So last night the group I GM for was assaulting the skeleton crew of a slaver/pirate vessel (the rest were on shore leave!). This was partially improvised on my part, and I LOVE the adversary decks for this. I pulled out the Pirate Captain, Pirate Crew, and Slaver cards and ran the encounters as they happened.

Now if you are not familiar with the Slaver profile from the back of the EotE book, he has 3 weapons: a battered stun pistol, a truncheon, and a net. The nets actually seemed rather entertaining, so I used them. Both times, the Slaver hit, trapping the PC in the net. The nets have Ensnare 3, which immobilizes the PC for 3 rounds. They also have the knockdown quality.

First, knockdown isn't listed with the weapon qualities. I assume it happens automatically? I know many qualities require 2 advantage to trigger, but since it wasn't even listed I wasn't sure. Ensnare does require 2 advantage, immobilizes the character for a number of rounds equal to the rating, and allow the character to make a Hard athletics check to get out (or a Formidable check if a triumph was rolled on the attack). Now immobilize just says that the character cannot take any maneuvers. Nothing limits actions, however while playing I did not allow any actions except the actions to attempt to free themselves.

Reasonably, I assumed that while trapped in a net, a player couldn't melee attack an opponent. I could maybe see trying to shoot out of it depending on the size of the weapon, but I also didn't allow it at the time. My players didn't attempt any other actions while trapped, though that could be because I phrased it as the only thing they could do was attempt the athletics check.

Side note, trapping a 1 Brawn Drall Doctor in a net on a triumph leads to a lot of funny jokes, and a lot of strain filled attempts to break free.

First question: Did I read it right? RAW there is nothing to limit actions while in the net?

Second question: What would you allow a PC to do while trapped in the net, assuming there is nothing that limits actions per RAW?

If you were wondering, at the end of the encounter, the Pirates and Slavers had won, so I have a pretty funny adventure to write for next time.

EotE, page 156, top of the second column:it's 2 Advantage to trigger, +1 Advantage for each silhouette above 1.

As for the net, you didn't do it RAW. Immobilized (CRB218) means you can't take maneuvers, but can still do actions. Any action. No limit on them. Of course, with no maneuvers, you can't aim when you shoot, or move into cover, or push a button, or nab a stimpack from your pack, etc.

With the net, barring any target is ensnared for 3 rounds. They can wait it out or make a Hard Athletics check—unless that Triumph shows up, then it's Formidable. In either case, the ensnared target can still take any action they want. However, they are immobilized, so if they didn't have a weapon out, they can't spend a maneuver to do so (unless they have quickdraw, which makes it an incidental, not a maneuver).

-EF

GMs call but you could do some setback also, due to the entanglement.

And what about the Knockdown quality? You just need another two Advantage on the attack roll to trigger that?

Disregard, all clear.

EotE, page 156, top of the second column:it's 2 Advantage to trigger, +1 Advantage for each silhouette above 1.

As for the net, you didn't do it RAW. Immobilized (CRB218) means you can't take maneuvers, but can still do actions. Any action. No limit on them. Of course, with no maneuvers, you can't aim when you shoot, or move into cover, or push a button, or nab a stimpack from your pack, etc.

With the net, barring any target is ensnared for 3 rounds. They can wait it out or make a Hard Athletics check—unless that Triumph shows up, then it's Formidable. In either case, the ensnared target can still take any action they want. However, they are immobilized, so if they didn't have a weapon out, they can't spend a maneuver to do so (unless they have quickdraw, which makes it an incidental, not a maneuver).

-EF

I didn't ask if I followed RAW, I asked if I missed something. I know I added restrictions that I did not see in the book. I also explained how immobilized work. Just feels a bit condescending of you to write it out like that. Maybe I'm being crabby.

It appears that the person who added Knockdown to the list of qualities with descriptions forgot their alphabet that day. The list is otherwise in alphabetical order, causing me to skip over it as it is followed by 3 straight 'I' qualities, so this is why I missed it. Thank you for pointing out where it was.

EotE, page 156, top of the second column:it's 2 Advantage to trigger, +1 Advantage for each silhouette above 1.

As for the net, you didn't do it RAW. Immobilized (CRB218) means you can't take maneuvers, but can still do actions. Any action. No limit on them. Of course, with no maneuvers, you can't aim when you shoot, or move into cover, or push a button, or nab a stimpack from your pack, etc.

With the net, barring any target is ensnared for 3 rounds. They can wait it out or make a Hard Athletics check—unless that Triumph shows up, then it's Formidable. In either case, the ensnared target can still take any action they want. However, they are immobilized, so if they didn't have a weapon out, they can't spend a maneuver to do so (unless they have quickdraw, which makes it an incidental, not a maneuver).

-EF

I didn't ask if I followed RAW, I asked if I missed something. I know added restrictions that I did not see in the book. I also explained how immobilized work. Just feels a bit condescending of you to write it out like that. Maybe I'm being crabby.

It appears that the person who added Knockdown to the list of qualities with descriptions forgot their alphabet that day. The list is otherwise in alphabetical order, causing me to skip over it as it is followed by 3 straight 'I' qualities, so this is why I missed it. Thank you for pointing out where it was.

My apologies. I misunderstood what you were asking, my bad. Let me see if I can answer your questions properly.

First question: Did I read it right? RAW there is nothing to limit actions while in the net?

No limits on actions per sé, no. But feel free to throw in a setback die or two since they're all tangled up. Or flip a destiny point to upgrade their check

Second question: What would you allow a PC to do while trapped in the net, assuming there is nothing that limits actions per RAW?

The answer to this follows your first question. I'd allow any actions, but sprinkle in some setback dice for flavour, encourage them to untangle and all that.

-EF

As for the net, you didn't do it RAW. Immobilized (CRB218) means you can't take maneuvers, but can still do actions. Any action. No limit on them. Of course, with no maneuvers, you can't aim when you shoot, or move into cover, or push a button, or nab a stimpack from your pack, etc.

Oddly enough, this allows you to swing a melee weapon at an engaged opponent or to shoot with any ranged weapon in-hand, but you can't actually draw a weapon without Quick Draw, so you can't pull out a knife to cut through the net unless it's already in-hand.

Also, I'd be a little wary of allowing someone to draw a weapon just because they have the quick draw talent that makes it an incidental, doesn't really make sense, unless they use it prior to being ensnared.

Also, I'd be a little wary of allowing someone to draw a weapon just because they have the quick draw talent that makes it an incidental, doesn't really make sense, unless they use it prior to being ensnared.

Not trying to come up with a loophole around this, but the intent is, all of the encounter is happening simultaneously.

BH in group has quickdraw talent, NPC is using a net. BH and NPC roll for initiative, NPC gets the better initiative so the BH is a split second slower on drawing his weapon but will be successful due to having the quickdraw talent. Now the NPC does not throw a Triumph (but rolls enough to ensnare) on his roll so the weapon is not dropped, NPC throws a Triumph the weapon is dropped.

So yes it is possible to use the quick draw talent. Now as a GM if the player is already ensnared and the BH wants to use the talent then I will explain to him why he cannot.

If we get to tied up in the rules and forget that in a combat round (which is what the net being used be part of), we have lost sight of the intent of narrative play and that's why I stated the 2 scenarios the way I did. The first scenario speaks for itself, the second I would say no you can't and yes I know what the rules say, let's use common sense in this though please, and if said player keeps going, I will look at him/her and make a decision and explain it later to keep the game going.

EotE, page 156, top of the second column:it's 2 Advantage to trigger, +1 Advantage for each silhouette above 1.

As for the net, you didn't do it RAW. Immobilized (CRB218) means you can't take maneuvers, but can still do actions. Any action. No limit on them. Of course, with no maneuvers, you can't aim when you shoot, or move into cover, or push a button, or nab a stimpack from your pack, etc.

With the net, barring any target is ensnared for 3 rounds. They can wait it out or make a Hard Athletics check—unless that Triumph shows up, then it's Formidable. In either case, the ensnared target can still take any action they want. However, they are immobilized, so if they didn't have a weapon out, they can't spend a maneuver to do so (unless they have quickdraw, which makes it an incidental, not a maneuver).

-EF

I didn't ask if I followed RAW, I asked if I missed something. I know added restrictions that I did not see in the book. I also explained how immobilized work. Just feels a bit condescending of you to write it out like that. Maybe I'm being crabby.

It appears that the person who added Knockdown to the list of qualities with descriptions forgot their alphabet that day. The list is otherwise in alphabetical order, causing me to skip over it as it is followed by 3 straight 'I' qualities, so this is why I missed it. Thank you for pointing out where it was.

My apologies. I misunderstood what you were asking, my bad. Let me see if I can answer your questions properly.

First question: Did I read it right? RAW there is nothing to limit actions while in the net?

No limits on actions per sé, no. But feel free to throw in a setback die or two since they're all tangled up. Or flip a destiny point to upgrade their check

Second question: What would you allow a PC to do while trapped in the net, assuming there is nothing that limits actions per RAW?

The answer to this follows your first question. I'd allow any actions, but sprinkle in some setback dice for flavour, encourage them to untangle and all that.

-EF

No hard feelings. I hadn't eaten yet today at the time, so I was primed for feeling agitated.

I like the ideas for setbacks. It was definitely easy for otherwise weak NPCs to overcome 4 PCs when 2 of them were useless for 3 rounds.

unless they use it prior to being ensnared.

Preserving the cinematics of a scene, in my mind trumps mechanics, I'm away from books atm, but aren't incidentals actions you can take whenever you want?

Incidentals are maneuvers you can take that don't count against you maneuver pool.

Drawing a weapon in the middle of a fight is a maneuver, with quick draw an incidental. Example, I am fighting with my blaster and I want to throw a grenade, drawing of the grenade would be a maneuver, with quick draw it would be a incidental and not cost me a maneuver.

That is a simple way of looking at it though.

Look at it as a western gunfighter fighting another gunfighter, now this is off the top off my head as I don't remember the actual gunfighting rules all the way. Gunfighter 1 has quick draw and if he does not get first shot on initiative rolls due to how the dice tumble, he now does not suffer from any maneuvers he does, because he had to spend one to draw his weapon. So gunfighter 2 misses his opportunity and decides to move to cover, now that is 2 strain due to his first maneuver being that he drew his weapon his second maneuver is his movement, now because he fired and missed he cannot take cover. At the same moment , GF 1 has drawn his weapon with QD, used 1 maneuver to move closer, 1 for aiming suffering 2 strain in doing so and then firing. All this happens at the same time in a split second. GF 1 did not have to use a maneuver to draw though.

Cinematically both weapons clear leather at the same time, the guy with the net gun is a split second faster than the guy with quick draw and hits and is successful enough to entangle preventing the first guy from firing his weapon at that time but it is drawn.

We all are so used to taking turns in the games that we forget that that if we are rolling dice for 15 minutes that that could be mere seconds in real life. In real life, there are 5 of in a group talking and someone throws a grenade in the middle of us with a 4 second fuse, we are not going to roll initiative to see what we are doing, and what order we are doing it in, we are all going to scatter and maybe one of us will throw ourselves on the grenade.

Now with that all being said, if the NPC that used the net on a PC with improved quick draw (which gives the PC the ability to use QD twice in an encounter) and the NPC not only roles the amount of advantage to entangle the PC but a triumph as well, I would say the triumph knocks anything out of the PCs hand as he is entangled and the PC cannot use quick draw again until he untangles himself but that he can use a maneuver to draw a weapon or knife to do what he needs to do.

Side note, if a usual net gun has some traits on it, and an NPC stat has the same gear but with different traits, I would think that is intentional.

Same book, different page I think Osprey, I pretty much agree with everything you said in your latest post.

Side note, if a usual net gun has some traits on it, and an NPC stat has the same gear but with different traits, I would think that is intentional.

I'm not sure what this is in response to?

The net is an actual weapon from the CRB. The Slaver profile from the back of the CRB has a net as an available weapon. They both have the same stats and qualities.

Side note, if a usual net gun has some traits on it, and an NPC stat has the same gear but with different traits, I would think that is intentional.

I'm not sure what this is in response to?

The net is an actual weapon from the CRB. The Slaver profile from the back of the CRB has a net as an available weapon. They both have the same stats and qualities.

Ah, ok then Just a misunderstanding, although I seem to remember some profile who had not the exact weapon profile... oh well.