I really love this weapon, conceptually, and can't wait to get one for my character, but I'm a little fuzzy on one aspect of the rules, and was hoping someone here could help clarify things.

The description notes that the rifle can "chamber speciality darts that can be filled with various chemicals and toxins". An example, SmartTranq, is listed. SmartTranq has a poison effect, requiring a Resilience check as normal, which it applies on top of the rifle's strain damage. This kind of makes sense - SmartTranq is an advanced tranquiliser, so we can interpret the additional strain damage here as just another effect of SmartTranq.

However, I want to be able to use some of the other poisons, such as those on CR p172. What I want to know is this: would these poisons just deliver their listed effect, or, like SmartTranq, would they also deliver the strain damage of the rifle's profile? If they do, where is this additional strain damage coming from? Why would the poison be more effective delivered by dart that delivered, say, via food or syringe?

Hope that makes sense...kind of waffled a bit at the end there. Thanking you all in advance.

I suppose you could argue that the extra strain comes from the dart itself piercing the skin; enough to be painful and slightly debilitating, but not enough to be actually physically harmful.

I don't see any particuar reason why you shouldn't be able to fill the darts with other poisons as well. I'd rule that you could only have a single dose per dart (the darts aren't big enough to hold a double dose).

I'm inclined to agree with Krieger22. If we follow the same model as the SmartTranqs then you apply the poison in addition to the initial attack.

Reading the full description it sounds like the 77's ammo is a basic tranq dart. Specialty loads like Smartranq seem to augment the standard load, not replace it, suggesting that it's a matter of adding the additional material to the darts existing reservoir, and not replacing it.

IT would also seem that (should you want to) a GM wouldn't be out of bounds to replace the entire reservoir, which would change the weapon's profile, probably removing the initial stun damage code and replacing it with the poison effects...

Ghostofaman, this is my issue. Narratively, that makes complete sense. However, it kind of also nerfs the weapon - sure, it's still silent, still has pierce 4 and still has long range, but to require a Ranged (Heavy) skill check followed by an NPC Resilience skill check to inflict, for example, 5 wounds is really crap, especially since it can't crit. For the same money you can get a Sorosuub OK-98 Blaster Carbine, and for 200 less you can get a Blaster Rifle - both have Damage 9, Crit 3. I don't want this weapon to be as powerful as those things - it's a specialist weapon with a specific function - but this logic makes it basically useless against anything other than the most feeble minions.

EDIT: See my later comment where I realise that this isn't entirely accurate

Your average NPC has a soak of 3-4. This basically gives the model-77 a base damage of 8 or 9 (depending on the soak of your target). It also deals stun damage only, which is irrelevant for a rival or minion, but a nemesis is likely to have a lower strain threshold than wound threshold So that definitely does not make this weapon useless. This weapon also has a way sap more strain on a successful. Finally, the rifle is the complete opposite of restricted. The galaxy looks at this rifle and sees a bee bee gun. Likely they're going to laugh at you whenever the check your weapon, but you'll know just how nasty the model 77 really is. This rifle is fantastic and has always been a favorite of mine.

It sort of has "sentry neutralization" written all over it, doesn't it? You can drop those pesky guards from a distance without a sound.

Hi Kaosoe

What I meant to say (but somehow failed to say) was that using it with other poisons is not worth it, if we use the logic that Ghostofaman puts forth so eloquently above. Under these rules you would lose the base strain damage of the weapon, meaning you're rolling to hit AND rolling to poison for not much reward.

You're quite right to say that it's base stats are fine and it's a great weapon when used with its standard darts or with SmartTranq. I'm just frustrated, because the implication of it's description - that it can use "speciality darts that can be filled with various chemicals and toxins" - seems to open it up for so much more, but with RAW this isn't actually viable. And I'm one of these tiresome people who likes to use RAW where possible.

Oops. My apologies for the misunderstanding.

Perhaps you should submit a question to the developers. Around here, their answers are as good as RAW.

Hi Kaosoe

What I meant to say (but somehow failed to say) was that using it with other poisons is not worth it, if we use the logic that Ghostofaman puts forth so eloquently above. Under these rules you would lose the base strain damage of the weapon, meaning you're rolling to hit AND rolling to poison for not much reward.

You're quite right to say that it's base stats are fine and it's a great weapon when used with its standard darts or with SmartTranq. I'm just frustrated, because the implication of it's description - that it can use "speciality darts that can be filled with various chemicals and toxins" - seems to open it up for so much more, but with RAW this isn't actually viable. And I'm one of these tiresome people who likes to use RAW where possible.

Right, but lets review some poisoning items because I think you missed some logic points that can sort out your issues.

1) The standard dart comes preloaded with a basic tranq to cause the listed base damage

2) The smarttranq is in addition to the base damage. So Smart tranq is an additional poison added.

3) This implies that each dart has sufficient reservoir space to hold at least 2 doses of poison.

4) The rules for poison actually state you get enhanced results from applying multipule doses of poison.

So, going off that it appears when applying your own poison to the darts you have the option to A)Add one dose to the existing base tranquilizer. Or B) Remove the stock traq and apply a double dose of your poison.

So lets put that into practice and see what we get:

We'll assume you're at long range with a skill of 3:2, double aiming, and using a Telescopic sight on a clear day providing no setbacks. We'll load the darts with your generic core rulebook neurotoxin.

I'll use a Stormtrooper as a baseline target due to it's toughness and ubiquity.

Your to-hit check will typically give you 2+ successes and often a triumph as well.

Standard off the shelf tranq:

That will leave you with 8 Stun damage, piercing 4 armor (out of the stormtrooper 5) resulting in 7 points of strain damage, enough to remove the trooper form play. It's worth noting that while the Model 77 does not have a crit rating, that merely means I can't use Advantage to trigger a crit, the triumph is still on the table, so were this a group of stormies I would have been able to remove 2 from play.

Smart Tranq with OTS tranq:

We've already established I've inflicted 7 strain, and if I decided to crit, removed a second trooper. Resiliance check for the smart tranq: Stormies don't have Resiliance as a grouped skill, so it'll be against base Brawn score of 3: The Stormtrooper will typically succeed.

If we use the Triumph to upgrade the Stormies difficulty: The stormtrooper is marginally more likely to fail, with a slight possibility of threat.

So Smarttranq is more a fun bonus then a reliable weapon upgrade, with Critting probably being of more value in the case of rapidly removing minions.

1 dose Neurotoxin with OTS tranq:

The difficulties and results are nearly identical to OTS+Smart Tranq, the only difference being when the poison does activate it inflicts wounds instead of Strain, but that wound count is only 5, and Threat inflicts strain.

2 Doses of Neurotoxin:

Without the initial strain we just straight to the Neurotoxin check.

The increased difficulty increases the odds of the target taking damage, and noticeably increases the amount of threat typically rolled. But if you're trying to eliminate the target from play, the OTS tranq is still the most reliable option.

Final look: So taking that, if you want to remove a character form play, the OTS tranq, augmented with SmartTranq will give you the most crash for your creds. Poison is an option, but if you want to assassinate someone, even considering some of the more exotic stuff you'll find in Hutt Space, there's easier ways. The analysis was vs a minion group, but the results will translate to the odds of one-shotting a Rival or better at being very low, again suggesting if you want to kill the target you're better off with a more conventional weapon, or one more purpose built for termination.

Your logic is impeccable. I may print this out.