.

Also, everything that Jon D said above.

@Oddball

The Ewoks didn`t defeat the empire, they helped out in one small, but important battle. One of the strengths of the rebels is cooperating with other species and cultures, as they did with the ewoks, therefore I don`t see them as deus ex machina or diminishing the rebels at all. But I get your point and it is a valid one, I just don`t agree that it is a problem within the context of the story. But I can absolutely see how that is a problem for some people! Thank you for answering my original question and making some good points!

The weapon tech arguement always falls flat to me, and is very irrelevant in the context as I see it. You could defeat the empire with kicks and punches and can-opener if you were smart or even just lucky.
This is a David and Goliath story enhanced by the contrasts of techenology* level, a story and a symbol about the underestimated part that appears weak and powerless, defeating the big and strong, about contrasts, about overcomming obstacles that seem impossible, like taking the ring to Mordor, defeating the evil alien overlords or killing a dragon single-handedly. And about seeing other more important strengths than power, strength and the obvious ones, like being able to befriend these trapmaking, canibalistic, idol-worshiping teddybears.

The force amplified weopons was a joke.. Too subtle?

And dude, if I had any low blows or edgy comments earlyer, I`m sorry:-/ We cool?

*I still think the traps are "high-tech", very effective and advanced though, no matter what they are made of... Did you see the Myth Busters episode?

To weigh in, the bit about the ewoks beating the stormtroopers bothers me less than how they were handled after the fact. The RotJ portrayal of ewoks as deceptively cute savages from a brutal environment who view humans as primarily 'food' got washed away by two further movies and several cartoons of cutesy teddybears and helpless, adorable critters. When I saw RotJ, I got a very Chucky the Murderdoll vibe from ewoks and I liked it. The tone afterwards shifted enough, however, that that simply got lost of overlooked, and we have to listen to people gripe about cute teddybears beating up stormtroopers. The traps and such were more a sign of the times, as well. You have primitives/underdogs beating up the high tech corporate evils in cinema during those years all over, from RotJ to Ernest goes to Camp. It's simply a theme and, given the gross differences in stormtrooper performance we see, perhaps the verbatim line "a legion of the emperor's finest" is misinformation, propaganda or a lie, and the post on a backwater moon got rotated to a bunch of rookies.

To weigh in, the bit about the ewoks beating the stormtroopers bothers me less than how they were handled after the fact. The RotJ portrayal of ewoks as deceptively cute savages from a brutal environment who view humans as primarily 'food' got washed away by two further movies and several cartoons of cutesy teddybears and helpless, adorable critters. When I saw RotJ, I got a very Chucky the Murderdoll vibe from ewoks and I liked it. The tone afterwards shifted enough, however, that that simply got lost of overlooked, and we have to listen to people gripe about cute teddybears beating up stormtroopers. The traps and such were more a sign of the times, as well. You have primitives/underdogs beating up the high tech corporate evils in cinema during those years all over, from RotJ to Ernest goes to Camp. It's simply a theme and, given the gross differences in stormtrooper performance we see, perhaps the verbatim line "a legion of the emperor's finest" is misinformation, propaganda or a lie, and the post on a backwater moon got rotated to a bunch of rookies.

I can absolutely get onboard with this! As a kid i really liked the cartoon, but I see the ewoks in that, the ewok-movies and those in RotJ as different continuities and not existing in the same interpretations of the SW universe, so in that way I am cool with it. I also agree that the ewoks in RotJ partly come off as sentient-eating canibalistic little monsters who actually are a bit creepy and scary with their strange, savage sacrafisial, idol-worshiping human-eating culture, even though there are very clear moments of cuteness! Maybe the scaryness and creepyness is even enhanced by the cuteness contrast?.. And yes, if they changed them from that to purely cute cartoon characters and sweet teddybears in the ewoks movies and said it was all canon(?) I would hate that and say it was stupid too... I would still like how they were presented(most of the time) in RotJ and I would still like to play one of the little, furry, savage predators.

@Oddball

The Ewoks didn`t defeat the empire, they helped out in one small, but important battle. One of the strengths of the rebels is cooperating with other species and cultures, as they did with the ewoks, therefore I don`t see them as deus ex machina or diminishing the rebels at all. But I get your point and it is a valid one, I just don`t agree that it is a problem within the context of the story. But I can absolutely see how that is a problem for some people! Thank you for answering my original question and making some good points!

The weapon tech arguement always falls flat to me, and is very irrelevant in the context as I see it. You could defeat the empire with kicks and punches and can-opener if you were smart or even just lucky.

This is a David and Goliath story enhanced by the contrasts of techenology* level, a story and a symbol about the underestimated part that appears weak and powerless, defeating the big and strong, about contrasts, about overcomming obstacles that seem impossible, like taking the ring to Mordor, defeating the evil alien overlords or killing a dragon single-handedly. And about seeing other more important strengths than power, strength and the obvious ones, like being able to befriend these trapmaking, canibalistic, idol-worshiping teddybears.

The force amplified weopons was a joke.. Too subtle?

And dude, if I had any low blows or edgy comments earlyer, I`m sorry:-/ We cool?

*I still think the traps are "high-tech", very effective and advanced though, no matter what they are made of... Did you see the Myth Busters episode?

Well, I guess it just boils down to some of us thinking it's pretty sh*tty storytelling.

And yes, we're cool about the comments earlier, I fired back, so we're kinda even

But I still think the Ewoks was a really crappy macguffin made up to sell toys and that's what irks me and many others.

Just like Jar-Jar irks me for the same reason.

Or the fact that he made an entire movie about the 9 year old anakin, that really didn't even have to be made.

Or oh so many other things that are wrong with the prequels, just because he's more interested in selling toys than making a good movie.

Well, I guess it just boils down to some of us thinking it's pretty sh*tty storytelling.

And yes, we're cool about the comments earlier, I fired back, so we're kinda even

But I still think the Ewoks was a really crappy macguffin made up to sell toys and that's what irks me and many others.

Just like Jar-Jar irks me for the same reason.

Or the fact that he made an entire movie about the 9 year old anakin, that really didn't even have to be made.

Or oh so many other things that are wrong with the prequels, just because he's more interested in selling toys than making a good movie.

A macguffin is some object the protagonists are searching for, pursue and want for little or no narrative explanations, not to use, not to destroy, just to get it.

I could see them as another plot device, the deus ex machina, if not for the fact that I see the rebels ability to befriend and cooperate with them as a strength and ability of the protagonists. But if you see them as deus ex machina in one form or another I can understand that and can see why it would bother you.

My own personal take on it, is not so much the Ewoks themselves but how ineffective the weapons appear to be when used. You see stones and arrows bouncing harmlessly off the stormtroopers armor, then magically they appear to collapse. The weapons themselves show no effect on the armor. Aztecs and Mayans used obsidian weaponry that would probably slice easily through armor that was designed to protect against energy weapons, however against metal it would be useless. In fact those self same weapons could behead a horse in one cut where metal weapons would barely go a few centimetres deep.

So my main problem was how the weapons were portrayed, if they had shown the weapons penetrate the armor I would have found it much more believable ( and the film would have had a higher rating).

My own personal take on it, is not so much the Ewoks themselves but how ineffective the weapons appear to be when used. You see stones and arrows bouncing harmlessly off the stormtroopers armor, then magically they appear to collapse. The weapons themselves show no effect on the armor. Aztecs and Mayans used obsidian weaponry that would probably slice easily through armor that was designed to protect against energy weapons, however against metal it would be useless. In fact those self same weapons could behead a horse in one cut where metal weapons would barely go a few centimetres deep.

So my main problem was how the weapons were portrayed, if they had shown the weapons penetrate the armor I would have found it much more believable ( and the film would have had a higher rating).

Yes, I see what you mean, I get it. On the other hand I guess that can be seen as a genre trope. You see people be hit with blasters all the time without it leaving a mark. It wouldn`t make sense in a gritty war movie or realistic and dark series on HBO, but within the genre and in Star Wars I feel it more or less can be acceptet within the genre and style.

You see a lot of arms being cut off, but that is a samurai movie genre trope. Star wars is made up of classic tropes and themes, immitating styles and is far from a realism simulator.

Seeing stormtrooper armour be crushed would be cool, but it wasn`t expected or necessary within the genre and movies at the time. We all know it is fake, we all know it`s just a story, but we have different limitations when it comes to suspension of disbelief..

There are tons of other stuff we could nitpick in Star Wars! One example is how the hell can Han Solo and the crew walk outside inside an asteroid, just wearing a breathing masks?

It just works within the universe of the stories being told! One fundamental rule of storytelling is that all stories exist within their own universe, even sitcoms and dramas, and "realism" in a story is not breaking the rules of your own universe. The rules in our own universe does not matter.

That being said, syrath has a fair point. If that takes him or her out of it, it takes him or her out of it. Suspension of disbelief is individual and varies from person to person and is often based on the kind of fiction and formats you are familiar with.

Added: What almost takes me out of it is how Luke reacts to his aunt and uncle being killed and seeing their smoking corpses and how Leia reacts to her home planet being blown up. They don`t really seem take it in or adress it very much in the movies at all and Luke seems more sad to loose the old man he had just met.

So then I have to take a step back from "realism" and see it for what kind of a story it is and what it means in the context of genre, theme and the story being told.

I always had the impression that they didn't so much defeat the stormtroopers, but two factors really contributed to that:

The defence had fought in fierce battle with a rebellion squad, something that had broken up the defensive perimentire they had established to stop them at any costs.

Thus the ewoks had plenty of time to set up traps and the garrison had gathered in one spot, making trapping fairly easy for for the ewoks considering they knew the envioment much better then the troopers. Even then, I was always under the impression that a lot more ewoks had died rather then stormtroopers. Not to mention unlike most situations the empires fleets were distracted, so basically those stormtroopers were completely isolated.

The other? Probably if it was remade today it would be more convincing. Personally I preferred revisiting the wookies home world, but I've chosen not to look too closely at the source material.

It really boils down to GM George letting his Herores be heroes. His bad guys are cannon (or sling) fodder. The GM wanted to finish up his campaign on a high note, and so he did. There really is no, nor is there, a need for another explanation. We can talk about battle tactics, power, real world stuff, whatever, all we want. But in the end, the GM guided his baddies in the direction he wanted to, to help the good guys win. I think it is something that most of who have GMed have done for our party.

I don't care about the primitive ewoks defeating stormtroopers. Maybe the Stormtroopers were just unprepared for that. Whatever...

Much as I love the cute, cuddlies, what bothers me most about that whole battle is that the ewoks had all those wonderful traps and things set up in the first place. Who were they fighting before they decided to fight the Stormtroopers that made them even have those traps? If they were fighting Imperials, then the Stormtroopers shouldn't have been surprised by their tactics in the final battle, right?

How did their traps suddenly appear near that secret entrance to the Imperial shield generator? If they'D been set up "just in case" some time before the battle, wouldn't some scouts have noticed?

I love ewoks but my suspension of disbelief isn't bruised too much by the fact that they were able to be a part of a winning battle against Stormtroopers. I can imagine reasons for this. But my suspension of disbelief takes a knock out blow by the preparation of the ewoks.I can't explain that other than by accepting that it made for more exciting scenes to be shot.

But the ewoks cute and cuddliness, right down to their voices, make me shrug and shut up about it... usually. It's like going on a roller coaster. You know you'Re in absolute safety (barring some tragedy, of course) but you still get excited and maybe a little scared and definitely a major adrenaline rush. If you look too deeply at it and get too analytical, ithe sucks the fun out so, while I'm on the ride, I'm just thinking about being on the ride.

I don't care about the primitive ewoks defeating stormtroopers. Maybe the Stormtroopers were just unprepared for that. Whatever...

Much as I love the cute, cuddlies, what bothers me most about that whole battle is that the ewoks had all those wonderful traps and things set up in the first place. Who were they fighting before they decided to fight the Stormtroopers that made them even have those traps? If they were fighting Imperials, then the Stormtroopers shouldn't have been surprised by their tactics in the final battle, right?

How did their traps suddenly appear near that secret entrance to the Imperial shield generator? If they'D been set up "just in case" some time before the battle, wouldn't some scouts have noticed?

I love ewoks but my suspension of disbelief isn't bruised too much by the fact that they were able to be a part of a winning battle against Stormtroopers. I can imagine reasons for this. But my suspension of disbelief takes a knock out blow by the preparation of the ewoks.I can't explain that other than by accepting that it made for more exciting scenes to be shot.

But the ewoks cute and cuddliness, right down to their voices, make me shrug and shut up about it... usually. It's like going on a roller coaster. You know you'Re in absolute safety (barring some tragedy, of course) but you still get excited and maybe a little scared and definitely a major adrenaline rush. If you look too deeply at it and get too analytical, ithe sucks the fun out so, while I'm on the ride, I'm just thinking about being on the ride.

They lived in a harsh forest world in a sci-fi/fantasy universe full of unknown dangers, why wouldn`t they have a rich hunter culture with traps all around their land?

They have a base of 3 in cunning you know;)

It really boils down to GM George letting his Herores be heroes. His bad guys are cannon (or sling) fodder. The GM wanted to finish up his campaign on a high note, and so he did. There really is no, nor is there, a need for another explanation. We can talk about battle tactics, power, real world stuff, whatever, all we want. But in the end, the GM guided his baddies in the direction he wanted to, to help the good guys win. I think it is something that most of who have GMed have done for our party.

I'd say it's more like GM Lucas is throwing some natives at the Imperials to save he Heroes day. Meanwhile, the players sit there and get to do almost nothing, and in the end the GM says "and you all win the fight thanks to these little furry creatures that did all the work, wasn't that exciting!?".

And the players change GM.

I don't care about the primitive ewoks defeating stormtroopers. Maybe the Stormtroopers were just unprepared for that. Whatever...

Much as I love the cute, cuddlies, what bothers me most about that whole battle is that the ewoks had all those wonderful traps and things set up in the first place. Who were they fighting before they decided to fight the Stormtroopers that made them even have those traps? If they were fighting Imperials, then the Stormtroopers shouldn't have been surprised by their tactics in the final battle, right?

How did their traps suddenly appear near that secret entrance to the Imperial shield generator? If they'D been set up "just in case" some time before the battle, wouldn't some scouts have noticed?

I love ewoks but my suspension of disbelief isn't bruised too much by the fact that they were able to be a part of a winning battle against Stormtroopers. I can imagine reasons for this. But my suspension of disbelief takes a knock out blow by the preparation of the ewoks.I can't explain that other than by accepting that it made for more exciting scenes to be shot.

But the ewoks cute and cuddliness, right down to their voices, make me shrug and shut up about it... usually. It's like going on a roller coaster. You know you'Re in absolute safety (barring some tragedy, of course) but you still get excited and maybe a little scared and definitely a major adrenaline rush. If you look too deeply at it and get too analytical, ithe sucks the fun out so, while I'm on the ride, I'm just thinking about being on the ride.

They lived in a harsh forest world in a sci-fi/fantasy universe full of unknown dangers, why wouldn`t they have a rich hunter culture with traps all around their land?

They have a base of 3 in cunning you know;)

And the scouts and patroling stormtroopers/AT-ST's were just blind, I guess... I mean the traps were soooooooooo well hidden in the movies...

And the scouts and patroling stormtroopers/AT-ST's were just blind, I guess... I mean the traps were soooooooooo well hidden in the movies...

And why would they care about those innocent teddybear culture animal traps?...

We(all of us) might be overthinking this war documentary...