NOTE: Whichever one I do not use on my Vic will go on my Gal, so choose wisely.

So, I am trying to decide whether to put EL or EA on my Victory II star destroyer. The Expanded launchers sound nice because I will be able to have 8 dice on the front arc, and the few shots I get off when I have the chance will be even more decimating. On the other hand, the side arcs feel lacking without the extra red dice on them. Which should I pick?

EDIT: I am an idiot. You guys are all right about them not being compatible with the other ship. Oops

Small thing. Be careful about your upgrade types...

Enhanced Armaments are a Turbolaser Upgrade, which is fine for either Victory class SD.

Expanded Launchers are an Ordnance upgrade, which means they are limited to a Vic-I or a Gladiator... A Vic-II has Ion Cannons instead.

That being said, I've started to experiment with EL on my Vic-I... But getting them that close is difficult at times.

What Drasnighta said.

Basically, if this is what you're thinking: the ONLY combo is Enhanced Armaments on the Vic-II and Expanded Launchers on the Glad, because neither ship can take the opposite upgrade at all.

I would say take an alternative Turbo on your Vic-II (XI7s or H9s imo), and EL on Glad with insidious title. That, or take EL on a Vic-I and Assault Concussion Missiles on your Glad.

Are they not both Modifications? So even if you had both sloe you could only have one of them?

EA is a turbo laser...glads can't use them.

EL is ordnance...Vic-2s can't use them.

NOTE: Whichever one I do not use on my Vic will go on my Gal, so choose wisely.

Well as Bitharne stated;

EA is a turbo laser...glads can't use them.

EL is ordnance...Vic-2s can't use them.

I guess the choice was already made for you.

If your running a non titled Vic II then Enhanced armaments are the way to go imo. But if your are going to run a title like Warlord, then I would take H9 Turbolasers . If you are going to run Dominator title, I would take XX-9 Turbolasers. the weight of dice you would be chucking would probably result in XX-9 coming into play for that nasty alpha-strike.

If your running a non titled Vic II then Enhanced armaments are the way to go imo. But if your are going to run a title like Warlord, then I would take H9 Turbolasers . If you are going to run Dominator title, I would take XX-9 Turbolasers. the weight of dice you would be chucking would probably result in XX-9 coming into play for that nasty alpha-strike.

Yeah, but depending on the activation cycle, and the range of the glad.. what Dominator doesn't end, the Glad can clean up or vice versa.

Yeah, but depending on the activation cycle, and the range of the glad.. what Dominator doesn't end, the Glad can clean up or vice versa.

One time a Glad had to run into aestroid to get the shot lost a black dice and rolled 2 hits and a blank. The Mon Mothma Whale made him reroll the crit and it came up hit so that helps. It then died to the Whales return fire due to a CF dial and

It had already lost a hull due to the crit and could not spend used defense tokens so the 1 accuracy later the brace was gone and the redirect was already used up, the 3 remaining red (it used Enhanced Armaments) and blue hit its side that shot at it and destroyed it. Lucky shot really bit hey no complaints here. The Whale later died to Rhymer though. . . Hate him sometimes

Yeah, but depending on the activation cycle, and the range of the glad.. what Dominator doesn't end, the Glad can clean up or vice versa.

Maybe. I have seen a set up like that fail due to a simple obstacle/obstruction.

One time a Glad had to run into aestroid to get the shot lost a black dice and rolled 2 hits and a blank. The Mon Mothma Whale made him reroll the crit and it came up hit so that helps. It then died to the Whales return fire due to a CF dial and

It had already lost a hull due to the crit and could not spend used defense tokens so the 1 accuracy later the brace was gone and the redirect was already used up, the 3 remaining red (it used Enhanced Armaments) and blue hit its side that shot at it and destroyed it. Lucky shot really bit hey no complaints here. The Whale later died to Rhymer though. . . Hate him sometimes

A perfect example of why I love this game. The bad situation was from pilot error, not dice, so better flying essentially can win you 99% of games imo. X-wing it's much lower, though better than chance.

Since the upgrade slot issue's been covered, I would just like to squawk out my opinion that putting ordnance on a VSD-1 seems incredibly optimistic (until maybe we get Wave 2 large ships and more points to shoot at). It's the least maneuverable ship in the game, bar none, and pouring on points for an upgrade that only works at close range and/or one arc seems to be begging for disappointment. GSDs are another story (esp demolisher)

if you want 8 dice out the front, I heartily recommend Dominator. It hurts you, sure, but it adds blue dice (more reliable; 150% the range of black dice) and can be used out of any arc. That's 8 out the front, 5 out the side, 4 out the butt. I love it on a VSD-2 so you can bring all your dice to bear at medium or close range.

Now EA I'm not sure of. Personally not sold because of the teeny tiny side arcs, but some have made compelling arguments for 4 dice sides essentially giving the VSD a huge arc that spits out very decent firepower. Personally, I'd rather just go FC + Hangars for an additional point and rely on squadrons to overcome the VSD's lack of maneuverability.

There's also the H9 + Warlord combo which, at the very least, will give you +1 damage as opposed to + 1 red die (hit result --> h9 into accuracy --> Warlord into "a die face with a hit icon" including the double hit side --> 1 damage becomes 2); not counting the utility have having an accuracy to stop brace tokens. This combo works on both attacks, regardless of arc, and works on squadrons for guaranteed 1 damage to everything in range. It is 6 points more expensive than EA, though, and I sadly haven't gotten to test it much

I would argue that point of Ordnance FGD with the same arguments for taking a Vic-1 over a Vic-2: area denial. Not to mention that it's nearly impossible to play a 6-turn game against a VSD-1 and NOT get shot with their black dice at least once or twice...and if you do pull it off, I feel your opponent should essentially kill you for doing so. By this I mean: if you're running away from the VSD-1 kill-zone (which you might do even more frantically against 5black dice VSDs) then the imperial player will KNOW where you WON'T be...thus he can put the rest of his force there and simply kill you with bombers/gladiators/other VSDs.

Also, I would like to point out the hyperbolic point on VSD speed/maneuverability. If you get a broadside-ing rebel ship in a fight with a Vic-1, how are you going to escape and fly away if you're not flying AWAY? If you're fleeing, how's your 2 red going to fair against his front arc VS his 3 red against your back if shots go off at all?

I'll be playing with it more, but essentially: the board is small enough that a VSD with manuever commands (even without if you play right) can't be circled around, and you either have to fire a few potshots and run, or dive hard at the ship and hope you get past it before that 3red 5black attack melts your entire ship.

All that said, at 300 points, I'd agree that Carrier-afying your VSD-1 if often a better option.

I don't think 13 points is anywhere close to reasonable for the sole purpose of area denial when the VSD-1 does it already so well naked. 6 dice is already terrifying, especially with 3 black.

The fact that your opponent doesn't want to be there can be better exploited by squadrons that the VSD will be supporting instead of missiles to emphasize "no really don't come here."

as for the VSD speed/maneuverability, it isn't hyperbolic. VSDs are, quite literally, the least maneuverable ship in the game. This is an objective statement based on the nav charts of every available ship. the VSD can make a 27.5 degree turn normally at either speed, and a 45 degree turn with a nav command; making them not terribly difficult to run from. See, a VSD-1 doesn't just have to worry about its front arc but it has worry about its front arc and being in close range. This is why I far prefer the VSD-2 if we're talking pure ship-to-ship combat, medium range makes it far more difficult to escape.

In order to escape a VSD and fly away, you don't have to be running directly from the front. You can just shoot by the sides from roughly long-medium range away. In fact, it's almost trivial with the fattie, which can circle strafe like nobody's business without sacrificing its powerful arc (its sides) and easily keeping out of close range. At medium range, 150% of the distance, things get quite a bit more difficult.

As for a Vic's 3 red, they're really not that great for the asking price. Between dodge tokens and care more dice efficient ships (such as the cr-90) the 3 reds out of a VSD aren't terribly scary on their own and it will get outperformed by larger numbers of smaller ships.

There's almost no reason apart from insane optimism to put EL on a VSD instead of a GSD, unless you really want to kill other VSDs I suppose. You'll get more and more reliable damage out of Dominator or the Warlord + h9 combo, both of which work out of any arc and at further than just close range. Hell, just having h9 or an int agent would probably get you more damage on the close range shots by negating the brace token.

or upgrade to a VSD-2 for one point less

True, and I believe I said I agree that EL isn't likely worth the price for more area denial.

However, while it is objectively true that VSDs are the slowest and more sluggish ship in the game. The actual in-game applications of that being a monumentous weakness IS hyperbole. Unless the AFMKII has a clear path to fly mostly perpendicular to the VSD and the imperial player has no way to cut off the ship (with his own, or via obstacles) then you're never going to be able to safely circle-strafe a VSD as far as I can tell.

In most of my games against rebels, Frigates tended to move along at speed 2 much of the time as well...this gives them equal speed to my VSD all out (which I often still run at speed 1) with a click more yaw. Yet, if you're driving in the general direction of each other, there seems to be enough opportunity for imperial players to force the issue and get at least close-range shot off with their VSD...and that would be an interesting argument for EL so that your 1 or 2 shots are that much stronger when they do connect.

Then again, maybe everyone I play is just that bad. /shrug

Vassal games needed!

I would never say your group is bad (I don't know em !); just that they havnt fully explored the joys of playing as cowardly rebel scum

In the immortal words of king Arthur, "RUN AWAY!!!"

I would never say your group is bad (I don't know em !); just that they havnt fully explored the joys of playing as cowardly rebel scum

In the immortal words of king Arthur, "RUN AWAY!!!"

A Space whale can easily survive a Dominator strike.it won't like it's remaining life much and may look like but hey its all good ^_~

That's one dominated fattie

That's one dominated fattie

I got to figure out how I am going to do explosions on the hull. . . Hmmmm