My first post! I got into X-Wing in May and I have been blown away but just how amazing this community is. So I’m finally taking the plunge into the forums. If this has already been answered, please let me know.

I’m wondering if Super Dash is really THAT good. My YT-2400 came in last weekend and I tried it out against a friend of mine. While I was impressed by just how good it is, I keep comparing it to a variant of Fat Han I just played in a tournament (PTL, Luke, Nien Numb, and EU) alongside Wedge (PTL, R2D2, EU). This list was fun to fly and both ships are deadly in the end-game. With Dash, I feel like I’m spending so many points and actions on boost and BR abilities instead of maximizing firepower.

What if I had a Wild Space Fringer with Outrider + Mangler Cannon for 39 points? Is Super Dash worth the extra 19 points? Or are those points better spent on keeping my YT-2400 cheap and viable as an escort ship for either a Millennium Falcon build or a list of 2 other ships (either Wedge, Jake, or Keyan for instance with another generic escort)? I’m worried I’m focused on raw numbers and doing a bit of everything which makes me a jack of all trades and a master of none.

TLDR: Is 19 points from Fringer to Dash worth the extra attack die and movement options? Or can I keep the ship cheap and either upgrade something else or squeeze in an extra ship?

Thanks for the help!

I am bias towards Dash he is one of my favorite ships to fly. I have been trying him with PTL, Mangler Cannon, Outrider, and a recon specialist to give him an edge. I also have 2 Z-95s and 1 X-wing with him. I fly them into the battle, while Dash uses the Asteroids and his ability to stay just out of their arcs and maybe pull them into the asteroid field.

If you can use Dash well in an asteroid field then the 19 points or more are very valuable. Also another thing I have realized is that when you chose where you want to fight you have the advantage. So what I do is deploy in a corner, you can always do a k-turn the first turn if you need to, but go slow to bring them over to you. Then you have lots of room to maneuver, while they have to worry about the edges of the board, making them more predictable.

All in all it depends on your flying ability with Dash.

I hope that helped.

-Arcsaber

Hi Rogue One, take a gander at this top 8 from Australia...

Canberra, Australia

July 4, 2015
Attendance: 63

Three D Six

List Juggler: http://lists.starwar...?tourney_id=530
Custom software used for event (awesome live updates): http://www.tabletopt.../event.php?id=1

• Winner:
  Dash, PTL, HLC, Kyle, Engine, Title
  Corran, VI, FCS, R2-D2
  
• 2nd place:
  Han, Pred, Luke, C3P0, Engine, Title
  3 x Bandit
  
• 3rd:
  Dash, PTL, HLC, Kyle, Engine, Title
  Corran, VI, FCS, R2-D2
  
• 4th:
  Dash, PTL, HLC, Kyle, Engine, Title
  Corran, FCS, R2-D2
  
• 5th:
  Dash, Pred, HLC, Recce Spec, Title
  Corran, VI, FCS, R2-D2, Engine
  
• 6th:
  IG88-B, Lone Wolf, Sen Jammer, Mangler, Autos, Dampeners
  IG88-C, PTL, Sen Jammer, Mangler, Autos, Dampeners
  
• 7th:
  4 x Thug, Ion, R4, Title
  
• 8th (Dropped from Top Cut):
  Lando, PTL, C3P0, Jan Ors, Title
  Wild Space Fringer, HLC, Gunner, Title
  (Yes Gunner - It was a mistake as he meant to submit Gunner on Lando and Jan Ors on WSF but got them mixed in his rush to submit his squad on time then it was too late once the tourney started to change)

always

not saying that a nice cheap fringer is worthless, in fact HLC fringers w/int agents are some of the largest pains in the ass you could ever put to the field, but they have their own part to play in lists (world's largest blocker; support for ships with post-maneuver movement...such as Dash)

combining the reliability of a re-roll + focus four red dice attack on a 360 swivel gives you some crazy offense, and Dash's ability is essential to mitigating the drawback of PTL which will completely neuter your dial and action choices on any other pilot that can't just breeze through obstacles (which you'll also need clever use of to actually outmaneuver your opponent, because otherwise they're just going to park in range 1)

Super Dash is probably the most lethal ship in the game of your opponent doesn't bring a way to deal with it.

Thanks everyone for the posts!

If you can use Dash well in an asteroid field then the 19 points or more are very valuable. Also another thing I have realized is that when you chose where you want to fight you have the advantage. So what I do is deploy in a corner, you can always do a k-turn the first turn if you need to, but go slow to bring them over to you. Then you have lots of room to maneuver, while they have to worry about the edges of the board, making them more predictable.

ArcSaber, thank you for the great set-up strategy! I really like this and can't wait to try it out!

combining the reliability of a re-roll + focus four red dice attack on a 360 swivel gives you some crazy offense, and Dash's ability is essential to mitigating the drawback of PTL which will completely neuter your dial and action choices on any other pilot that can't just breeze through obstacles (which you'll also need clever use of to actually outmaneuver your opponent, because otherwise they're just going to park in range 1)

ficklegreendice, thanks for the comment about 4 dice with TL and focus. The more I think about it, it seems like a great counter to any ship - regardless of agility.

Super Dash is probably the most lethal ship in the game of your opponent doesn't bring a way to deal with it.

Hi Rogue One, take a gander at this top 8 from Australia...

Canberra, Australia

July 4, 2015
Attendance: 63

Three D Six

List Juggler: http://lists.starwar...?tourney_id=530
Custom software used for event (awesome live updates): http://www.tabletopt.../event.php?id=1

• Winner:
  Dash, PTL, HLC, Kyle, Engine, Title
  Corran, VI, FCS, R2-D2
  
• 2nd place:
  Han, Pred, Luke, C3P0, Engine, Title
  3 x Bandit
  
• 3rd:
  Dash, PTL, HLC, Kyle, Engine, Title
  Corran, VI, FCS, R2-D2
  
• 4th:
  Dash, PTL, HLC, Kyle, Engine, Title
  Corran, FCS, R2-D2
  
• 5th:
  Dash, Pred, HLC, Recce Spec, Title
  Corran, VI, FCS, R2-D2, Engine
  
• 6th:
  IG88-B, Lone Wolf, Sen Jammer, Mangler, Autos, Dampeners
  IG88-C, PTL, Sen Jammer, Mangler, Autos, Dampeners
  
• 7th:
  4 x Thug, Ion, R4, Title
  
• 8th (Dropped from Top Cut):
  Lando, PTL, C3P0, Jan Ors, Title
  Wild Space Fringer, HLC, Gunner, Title
  (Yes Gunner - It was a mistake as he meant to submit Gunner on Lando and Jan Ors on WSF but got them mixed in his rush to submit his squad on time then it was too late once the tourney started to change)

Shirako and The_Brown_Bomber, thank you for pointing out how potent and widespread Dash is. That settles it. I'm going to try out Super Dash at a store tournament tomorrow. I'm looking at Dash with PTL, HLC, Outrider, Kyle, and EU for 58 points. Unfortunately I don't have an E-wing yet but I do like B-wings.

Option 1:

Ten Numb with VI, Mangler, FCS, Bwing Mod + Lando for 42 points.

Option 2:

Keyan with FCS, HLC, and SoT for 40 points

Option 3:

Nera with FCS, Ion Torp, Advanced Torp, Lone Wolf for 41 points (more of a suicide alpha strike to soften up whatever my opponent brings so Dash can finish the rest mid and end game)

Option 4:

Wedge with R2-F3, Proton Torp, Stealth Device, PTL for 42 points (he'd have 4 agility to start but that could disappear instantly so this may be better):

or

Wedge with R2-D2, Lone Wolf, EU for 39 points.

Any help would be really appreciated!

-RogueOne

Of those take option 2 but with advance sensors instead of the FCS

Yo RogueOne! (love the name by the way)

Everyone pretty much hit the nail on the head answering your question but I figured I'd through in my two cents anyway.

While I enjoy super Dash as much as the next guy, I was also trying to find a way to make a cheap Fringer substitute.

While I eventually came to the conclusion that super Dash is ultimately worth the points I did have some success with a build that looked like this

"Not-Dash" 99 pts

Wild Space Fringer with Outrider and Heavy Laser Cannon- 42 pts

Roark Garnet with Moldy Crow, Recon Specialist, and Blaster Turret- 29 pts

"Dutch" Vander with Ion Cannon- 28 pts

Lots of turrets here but the Roark buff on the Fringer still made him shoot first and that proved fairly lethal against the mini tie swarm and decimator I flew this against.

problem with HLC outrider fringer is that he's very easy to doughnut hole

now, if you're crazy enough to outrider autoblaster (esp w/int agent) that's another story...

problem with HLC outrider fringer is that he's very easy to doughnut hole

now, if you're crazy enough to outrider autoblaster (esp w/int agent) that's another story...

Superdash with APL and Autoblaster instead of Engine, Good ole' bowling ball

Of those take option 2 but with advance sensors instead of the FCS

Good suggestion. I may pick up an E-wing before the tournament since I need that card badly anyway (I don't have it yet). Thanks!

Yo RogueOne! (love the name by the way)

Everyone pretty much hit the nail on the head answering your question but I figured I'd through in my two cents anyway.

While I enjoy super Dash as much as the next guy, I was also trying to find a way to make a cheap Fringer substitute.

While I eventually came to the conclusion that super Dash is ultimately worth the points I did have some success with a build that looked like this

"Not-Dash" 99 pts

Wild Space Fringer with Outrider and Heavy Laser Cannon- 42 pts

Roark Garnet with Moldy Crow, Recon Specialist, and Blaster Turret- 29 pts

"Dutch" Vander with Ion Cannon- 28 pts

Lots of turrets here but the Roark buff on the Fringer still made him shoot first and that proved fairly lethal against the mini tie swarm and decimator I flew this against.

Thanks for the idea! I hope to try it out soon once I have those ships.

problem with HLC outrider fringer is that he's very easy to doughnut hole

now, if you're crazy enough to outrider autoblaster (esp w/int agent) that's another story...

Superdash with APL and Autoblaster instead of Engine, Good ole' bowling ball

This! I'll try the "bowling ball" in my next friendly

Thanks everyone!

-RogueOne

Dash is a wrecking ball of action economy and pain, but definitely has counterplay with his donut and low agility (2 dice is not all that many in reality). He's good but you need to not let him get shot too much or he will leave a very sad wingman.

Option 1:

Ten Numb with VI, Mangler, FCS, Bwing Mod + Lando for 42 points.

I like it. Gives you a way to potentially deal with pesky arc-dodgers (Soontir, Whisper) that like to live in Dash's donut hole.

Option 2:

Keyan with FCS, HLC, and SoT for 40 points

With your 2 extra points, B-Wing/E2 + Intelligence Agent can help with SoT against higher-PS targets.

Option 3:

Nera with FCS, Ion Torp, Advanced Torp, Lone Wolf for 41 points (more of a suicide alpha strike to soften up whatever my opponent brings so Dash can finish the rest mid and end game)

This one I really don't like. That's a cannon made of the most fragile glass.

Option 4:

Wedge with R2-D2, Lone Wolf, EU for 39 points.

This one's not bad, but if you have to use him to cover the donut hole LW might not be 'on' very often. With 3 points left you can give Wedge a Flechette Torpedo which can be useful, or Dash a Proton Rocket to give you something you can fire in part of the donut hole and more importantly protect against Munitions Failure crits.

Option 1:

Ten Numb with VI, Mangler, FCS, Bwing Mod + Lando for 42 points.

I like it. Gives you a way to potentially deal with pesky arc-dodgers (Soontir, Whisper) that like to live in Dash's donut hole.

Option 4:

Wedge with R2-D2, Lone Wolf, EU for 39 points.

This one's not bad, but if you have to use him to cover the donut hole LW might not be 'on' very often. With 3 points left you can give Wedge a Flechette Torpedo which can be useful, or Dash a Proton Rocket to give you something you can fire in part of the donut hole and more importantly protect against Munitions Failure crits.

Thanks for the advice! You're right about Wedge - I'd be forcibly flying him solo with LW. Maybe Pred would be better, but now I'm losing the point I need to add a Procket Dash (which I really like btw).

I'm going to run with Ten Numb this afternoon and see how it goes. Hopefully I can keep him trailing behind Dash and keep the Donut Hole clear.

Thanks again!

-RogueOne

Dash is a wrecking ball of action economy and pain, but definitely has counterplay with his donut and low agility (2 dice is not all that many in reality). He's good but you need to not let him get shot too much or he will leave a very sad wingman.

You cannot counter play him unless you have PS 7+ pilots. The doughnut hole is absolutely meaningless if you cannot outbid him in PS.

2 agility when it's always at range 3 ends up nullifying a lot of damage.

You cannot play normal ships any more, only dumb nuanceless 2 ship super builds.

I personally like Jan with pred, blaster, recon, moldy, and engine.

She can often keep up, makes Dash's shot much more efficient (you'll one shot z95s and Tie Fighters more often than leaving them at 1 hp), and a 360 degree turret with predator and focus can deal quite a bit of damage to people trying to get into the donut hole.

Key thing for Dash: unless against Aggressors, stay at range 3 as much as possible. Failing that, arc dodge.

Imo HLC < Mangler

I like Dash as a blocker, specially against Soontir and other Corran builds. Crits will help against Decimators more than one extra hit most of the times.

It also leaves 3 points to spend on Corran who can get EU and make sure the double tap is at R1. The list:

Corran Horn — E-Wing 35

Veteran Instincts 1

Fire-Control System 2

R5-P9 3

Engine Upgrade 4

Ship Total: 45

Dash Rendar — YT-2400 36

Push the Limit 3

"Mangler" Cannon 4

Kyle Katarn 3

Engine Upgrade 4

Outrider 5

Ship Total: 55

I like that Ten Numb but Lando seems wasted. tactician?

I like that Ten Numb but Lando seems wasted. tactician?

I went with Lando because I don't have tactician yet. Lando was fun. I really only needed Lando for defense and you're reliably getting at least one focus or evade. In a friendly - highly recommended because you don't know what you're getting and the anticipation is great.

I ended up playing two friendlies vs a Decimator build with three tie fighters. Ten numb's ability was only utilized once, but that was based on the build I was up against. I need to try it out a few more times, but 2-3 jousters would probably be more effective against most builds.

-RogueOne

Dash with Autoblaster is deadly. Put EU on him and try to out fly him if he wants to stay range 1

Just my two cents.

Any tips how to fly Dash against an enemy with high PS ships (like Soontir and Howlrunner)?

Any tips how to fly Dash against an enemy with high PS ships (like Soontir and Howlrunner)?

When I've flown Dash in the past I didn't use PTL so I had his whole dial to work with. Go long and go through things and make them chase you. If Soontir doesn't predict what move Dash has set then he's going to have a hell of a time staying in the donut hole, especially if there are some obstacles nearby that he needs to worry about. Don't be afraid to park in debris (and you picked the three largest debris fields, right?) if he's on your tail. If you don't have a shot because he's in range one anyways, it's just an extra green die for you this round and it should really limit his options the next.

The trick to ptl dash is abuse the **** out of his ability

Put rocks/debris between him and soonts, roll to set up approaches, don't ptl if you need your entire dial; plan ahead

Dash is not easy to fly; he's an intensive and rewarding mental exercise

But I don't use engine (3 As baby!) So maybe I'm just nuts